CWSOX45 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I was reading an article in the Daily Herald this morning about how Graffanino will start at shortstop from now on against left handers. I really don't have a problem with it, but we really need Jose in our line-up everyday. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That isn't all bad. Jose really hits awful righthanded. Plus we need to keep those bench guys fresh. I hope they don't let Daubach and Rios rot on the bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I have no problem with that move. Graf needs to get some time in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris B Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That is a smart move, Graffy gives us better defense and he is willing to do things other players wont do to help the team win. I would not be surprised one bit if Tony plays well enough to be the every day SS, hopefully his knee can handle it. I have never been on the Jose Valentin bandwagon like other Sox fans and media. He is a horrible defensive player and his bat is very inconsistent. However he does bring it everyday and hustles everytime out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I was reading an article in the Daily Herald this morning about how Graffanino will start at shortstop from now on against left handers. I really don't have a problem with it, but we really need Jose in our line-up everyday. CWSOX45 Disagree, that is a great idea. Jose simply cannot hit left handed pitching while Graffanino is very solid offensively against lefties and very solid all together as long as he isn't starting. If he's starting, then he tires and his numbers just drop. This is a great move by Manuel. Is he going to hit in the two hole these days or will Rowand move to the 2 hole on these days? I'm also assuming we will see Daubach get quite a few at bats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That is a smart move, Graffy gives us better defense and he is willing to do things other players wont do to help the team win. I would not be surprised one bit if Tony plays well enough to be the every day SS, hopefully his knee can handle it. I have never been on the Jose Valentin bandwagon like other Sox fans and media. He is a horrible defensive player and his bat is very inconsistent. However he does bring it everyday and hustles everytime out. I utter your sentiments exactly. I think Jose gets overhyped and is inconsistent, but I give him credit for always hustling, etc. Defensively he's inconsistent (One day awesome, next day, uggh). Offensively he goes through huge up and down periods and if he could just stop chasing stuff in the dirt, he'd be alright. In general, I would love having a new shortstop that could field better and would be a more prototypical 2 hitter, but I'll live with Jose as long as he isn't approaching 30 errors. If he has more then that, I'll be sick. Of course if were winning, it will be a semi antacid. Its just in the world series, it gets tough to score runs, so you need every great play possible. The team that plays worse defense, typically loses come playoff time. Especially in the close games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 be careful Chris B and Jason, the St JosE6 contingent will be after you now too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 be careful Chris B and Jason, the St JosE6 contingent will be after you now too! CW, I'm used to it. Afterall I ripped Jose for pretty much two straight years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 be careful Chris B and Jason, the St JosE6 contingent will be after you now too! CW, I'm used to it. Afterall I ripped Jose for pretty much two straight years. So what do you think of the leadership side of Valentin? Supposedly he is the key guy for the quickly growing hispanic part of our clubhouse. What is that worth to the team, espesially after all of the clubhouse fiasco's we have had over the past 5 years or so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 be careful Chris B and Jason, the St JosE6 contingent will be after you now too! CW, I'm used to it. Afterall I ripped Jose for pretty much two straight years. Jason, that is just another reason I think you have a brilliant baseball mind! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 So what do you think of the leadership side of Valentin? Supposedly he is the key guy for the quickly growing hispanic part of our clubhouse. What is that worth to the team, espesially after all of the clubhouse fiasco's we have had over the past 5 years or so? I have no idea what are all of the fiascos that you refer to. Not sure that we have certain ethnic parts of the clubhouse either but if he gives help to those for whom English is not their native tongue, that is great, if they need it. Jose can be an emotional leader of the team and he has never dated any of Frank's former wives or girlfriends (to my knolwedge). I also think he talks to the press too much about other team mates and makes way too many errors. I also think his home run at Wrigley was great when he mocked (or whatever one wishes to term it) Sosa. Jose is a complicated person as are all players. I hope he has the year hitting wise that he is capable of and gives us some emotional lifts and trims the error count to 20 max. And I will cheer for him as long as long as he is with us - I like the guy but his supporters just lay it on way too thick sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I have no idea what are all of the fiascos that you refer to. Not sure that we have certain ethnic parts of the clubhouse either but if he gives help to those for whom English is not their native tongue, that is great, if they need it. Mostly problems related to Frank Thomas, but guys like Albert Belle, Jaime Navarro, David Wells, and Royce Clayton had polarizing effects on the clubhouse. I think a guy like Jose gives a level of comfort to someone who has English as his second language. He seems to be able to bridge the gap between those who are English speakers and those who are Spanish speakers. And I think that is an often overlooked factor in why some players have a harder time making it in the majors and fitting into a clubhouse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Belle: asshole. Navarro: asshole. D. Wells: asshole. Clayton: asshole as far as most everyone is concerned so: asshole. They are gone. I don't see Frank as any club house trouble any more any other highly competitve player. As far as I can tell, we have no assholes on this team. Just as we didn't in 2000. Now if the Tigers will just pick a fight with the Sox this weekend, the rock and roll may just flow all season! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Belle: asshole. Navarro: asshole. D. Wells: asshole. Clayton: asshole as far as most everyone is concerned so: asshole. They are gone. I don't see Frank as any club house trouble any more any other highly competitve player. As far as I can tell, we have no assholes on this team. Just as we didn't in 2000. Now if the Tigers will just pick a fight with the Sox this weekend, the rock and roll may just flow all season! I absolutely agree they were all assholes, but they all were problems in the clubhouse also... As for Frank he just has a tendancy to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Why is that? I have no idea. And as for a brawl with the Tigers... Where is Jeff Weaver when you need him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Belle: asshole. Navarro: asshole. D. Wells: asshole. Clayton: asshole as far as most everyone is concerned so: asshole. They are gone. I don't see Frank as any club house trouble any more any other highly competitve player. As far as I can tell, we have no assholes on this team. Just as we didn't in 2000. Now if the Tigers will just pick a fight with the Sox this weekend, the rock and roll may just flow all season! I absolutely agree they were all assholes, but they all were problems in the clubhouse also... As for Frank he just has a tendancy to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Why is that? I have no idea. And as for a brawl with the Tigers... Where is Jeff Weaver when you need him? I agree with all on the list except for Albert. Robin was his best friend on the team until he moved on to NY. And Albert did a s*** load for Sox cherities. Yep, he had issues outside the clubhouse (cough, cough... ) but his thermostat busting issues were in Cleveland and Baltimore. No collateral damage in Chicago that I'm aware of.. he was just quiet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 bell got a bad rap. in reality, he went out, handled his business and worked just as hard as any other player. he was just quiet and not a media person. honestly, I would rather a player be straight foward and honest rather than be a complete phony. Navarro was an ass, he came in to do a job, didn't do it, and then blamed everyone else. Clayton may have an been ignorant, but he did what he was brought in to do. Wells was a dick. I just hate it how he didn't take any s*** from us or anyone concerning the whole weight situation, but he goes to new york and is on his knees with Steinbrenner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I will accept Steff's and Molto's interpretations. I did stay away from the park more than was seemly during the Bevington era but I just couldn't stand Bevington at all. I am the proud owner of an Albert Belle #8 shirt that the Hall of Fame store was selling for $5 to get rid of them. I wish I had bought a bunch. It is a great shirt to sleep in and one that I will never wear to the park, and good comfy Sox gear that I dedicate only to sleeping is hard to come by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Wells was a dick. Please do not insult my favorite body part this way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That is a smart move, Graffy gives us better defense and he is willing to do things other players wont do to help the team win. I would not be surprised one bit if Tony plays well enough to be the every day SS, hopefully his knee can handle it. I have never been on the Jose Valentin bandwagon like other Sox fans and media. He is a horrible defensive player and his bat is very inconsistent. However he does bring it everyday and hustles everytime out. Graffy is not even close to what Jose is defensively. Graffy makes all the routine plays....Jose does not. Graffy has very little range....Jose has very, very good range. Graffy has a soft, accurate throw....Jose has a fast, inaccurate throw. There is a big difference defensively. I'm not shocked by the move though....because as some guys have said, you gotta get the bench players in....and Jose doesn't hit lefties very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan420 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 lets just get tejada and fix our little ss problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris B Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That is a smart move, Graffy gives us better defense and he is willing to do things other players wont do to help the team win. I would not be surprised one bit if Tony plays well enough to be the every day SS, hopefully his knee can handle it. I have never been on the Jose Valentin bandwagon like other Sox fans and media. He is a horrible defensive player and his bat is very inconsistent. However he does bring it everyday and hustles everytime out. Graffy is not even close to what Jose is defensively. Graffy makes all the routine plays....Jose does not. Graffy has very little range....Jose has very, very good range. Graffy has a soft, accurate throw....Jose has a fast, inaccurate throw. There is a big difference defensively. I'm not shocked by the move though....because as some guys have said, you gotta get the bench players in....and Jose doesn't hit lefties very well. Your right there is a big difference defensively Graffy is much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 lets just get tejada and fix our little ss problem I wonder what odds are better, the 750,000 to 1 on the Royals winning the World Series or JR openning his wallet and signing Tejada? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That is a smart move, Graffy gives us better defense and he is willing to do things other players wont do to help the team win. I would not be surprised one bit if Tony plays well enough to be the every day SS, hopefully his knee can handle it. I have never been on the Jose Valentin bandwagon like other Sox fans and media. He is a horrible defensive player and his bat is very inconsistent. However he does bring it everyday and hustles everytime out. Graffy is not even close to what Jose is defensively. Graffy makes all the routine plays....Jose does not. Graffy has very little range....Jose has very, very good range. Graffy has a soft, accurate throw....Jose has a fast, inaccurate throw. There is a big difference defensively. I'm not shocked by the move though....because as some guys have said, you gotta get the bench players in....and Jose doesn't hit lefties very well. Your right there is a big difference defensively Graffy is much better. Somebody better make sure Graffy has undergone remedial training in "When a 'Force' Play is in Effect for SS." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted April 1, 2003 Author Share Posted April 1, 2003 Look people, I never said it was a bad idea. I may have said that I think Jose needs to be in there a lot, that's just my opinion. I actually think it's good that Jerry is using his bench, I like having Tony G. in there, he gives it 100% all the time, I was just saying that more tinkering could be coming for Jerry Manuel, plus I'm bored since there's nothing to talk about around here since the Sox don't play til tomorrow.... Can't wait for the Sox to light up Affeldt CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I was just saying that more tinkering could be coming for Jerry Manuel Could be ? I think it's guaranteed..... probably sooner than we think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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