poppysox

You smooth talker. I agree as usual.

Still a young pup. Lot's of WS championships in your future.

Yep...those people hoping for one side or the other to win are going to be disappointed. No one is going to win this. At the very best the season looks like it will be delayed and maybe result in games missed. I would say the young players playing for the league minimum and the low-level FA's will be the losers. The well-established players along with the owners will go forward with perhaps a little less money in their pockets. Once again many fans will be turned off by what they perceive to be rich people fighting over money.

What a great idea. This should settle the work stoppage for sure. Just make all players independent contractors and pay all players what they were worth each and every season. If I am an owner I jump on that.

No problem. I was really trying to make the point that when some posters try to make 17 points in one post it is hard if not impossible to respond with any degree of clarity. I frequently find myself in agreement with some points the poster is making but can end up debating some points I don't even care about.

I didn't underline or bold anything. It was there when I responded to it.

I would be curious to know what "one" issue those of you who support the players feel is a must-win.

TLTR

There are industries like airlines where people work all over the world and have a different person they report to every week. You are just a number and a bargaining unit is necessary to offer some degree of representation. The vast number of us work in environments where our own contributions can be evaluated by bosses who have supervised our efforts for many years in some cases. If you want to be treated as just another person who performs such and such type of work...by all means...join the union. As most of you know, many businesses today allow you to join a union or not. Pressure is applied to the employee by union reps but ultimately the employee decides what he is comfortable with. Baseball has vast numbers of rules brought about by the players union fighting for things such as arbitration and free agency and I would admit that those advances came about by negotiating together as a group and fighting together for those improvements. Almost all of us have the benefits we have for some hard-fought battles between unions and employers. Most employers today pay the going wage for the type of work required...along with benefits, etc. in order to attract the caliber of employee they want. In many but not all situations...unions have largely outlived their usefulness IMO. Now...back to baseball.

This would take a very long time to discuss and be inappropriate to get into a baseball site. We will be getting plenty of politics later in the year.

I have worked in both union and non-union environments. I negotiated contracts on behalf of employers for 30+ years and have a wife who was required to belong to the union of her employer, a major airline for 25 years. I might not know everything there is to know about this subject...but I know a fair amount.

The players clearly expect the owners to cave. Not happening.

Lighten up...you will be a lot happier.

Your bias is keeping you from seeing reality in this case. There is no little guy or a nice guy trying to earn a living for his family in this case. Robin Hood would not be in the least interest in getting involved in this clash of the wealthy IMO. I can assure you that not all employees feel underappreciated or under-compensated. Actually, most employees are doing just fine for themselves without a union. A union is most helpful to the underperforming employee and helps him get the wage of the best employees IMO. I am admittedly biased in favor of starting the season on time.

Do you ever side with management in a labor dispute?

You just keep reading them...it will all become clear after you get over the nitpick bs.

Reread my posts. Don't try to put words in my mouth.

Yep...it's a balancing act of charging what the market will bear and breaking the camel's back.

Additionally, any gains made by players will be paid for by fans. Business plans don't generally call for making fewer profits.

I really don't understand why everyone wants to play the blame game. Unions and businesses have these negotiation issues all the time. The players and owners make a ton of money and neither side has any right to be upset with their respective situations IMO. If they insist on killing the golden goose...that's on them.

When Landis was asked to be commissioner after the Black Sox scandal...he insisted on complete control of everything baseball. His intent was to instill trust in baseball and used as his governing standard "best interest of baseball." Pete Rose is banned largely because of the standards set by Judge Landis. The commissioner's office still oversees the hiring of umps, negotiates contracts, and oversees everything baseball connected. The commissioner has always been paid by the owners but is expected to adhere to "best interest of baseball" standards is my understanding. Ideally, the commissioner would work to get both sides talking and act as something of an arbitrator in these matters. I understand that there is a difference between theory and reality.

I thought the commissioner worked in the best interest of baseball. He should be the guy who gets both sides to the table.

I think both sides deserve credit for this and certainly not just JR. What does the commissioner do to earn his money?

I quit the Blackhawks cold turkey when they let Bobby Hull leave. I have never watched another game.

Yep...JR knows what he's doing.