fathom

QUOTE(ptatc @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 10:13 PM) i agree. I'm just saying that they aren't alone in thinking this. And I'm sure things like Cooper getting exposure on the radio with a regular spot (with 670 last year if I remember right) doesn't diminish that ego at all. Don't get us started on the arrogance and ignorance that was displayed during those interviews.

QUOTE(ptatc @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 10:06 PM) That can be said for about 100% of the managers/coaches in the league. In all sports for that matter but moreso in baseball. I've done it myself after biomechanical analysis of a pitcher after a lab session. That's why players with "potential" bounce from team to team because everyone knows they can fix them. I think your example of MB is premature. He has had only one bad year. Cotts on the other hand has a history of control problems they ironed out for a year. I think they got what they could for him and I'll bet there was some differences between Cooper/Staff and Cotts on either how or what to throw. that may explain the reason to dump him. My statement is more in reference to the infamous "Don't worry, Coop will fix him" clan that existed prior to last season. Cooper is a good pitching coach...but he's not a magician.

QUOTE(ZoomSlowik @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 08:44 PM) I would still take B-Mac. Hill is going to be 27 by opening day and hasn't shown any more than B-Mac has yet. Give me the guy that is more than 3 years younger. MLB execs have a short memory, and they saw how great Hill pitched in the 2nd half last season. Also, he has the great K/9 inning ratio going which is one of those golden stats that always raises a prospect's prestige.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2006 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 09:17 PM) He'd be their #2 starter if the season started today. Um, no. Rich Hill is much better than Cotts, and I'd rather have a guy like Sean Marshall over him. QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 09:33 PM) Cotts and Buerhle were equally as bad last year. I think Cotts had a mechanical flaw making him very hittable. If Cooper is such a magician, why not keep Cotts? Aardsma's claim to fame is he is now the first player listed in the Baseball Encyclopedia. Cotts was bad in 2006, but I think he'll rebound, although maybe not as a starter. I think the Sox would have been better off holding on to him and deal him after he had a nice 2007 season. I believe that KW and Cooper are arrogant, and they believe they can turn any pitcher around. The problem is that while they do have some magic (Thornton, Contreras, etc), we also have seen some pitchers regress and no solution was in sight (Cotts, Buehrle, etc).

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 08:25 PM) lol, there's no way. BTW Rowand, you know I'm a big McCarthy fan. I was one of the many on this site all season whining that he should have been in the rotation.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 08:25 PM) lol, there's no way. I'm just saying what I heard....Hill's finish last year has raised his stock a ton again. I think it's safe to say that 2007 is a huge year for both of them though. If I had to choose one of them to be on my team, I'm not sure who I would take.

According to my source, this Vasquez guy isn't a prospect at all.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:21 PM) Williams hasn't liked playing the FA game since he has been here. That IMO was one of the major reasons the Vazquez deal was made last year. I don't blame Williams for that at all. I agree, but our system is getting rather thin now due to all the trades. I just hope he doesn't panic and spend money on guys like Dotel or Hawkins, who won't really improve our team at all. Personally, I think our outfield is a much bigger concern than our relief pitching.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:14 PM) If people want to say Cotts has no stuff and just a sneaky fastball with a deceiving motion, what do they have to say about Logan? I saw him late in the year here in Louisville in AAA action and he wasn't impressive at all. He's the prototype of a guy with no stuff and a funky motion. Logan's offspeed stuff is twice as good as Neal's was. I think that Logan can be much more effective vs LHP than Cotts was.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:13 PM) But keeping Cotts was the way to do that?? No, not at all. I was one of the first on this site during the season last year that said he would be gone. I just thought that we'd use him as a bigger piece of a trade, and I thought we'd be more active in the FA market than it seems we are.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:12 PM) Hey, Mr. "Carlos Pena will be our starting 1B-man next season" -- I don't want to see any predictions out of you. That was a psychic vision, not an actual prediction. I did have to laugh when he hit the walkoff against us last year though.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:10 PM) Oh yeah -- what does this mean for the Sox bullpen? It could be one of... a.) Haeger doesn't have a lock on that sixth bullpen spot like everybody thinks. b.) The Sox will give their "David Riske" roll to someone within the organization, such as Oneli Perez or Aardsma. Meaning the Sox won't be going after Speier. c.) The Sox go to to a seven man bullpen even though they haven't done this the past two years (I hate this option). I thought the goal this offseason was for the Sox to make their relief core dominant. At this time, I don't see the possibility for drastic upgrades from last year.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:09 PM) What I find troubling is that we give up on a young guy after one bad season. You might as well copy this statement....you'll be saying it again shortly.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:08 PM) It's going to be tough for Cotts to duplicate his 2005 success without a second pitch. Even in his dominance during 2005, that was all with his "sneaky" fastball. He located well and got hitters to chase sometimes, but as I said, it'll be tough for him to dominate with a 91 MPH fastball, funky delivery or not. A high fastball pitcher allowing only one homer all season is one of the biggest fluke statistics I've ever seen in baseball. A name I haven't heard mentioned as a possible lefty reliever is Ron Villone, who I read earlier was a FA.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:05 PM) Agree, it's way too early in the off-season for a move like this. Bottom line is they sold low on Cotts for some reason, possibly he wanted to be a starter or possibly something else that no one knows about. I don't buy this starter idea at all. Simply put, he fell out of favor with the Sox with the way he pitched the last half of the season last year, and KW knew he wouldn't be on the roster this season.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:01 PM) Think again. Aardsma is one of the hardest throwers in the game. In fact I remember John Dujaun on the Score saying he was the hardest thrower for the Cubs (AVG fast ball is around 96 MPH) and Jenks, Thornton, and MacDougall were in the top 10 as well. Maybe acquiring this Vasquez will stop people from spelling Javy's last name incorrectly. Hypocrite

Thank you Baltimore. We would have regretted giving him a 3 yr deal for 3 million plus. He really hit the wall last season, and I wouldn't trust Ozzie to use him right anyways.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 04:32 PM) And Baldelli isnt worth BMAC so theres where the problem is. Baldelli may be worth an average young guy like Rich Hill, but no way could you give up a solid starter like BMAC. Most MLB executives would take Rich Hill over McCarthy in a heartbeat.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:36 PM) Pretty much, this seems like a lateral move. The reliever we got back had good K numbers last year, and was 23 pitching in AA. But who knows -- last year was his first season pitching exclusively out of the 'pen. It's hard to call it a "brutal" trade as you did. I just feel like we sold Cotts at his lowest value, and thought we would include him in a bigger deal. I don't feel like we're a better team after making this deal.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:33 PM) Oh yeah, he's better than Tracey. Fathom, what do you think of the prospect we got? No clue about him. He has good K numbers, but so does everyone in the Cubs organization. He's a lefty though, so it's not a terrible acquisition. This gives the Cubs 3 lefties now in a division without a lot of lefty fire power. I wonder if they're going to use one of their other lefties in a trade.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:30 PM) i dont really get it either.....aardsma seems like another sean tracey to me, and i have no idea on vasquez.. I'll say this: Aardsma is better than Tracey. Aardsma's problem is that he overthrows. I'm just disappointed because I thought Cotts would have brought in better value than he did.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:28 PM) Hell no, we went through that BS last year. Hopefully Kenny has something else up his sleeve, history shows he does. Lets wait and see. Logan is very likely a better option than any of the other lefty relief crap that is on the market. Of course, Fabio Castro would be a nice option to have....but we screwed that up badly.

QUOTE(watchtower41 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:22 PM) What has Cotts done to merit more in a trade?? Win a ring?? I am shocked that anybody is even interested in him, he was throwing BP all of last year. I dont think he held a lead once this entire season. ONCE. He's still a relatively young, cheap lefty reliever who is a year away from one of the best relief seasons in the league. Maybe with a better pitching coach, he'll develop something more than a 91 mph fastball and nothing else.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:12 PM) Aardsma has a good live arm, but I dont know if I would of sent Cotts off for that. I guess the name of the game this offseason is "sell low". I'm shocked that we couldn't get more for Cotts. I've seen Aardsma pitch a lot, and he throws about 95 mph with absolutely no movement or secondary pitch. BTW, good luck to Cotts surviving those day games.

For David Aardsma....what an absolutely brutal trade by KW. I'm worried about this offseason, I really am.