Steff

QUOTE(SuperSteve @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 10:35 AM) I believe she meant within reason. Obviously you knew that. Actually I really think he thought (or was hoping) I would find proper comparison to the red car analogy... :rolly

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 10:30 AM) LOL Ok Steff. and a jury could award damages because someone drives a red car. In the end, a law must be broken. No s*** Tex.. My point is that if a jury finds defimation or libel and claim the publisher had responsibility they can be awarded to pay damages.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 09:48 AM) The Publisher would lose if they knew Canseco's allegations were false. That cannot be sued for publishing the allegations. Example: Every newspaper in America published Clinton's quote "I did not have sexual relations with that woman" and it was later proved false. They were not sued for printing a lie. Newspapers printed allegations that Cardinal Bernadin had sexual relations with a young man. Later the man admitted to making up the story. Again, the publisher cannot be sued. Anyone can be sued for anything. It's in a jury's hands to award damages.

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 12:21 AM) Well, back when I was in 8th grade, banging the attractive 27 year old female would have only turned you into a legend, and not a basketcase in need of a psychiatrist. Is it absolutely pathetic that a 27 year old woman would participate in sexual intercourse with an 8th grader? You're damn right. Is the kid gonna need a psychiatrist? Hahahahahaaa!!!! I don't think so. Yea... this kid turned out perfectly normal.. :rolly http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5612275 Today show Updated: 11:35 a.m. ET Aug. 5, 2004Former school teacher Mary Kay Letourneau is a free woman now after serving seven years for child rape. Now, her victim and former lover, Vili Fualaau, breaks his silence. In an exclusive interview, Letourneau's former 6th grade student and father of two of her children, talked to “Today” host Matt Lauer about what he thinks about their relationship and her release from prison. Vili Fualaau: “I've been waiting for a long time for this to happen – for her to come out. And now that I – now that she is out now, you know, I'm really excited to see her.” Matt Lauer: “There's a no contact order in effect. A lawyer on your behalf took actions to initiate, which you had to do, to remove that no contact order. So is that for the ease of Mary visiting the kids so that it won't be awkward? You won't have to leave the house when she comes over or is that because you want to now say, ‘Let's see if we can make it?’” Fualaau: “That's it. I want to see … who she is and if she's still the same person that I fell in love with. And I want to see if she feels the same way for me.” Lauer: “Do you want your children to be there for the first meeting? Is that maybe a little buffer zone?” Fualaau: “Well, I kind of want to … do it alone. And then, later we'll bring the kids in the picture.” Will there be a relationship? Lauer: “How long do you think it'll take, once you do get to see her, how long do you think it'll take for you to decide whether this has a chance to work or not?” Fualaau: “I'm hoping by the end of this month.” Lauer: “So in other words if you see her at the end of this month, you're going to give it two weeks? You're going to give it … two months? I mean do you think you'll know kind of quickly if you two have grown apart and there's no chance for getting back together?” Fualaau: “I mean we left on awkward terms. So…” Lauer: “That's a…” Fualaau: “I mean I can still remember that … night. You know that we were spotted at in front of her friend's house and taken and separated. I can still remember that night like [the] back of my hand.” Lauer: “And that was the last time you saw her?” Fualaau: “Yeah. In fact I can remember word for word and – what we did and what we were doing.” Lauer: “What were the last words you said to her?” Fualaau: “What was the last word that I said to her? ‘I love you.’” Lauer: “And she said?” Fualaau: “And she said ‘shut up,’ I'm not leaving.” What Mary Kay saw in Vili Lauer: “When this started you were 12, she was 32. What your memories of Mary Kay Letourneau back when you were 12 or 13-years-old? What was she like?” 'What was she like? She was beautiful. I thought she was really gorgeous. I mean that was all I thought about her before anything happened.' — Vili Fualaau Talking about Mary Kay Letourneau Fualaau: “What was she like? She was beautiful. I thought she was really gorgeous. I mean that was all I thought about her before anything happened. And it things just turned out [that] we fell in love.” Lauer: “You know, Vili, that some people say, ‘He was 12-years-old, she was 32, how could they fall in love? What did they have in common?’ How do you answer that?’” Fualaau: “I ask myself that at the same time – the same thing all the time. You know, I was 12, she was 32. When I look back at the situation, I'm just like, what did she see in me? She's older than I am. She's a teacher and she's married – has a good life.” Lauer: “Four kids.” Fualaau: “And she has four kids of her own. And I’m 12. I barely even know what my future is.” Lauer: “Or who I am?” Fualaau: “Or, yeah, or who I am. And I ask myself that all the time. And I always just think, I’m not really that good looking – what's the deal here? Why does she love me or why does she say she's in love with me? And things like that.” Lauer: “She said basically you were old beyond your years, wise beyond your years – very strong, very smart and that there was an instant attraction. Is that the way you remember? That kind of instant attraction?” Fualaau: “I wouldn't say it was like that.” Lauer: “What did you two talk about? I mean when you were alone together, which was hard.” Fualaau: “Right.” Lauer: “It was hard for you two to be alone together. She was your teacher.” Fualaau: “She was my teacher.” Lauer: “What kinds of things did you talk about?” Fualaau: “Basically we talked about anything and everything. I'm not the only person that's ever felt the feeling I felt. I mean there are a lot of people that's been in love before [and] knows what it feels like. And the people that are still in love, you know, for a long time, [like] the people that are married their whole life. And love is very strong in their marriage. It's that feeling where [you] just know. It's not like you have to work at it.” Lauer: “There was just the chemistry?” Fualaau: “It's just there and it belongs to you.” Lauer: “She went to jail for the relationship [and] she got out. And then, of course, you two got back together again. What was the hardest part for you when she went off to prison?” Fualaau: “Hardest part was being separated without choice.” Lauer: “I think you’ve described it some ways as a conspiracy against love?” Fualaau: “Yeah.” Lauer: “Was it ever?” Fualaau: “I believe sometimes, maybe it was like a punishment from God – the whole adultery thing. And also a test to see, you know, if we still love each other after seven years.” Adjusting to being a father Lauer: “Some people have told me, Vili, that over the last seven years, if it hadn't been for your kids, things might have turned out very differently for you? That you went through some very difficult times. And that your daughters were kind of what got you through it. What have they meant to you over these past seven years?” Fualaau: “At first it was really hard for me to believe I was a father – I still wanted to live out my childhood, which I've tried. But I still couldn't because it just couldn't happen.” Lauer: “You were 14 when Audrey was born, right?” Fualaau: “Right.” Lauer: “And then 15 and a half, 16 when Alexis was born?” Fualaau: “Yes.” Lauer: “That's a tough adjustment. I mean how did you deal with it?” Fualaau: “At home I write little poems about my life and how I lived it out, what gave me that strive just to keep pushing forward and every time I fall how to pick myself up. And what I did to do those kind of things.” Lauer: “Tell me about a couple of times when you fell. I mean did you have tough times when you thought, "I'm not going to make it through this." Fualaau: “Yes. I've been there more than I can count. It's just been crazy. I mean just seven years of being alone.” Dating other girls Lauer: “What do you say to people, Vili, who think it's hard to believe this is a love story? You know that there's something built into some people that say it can't work. You know I think there are probably some people who want to grab you by the coat and shake you and say, ‘Vili, it can't work, you were 12-years-old.’” Fualaau: “I've heard that so many times. There [are] people like telling me all, ‘Vili, you're very young. You're a handsome guy. There are a lot of other girls out there. Don't dwell in this relationship because it's making you sad. I hate to see you sad like this. "So, try other relationships. And try to make yourself happy.’ And I have and other relationships haven't made me happy.” Lauer: “Has it affected the way you view other women?” Fualaau: “Yes, it has.” Lauer: “In what way?” Fualaau: “Every girl or woman that I've gone out with, I've always compared Mary to them. Can they stand up to who Mary was?” Lauer: “And if they're teenagers, that's like comparing a girl to a woman which has got to be a little difficult for you. Although some people would say that's what you should be after. You should go after a girl.” Fualaau: “Right. Well, I wanted to be in love on many different levels. You know I wanted to bond with them on many different levels. And I couldn't do that with any other girl, because I constantly thought about Mary or they would constantly remind me about Mary. They would bring up the subject, ‘So how did it all start?’” Lauer: “You'd be on like the second date and they'd say, "Tell me about Mary Kay?" Fualaau: “Yeah. It [would] be like that. And sometimes it would like irritate me because I wanted to start something new. I want to see if it could work. But I guess, you know, it's just inevitable not to work.” Lauer: “You have no doubt, even as a 12 and 13-year-old, you had no doubt that this was the relationship that for you, was forever.” Fualaau: “I didn't think it would. I never really thought I could ever fall in love that young. I didn't know what the feeling was. But I could explain the feeling from [an] adrenaline rush, to the feeling that flow through my body, and the words that come out of my mouth, sometimes they sound kind of corny. But [at] same time, I didn't really care, because it was from my heart, and it's what was true. Or, what is still true.” Lauer: “You are 21-years-old now. You have two daughters, seven and five. And you've been through a lot. Was it worth it?” Fualaau: “Was it worth it? I don't know yet. There's still more to come. We have to hear her side, and whether she still loves me. So, there's still a lot more to come.” :puke

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 09:29 AM) The problem is how much are you going to spend on the law suit versus what you could collect from a broke Jose Canseco. The publisher can be sued.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 09:11 AM) So if no one sues, you know there is pretty much fire underneath that smoke... Maybe it's just me.. but I have no doubt there's a LOT of fire under that smoke. I believe what Jose's saying a lot more than I doubt it.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Feb 10, 2005 -> 01:55 AM) I thought we decided to set the standard at 5000 posts before we issued the badges. A week on the job and already it's "we"... :rolly

SB.. In a nutshell she said that while the publishing company likely has a disclaimer on the book that they can (and will in her opinion) be sued for negligence, and they will lose unless the claims can't be proven. That, of course, will be up to a jury as to what they define and determine as "proof". One interesting thing is that the publisher initially said no way to the book. After investigators looked into Jose's claims they changed their minds. It all boils down to anyone can sue for anything. It's a gamble on what a jury will decide. She apologized for not being more detailed but she's a bit busy. But she did say she'd answer questions if there were any more. She also wanted to stress that she is not a publishing attny and her answers are based on case law that she has access to.

QUOTE(The Critic @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 07:33 PM) Mohawktalk.com Pale Face Talk The Scalp Bar Sex, Lies, and Punk Rock

I agree that many here wouldn't have the insite to think rationally about this stuff. Can't really have an opinion until you are responsible for a child. My Godson and my neice have changed the world a lot for me as well.

QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 07:15 PM) lol so true. Do you have kids of your own Steff? No way!! Life is way too busy for anything more than pets. And I don't think a kid would have my appreciation for 50+ baseball games a year right off the bat. Gotta wait till I slow down on that stuff.

QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 07:13 PM) I certainly hope so. If it was... he'll get the last laugh when her ass is sitting in jail.

QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 07:09 PM) That's still a terrible way to get back at an ex. I don't think it was a "get back" I think she's just plain stupid.

QUOTE(silver and black @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 06:56 PM) ...i am sure the same can be said for you... Hmm.. no. I wouldn't think it would be cool for my kid to be molested or raped by a pedophile.

QUOTE(silver and black @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 06:51 PM) I'll make sure not to have a daughter... so I can prove you can be wrong. You can bet I'm rooting for that.

QUOTE(RibbieRubarb @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 05:32 PM) One: Take it easy buddy. Steff has every right to express her opinion..and might I add not in an insulting way like you. Two: Where's my Thread Police badge?!? It certiantly wasn't meant as an insult. No more than the other 50 times someone else expressed the same thing.

QUOTE(The Critic @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 06:00 PM) and crime is crime. and this teacher is a sexual predator who should be locked away for what she did, once it's proven in court. a 27-year-old woman who has sexual desires towards a 13-year-old boy is every bit as much of a sicko as the reverse would be. I don't get it critic.. Makes you wonder the company they keep that makes them thing pedophelia is ok.

QUOTE(silver and black @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 05:39 PM) my.point.exactly. But the point you're making.. since it's ok for you.. is that when your 13 year old daughter's school calls to tell you she's getting nailed by some 30 year pedo... you're saying you'll think back to this day and say.. "ahhh.. it's ok." If you do.. you deserve to be locked up just as much as the asshole that would have raped your daughter. BTW.. it's nothing personal against you.. I'd feel this way about any parent that would think of this as "cool"

QUOTE(qwerty @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 05:25 PM) That is not gonna happen anytime soon. I hope not, for any of you young guys, for many reasons.

QUOTE(silver and black @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 04:34 PM) ... or be very, very happy to get laid. I know I would... So it should work the opposite way, right...? Maybe a 13 year old girl would be as estatic to get laid. It's possible I suppose.. Right..? Remember that when you have a daughter...

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 04:50 PM) If it was called profit sharing it was probably not taken from your check. For $30, I don't think it's worth getting an attorney. Be careful filing your taxes, unmatched 1099 do cause the IRS to get excited, regardless of the amount. I wouldn't get an attny either. But like Tex said.. an unmatched 1099 will get you a call from Uncle Sam..

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Feb 9, 2005 -> 03:59 PM) That's messed up! Any motive, other than being assholes? IMO, being an asshole is more than enough for some folks to get the s*** beat out of them. These two more than qualify.

http://www.caledonianrecord.com/pages/top_...story/d74e6e039 Jeff Plourde Facing More Charges BY JAMES JARDINE, Staff Writer Tuesday February 8, 2005 ST. JOHNSBURY -- Jeff Plourde, the 17-year-old Lyndonville youth charged with aggravated animal cruelty in January, is facing new charges of burglary and possession of stolen property. Chris Stark, 20, of Kirby, has also been arrested, along with Plourde, on charges of burglary and possession of stolen property. Caledonia District Court State police report receiving information that Plourde and Stark had been involved in several burglaries and thefts in the area. State police, along with the Lyndonville Police Department, executed a search warrant at the Plourde and Stark residences. Stolen property was located at the Plourde residence, according to state police, who say the investigation is ongoing. Plourde is awaiting arraignment on Feb. 28 in Caledonia District Court on the felony charge of aggravated animal cruelty. On that charge, he could face a maximum sentence of 3 years in prison. The cruelty charge resulted from an investigation by Lyndonville Police Chief Jack Harris of the alleged brutal cruelty and torture of a chocolate Labrador retriever owned by Kelley Willis of Lyndonville. In a separate case, on Jan. 24 in Caledonia District Court, Plourde was convicted of two counts of petty larceny, two counts of violating conditions of release and one count of littering. Plourde was sentenced to 6 to 18 months to serve, all suspended except for 60 days to be served on the community work crew. He was also placed on probation. No court date has been announced for Plourde and Stark on the most recent charges. :headshake

INDIANAPOLIS, Indiana (AP) -- Investigators found human remains in a basement under fresh concrete after a brother and sister told them they had killed their mother and grandparents, authorities said Wednesday. Investigators worked into early Wednesday digging up concrete in the grandparents' small, wood-frame home on the city's east side, and a forensic anthropologist was brought in to help gather evidence. Kenneth Allen Jr., 29, and his sister, Kari Allen, 18, had been pulled over for speeding Tuesday in Missouri. In the car, officers discovered bloody clothes and bedding, as well as jewelry, cash, credit cards and the driver's licenses of two older people in Indiana, St. Charles County, Missouri, Sheriff's Lt. Craig McGuire said. Indianapolis police identified the grandparents as Leander Bradley, 92, and Betty Bradley, and the mother as Sharon Allen. Kari Allen told authorities she and her brother had killed them, dismembered them and buried them in the basement floor in the grandparents' home, McGuire said. Kenneth Allen also later admitted involvement, he said. They were charged with receiving stolen property, and murder charges were planned, authorities said. Police Lt. Paul Ciesielski said authorities believe the three were killed early last month. The sister told authorities the mother and grandmother were killed at the mother's apartment in Noblesville, an Indianapolis suburb, then the bodies were brought to the grandparents' house, where the grandfather was killed, Ciesielski said. http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/02/09/basement....h.ap/index.html

Suspect in teen's scalping surrenders Wednesday, February 9, 2005 Posted: 2:20 PM EST (1920 GMT) Sheila is recovering at home, after two weeks in the hospital. Image: BOISE, Idaho (AP) -- A woman suspected of scalping another member of their punk clique -- apparently as punishment for her disrespectful behavior toward women -- surrendered Wednesday, police said. The victim, a 16-year-old girl whose hair was cut in a mohawk, survived. Marianne Dahle, 26, surrendered at the Ada County Jail on a felony arrest warrant for aggravated battery. If convicted, she could be sentenced to 14 years in prison. Dahle is accused of tying up the teenager and cutting away a 6-by-8-inch section of her scalp. She allegedly used a 4-inch knife to cut away the crown and back portion of the scalp. The victim -- who identified herself to reporters only as Sheila -- said she underwent skin grafts and anticipated another surgery to repair the damage. Authorities did not release the girl's name. Dahle was visiting Kirkham Hot Springs in central Idaho with the girl and a friend when the attack occurred January 18. The teen spent two weeks in the hospital and is now recovering at home. "When I say this gal was scalped, she was truly scalped," said Bill Braddock, chief deputy of Boise County. "The top of her head, her hair, was completely cut off. The motive, as near as we've been told by witnesses, was retaliation for acting in a way that the adult perceived as being offensive to women as a gender." Braddock said the victim, Dahle and another teenage girl who witnessed the attack were long-term acquaintances who belonged to the same clique. The victim's mohawk hair cut may have played a role in the assault, he said. "In their punk group, wearing a mohawk is a sign of being a punker, and according to their creed if you disrespect women you are not allowed to wear a mohawk," he said. "But I don't think the victim had any idea in the world she was going to be scalped." Sheila, who is from Nampa, near Boise, told Boise TV station KTVB that she thought the woman was going to cut her hair. "Why would they do something like this to me?" Sheila asked. "I thought they were my friends." The group is not a gang, Braddock said, though they had at least some established rules of behavior. "It was an act of revenge. I view this as a case where an adult female is using predatory control -- both psychological and sexual -- toward juvenile victims. There are definitely sexual overtones to this crime," Braddock said. No drugs or alcohol were involved, Braddock said. Police were alerted after Dahle allegedly dropped the teen off at St. Luke's Regional Medical Center in Boise, Braddock said. Sheila said her face and body were covered with blood when Dahle left her at the hospital. Authorities recovered the scalp, which had been left behind at the hot springs, but doctors were unable to reattach it, Braddock said. The Kirkham Hot Springs, about 70 miles northeast of Boise, are popular with campers and hikers, but visitors during midweek in the winter can count on near total seclusion, Braddock said. The case has been difficult to investigate because it has taken deputies time to win the trust of witnesses and friends of the victim. Some witnesses are afraid of retaliation. "Everybody in this case is very fragile and they're worried about how they're going to be judged by their peers," Braddock said. "I have to be very protective of my victim and others who are cooperating." Braddock said he only agreed to discuss the incident so the public could help authorities find Dahle. Police would not release many details for fear it would harm the prosecution's case.