FlaSoxxJim

QUOTE(sox4lifeinPA @ Aug 16, 2007 -> 11:05 PM) To jump to the conclusion that they some how had a homosexual relationship is pretty ridiculous and seemingly an attempt to mischaracterize a biblical story for political gain or at least a foot hold for an argument in favor of homosexuality. Jumping to that conclusion s less of a leap than the leaps requierd to turn other Biblical passages into anti-homosexual screeds. The relationship is drawn out in Samuel, and dwelled upon and the reader feels a bit voyueristic at the end of it. There are criticisms with every translation, and you know that NIV is no exception. A cheif criticism is that it has a slant to it that supports an evangelical agenda (what was that you said about biblical stories for political gain?) compared to KJV and others. Convenient substitution of "effeminate" as "homosexual" is a populatrly cited case in point (would that we all could read Hebrew), and it's likely the NIV authors similarly intentionally dialed down the gay in Samuel to nuance the translation as they saw fit.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Aug 16, 2007 -> 10:14 PM) My old laptop is falling apart! Today the n key fell off, and the guy said to fix it we would need to replace the whole keyboard due to the age of the computer. Dammit. I can live without an "n" I had to use a busted keyboard like that for a little while once. I forget what key was dead, but I just kept it in clipboard memorey and pasted it in every time I needed it. It would have driven me nust if I had to do it for more than a couple days.

I was going to stay clear of the Jonathan and David row mostly because I didn't know the nature of their relationship was much in question. Whether or not the lovers' relationship was physically consummated or not, this is way more than a coupld dudes knocking back beers at the bowling alley. PA, explain away this statement of Saul's from 1 Samuel 20: It is quite evident that Johnathan "delighted much in David." And in 2 Samuel, David confesses his delight in turn: I think we've definately got some Brokeback Gilboa Mountain here. But I think the relationship is on the whole shown in a favorable light which is refreshing for the OT.

QUOTE(sox4lifeinPA @ Aug 16, 2007 -> 05:16 PM) Dress up games | Car Finance | Insurance-owl information Centre | Myspace Layouts | Remortgages I'm straight up concerned for soxtalk now. Why would I insure my owl? You obviously have not read the last Harry Potter book, have you?

Two unusual apologies were reported today from the descendants of some bad muthahs from long ago. Danish culture minister Brian Mikkelson in Dublin today apologized for the bad behavior of his forebears in the Viking raids on Ireland: http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...2149421,00.html Also, the descendants of cannibals who killed and ate four Fijian missionaries in 1878 have apologised for their forefathers' actions, the Australian Associated Press reported Thursday. http://rawstory.com/news/afp/PNG_apologise...s_08162007.html In the spirit of the day, I'd like to apologize to any Soxtalkers whose ancestors may have been wronged by ancestors in any way. Wow, I do feel better now.

QUOTE(vandy125 @ Aug 16, 2007 -> 09:55 AM) After saying this, we are told to live under the laws of the land we live in, and we need to respect those around us. I see church ordained marriage as different from state marriage. One is a religious thing, the other is not. As such I do not see why we should be pushing those beliefs on the state. Something such as stealing though (as an example), is not a religious thing that is separate from the state. If we see that not being addressed, we do need to push on that. We are in close agreement on these issues than it first appeared, then. I respect the right of churches to allow or disallow the recognition or sanctioning of gay marriage in the manner that best reflects the views of the flock. Differences of opinion among the flock may lead to schism as we are seeing in the Anglican/Episcopal church, but the dialog and decisions need to take place. I appreciate your insights into the transforming nature of Jesus and sin/repentance, and what it means to the OT take on the wages of sin. Even if I only see him as a human role model and not a Word made flesh facet of a divine agent, I continue to find attractive his central messages of forgiveness and love.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 16, 2007 -> 08:43 AM) fly fly, little starling.

So, How long did Cain hate his brother? Answer: As long as he was Able! Thanks, I'm here through Thursday. Tip your wine bearer and try the loaves and fishes.

QUOTE(vandy125 @ Aug 15, 2007 -> 09:48 AM) The difference between these texts and the one's that were sited is that there is condemnation of the practice. It is not merely writing down what happened. I know that is not PC to say, but it is what I believe, but I also believe that I do not have any ability to judge anyone. That is between each person and their maker. I cannot know someone's heart. I can bring the sin before the Christians that are doing it, but what common ground is there for me to appeal to with a non-Christian? To put it another way, the Bible clearly condemns it, but if you are not a Christian, that should not matter to you. Well, the OT condemns it, and the NT not so much. By extension of your reference to the cast the first stone Gospel refence in which Jesus supplants the Law of Moses, I should take Jesus' apparent lack of concern over homosexuality (he never mentions it) as an unspoken dismissal of the uptight OT dictums, yes? Your drawing the distinction between condemnation of a practice versus writing down what happened I can accept on its face, but, I know I can draw out other OT examples where practices that are quite normal today were explicitly condemned. I can't recall the book or verse at the moment, but the one about men with poor eyesight being unworthy to approach God's alter comes to mind. I'll have to find it. But, I'll use your own acid test and discount one of the rare NT references to homosexuality, from Paul in Romans 1: This is a verse commonly pulled out to demonstrate that, yes, homosexuality is bad by NT standards too. But, this is one of the examples you are talking about that is "merely writing down what happened": As for common ground and appealing to with a non-Christian. . . this is the sort of discourse that must occur in a society where not everyone shares the same belief system yet we still try to seek understanding of where our operspectives come from. More to the point, the but about the Bible clearly condemning homosexuality, but that shouldn't matter to non-Christians is an illogical statement. There are lots of non-Christians whose rights are compromised because they are gay and therefore not allowed to enter into civil unions, adopt, share parental custody, enjoy spousal hospital visitation priveledges, etc. If vestigial belief in the condemnation of homosexuality by conservative Christians is holding our society back from correcting this injustice, then it should matter and does matter to me.

Random Exotic Species Fun Fact of the Day: Source: ISSG Global Invasive Species Database

Happy Birthday, you big brown monoptic, ribbed, afghan dog-looking thing, you.

QUOTE(sox4lifeinPA @ Aug 15, 2007 -> 02:43 PM) Mortgages | Debt Help | Myspace Friend Train | Debt Help | Cheap Loan look, a palendrom! btw, I don't even WANT to know what a Myspace Friend Train is or looks like.... Egad, a base life defiles a bad age!!

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 15, 2007 -> 10:41 AM) Has anyone else noticed a sudden, dramatic increase in spam email during the last week or so? My email account is becoming almost unmanageable. I must be getting close to 100 a day now. Maybe you have SoxTalk to thank for that?? Mortgage | Credit Cards UK | Get More Spam | Spam Out Your Ass | 0 Credit Cards

QUOTE(longshot7 @ Aug 15, 2007 -> 01:56 PM) Did you hear about this controversy over the Van Halen website where they removed Michael Anthony from the VH 1 and Women & Children first album cover? Can you believe that s***? I guess they put the originals back after a huge uproar. How unclassy is that though? Unreal.

For trying so hard to paint themselves as green, the last two years have really showed BP really only thinks green when the green in question is money. Before the Prudhoe Bay oil field leaks last year and teh subsequent maintenance shutdowns, the lines on the west side of the field had not been pigged since 1998 and those on the east side hadn't been pigged since 1991! (Contrast that to the Trans-Alaskan pipeline where they pig the line every two weeks). By August last year when the north slope pipes were finally shut down, "more than 70 percent of the wall of the tube had eroded in 12 places. At another 187 spots, wall loss exceeded 50 percent." http://money.cnn.com/2006/10/02/magazines/...rtune/index.htm All for the sake of profit.

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 10:06 PM) I got a secured loan, some more loans, some mortgages, another loan, and advice on my new debt problems. Secured Loan | Loans | Mortgages | Loan | Debt Problems :lolhitting

QUOTE(Felix @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 08:06 PM) A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous. Got me? I finished reading Fear and Loathing today, so I figured I'd change from Ralph Steadman's work I hope you drank nothing but Flying Dog whilst reading the Gonzo.

Yabba Dabba Fµ@* Yeah!!

QUOTE(sox4lifeinPA @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 02:24 PM) Thanks to soxtalk's ads, I was able to consolidate my credit cards, find a doctor in Tennessee, play my RPG free of charge, and dress up in my pirate rock band. thanks soxtalk! Soxtalk cured my genital warts, and it makes great julienne fries too!

QUOTE(Felix @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 07:44 PM) Trust me, I'm aware of that process. When I was younger, I was raised agnostic, as my parents aren't religious at all. Then, in 6th grade, I went to catholic school (better education than the public one), and.. well.. that was enough to give me a hatred of religion. It's sad, but it's true (this reigns very, very true). Diggin' the Beefheart

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 07:13 PM) I would disagree with that. An atheist generally believes that there is no higher power. An agnostic generally does not know. It's the opposite of a gnostic. See above. I didn't wake up on day and know that I had gone from agnostic to atheist. And again, out of sensitivity to religous family and friends I tried passing as an agnostic for a while before I came out to them.

QUOTE(Felix @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 07:04 PM) There is a huge difference between agnostic and atheist, so you're completely wrong there. There is, but I can attest to the truth of what Crimson is saying. Out of (a possibly misplaced) courtesy to the religious family and friends I grew up surrounded by I continued to profess to be agnostic well past the time when I had known myself that I was an atheist. Unless you are born into atheism, it is an experiential process to get there from the religious space you were born into, and the transition from questioner to doubter to outright unbeliever is for most a continuum rather than an abrupt process.

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 03:37 PM) You know what you get with Roth, and that's just an arrogant ass. But with Eddie you get an unpredictable psychopath. Damn, I hope that's the title of the upcoming studio album.

QUOTE(Steff @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 02:59 PM) Huge estrangement there. MA got screwed because he continued his friendship with SH. EVH isn't even shy about saying so either. It's very sad. Seeing as Hagar the Tequilla Night Club King can now buy and sell the lot of them several times over, Maybe Michael Anthony was wise not to burn that bridge.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Aug 14, 2007 -> 02:29 PM) Oh, and there's little evidence that gamma rays caused the Silurian extinctions, either. Yes, I'd say the evidence in favor of climatic (big-ass Ice Age) causes is stronger at this point, although the exploding star/gamma ray burst hypothesis is intriguing.