Gregory Pratt

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:22 PM) So then I'll say that you're full of crap. You can say whatever you want. So far in this discussion all you've done is make bad points about past underdog champions completely ignoring their whole situations. Like St. Louis -- the White Sox aren't in the NL Central. The whole "World Series ring" argument. A bunch of weak arguments. So, if you say I'm full of crap, I kind of shrug.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:22 PM) Wow, the Soxtalk IQ will increase exponentially once school is back in session. Football = baseball = why KW possesses one ring to rule them all. Or didn't your math teacher teach you that, too?

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:20 PM) Care to provide some links? No.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:19 PM) I don't think that Gord Ash thought of Kenny as a "laughingstock" six years ago and I don't think that Pat Gillick thinks of him as one now. I don't think that Billy Beane is laughing anymore. And since he hasn't won crap since he began running his mouth, I don't think that anybody's listening to him anyway. I don't think Bill Cowher or Tony Dungee are laughing at him, either. They say, "We overcame the impossible. Go White Sox!" That's why I say, God bless Jerome Bettis. He beat up on the Cleveland Indians of Milwaukee and led his Indianapolis Colts past the Detroit Tigers to win the World Series of Sports.

QUOTE(SoxFan77 @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:18 PM) Blasphemy I was, of course, being sarcastic. But that seems to be the point he's making.

QUOTE(fathom @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:17 PM) He'll be fired well before he can become the laughingstock again. It was interesting seeing him say a few days ago in the press that the bullpen is eventually going to cause him to lose his job. Like I've said, I'd hope so but I don't look forward to the replacement at all. It'd probably be Rick Hahn. I've heard good things, but I'm not sure I have faith in him, either.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:14 PM) Yeah, by a guy who hasn't won crap. Umm, by a lot of people. But like I've said in the past, winning a World Series doesn't make you a good GM. I guess because Schuerholz has one Ring, he and KW are equals.

QUOTE(fathom @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 02:13 PM) BTW, I don't think Williams is the laughingstock of baseball at all. If anything, his rep as a GM has greatly increased over the last three years. It has increased over the last three years. But it's a false impression and it'll go back down soon. You aren't disputing that Williams was once a laughingstock, are you? I never said he's still a laughingstock. I said I can see why he once was and why, IMO, he soon will be again.

Now you're disputing that the Cardinals were a fluke ----- or even an upset? Damn.

No, it's not fathom's sources. You can see it in Moneyball, for one. For another, KW was and often is made fun of as a bad GM. And it hasn't got anything to do with anyone on this site.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 01:58 PM) Owens in July: .293 .341 8 sb 1 2b. Basically 9 doubles. 5bb 11k not really that bad. If he keeps developing at this rate, he could actually be a leadoff hitter. That and his defense in CF has surprised the s*** out of me. Luis Terrerro was good for a few at-bats, too.

If wite agrees with me, I know I can't be wrong.

Sweeney's looked at as a number two hitter, as far as I can tell.

WCSox, I wish I had your rose-colored glasses. I try to look at this organization and see good things, but that's pretty hard to do. We're going to be bad. I don't want to discuss anything else with you, though.

This conversation's about done from my end, though. My position: we should have a full-scale firesale but alas, Williams won't do it, and that might be for the best because I don't think he could do it right. Your position: I like the Cubs. And am being too pessimistic. Got it.

QUOTE(SoxFan77 @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 11:43 AM) Great.. unless they pitch 9inning and strike out 27.. we don't have a shot. So 100mil 4th place and no minors is not bad.. please do tell.. what is Bad then? Trading "The Face of the Franchise!"

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 11:29 AM) Truthfully, I think that your knee-jerk reaction to what could be the Sox's first losing season in EIGHT years (and not to mention being less than two years removed form a WS title) shows what little perspective you have. You have no idea what "bad" is. Oh, bulls***. We may not have had losing seasons but we weren't necessarily very good in those eight years. We were okay teams in a bad division through much of the 2000s and late-90s. Little perspective? Please. You want perspective? Look at our draft history. Look at our lineup. Their age. The likelihood of regression. There's a reason Williams was a laughingstock for awhile, and it isn't because I lack perspective. There's a reason we went 88 years without winning a title. And that's because we were bad, with bad management for a long, long time, and it's still going on today. I'm just glad we won when we had our chance because it won't happen anytime soon unless something drastic happens.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 11:22 AM) I do root for the Cards when the Sox are out of it. Spoken like a true champion. You know, I'm echoing Reinsdorf in 97, except our team's in a much worse situation now. Much much worse. Truth is, this organization's bad, and there's nothing wrong with admitting it. If everyone got on Reinsdorf, Williams and the scouts for being terrible, we might see true, significant changes but as it stands, anything less than sheepish devotion to the team and a refusal to criticism is seen as "Cub-like." Truthfully, I think you're being Cub-like by refusing to acknowledge the reality of our situation.

Also: like I said, if you think the Cardinals were such a great example, then have Bud Selig move us to the NL Central.

Why don't you go become a Cardinal fan, if you're such a huge fan of them? I watch the games and am faithful to my team, but the truth is, they're bad and will continue to be bad. Besides, I already have a second team, and even their announcers beat the s*** out of ours. Atlanta!

Football =/ baseball. I'm not expecting to lose. I'm expecting the organization, the players, the General Manager to lose, because KW is not a good GM, the players are generally not good players, and the organization is one of the worst at all the things an organization is supposed to do.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 11:01 AM) Funny how the Cardinals won it all with Suppan/Weaver/Reyes in their rotation after their big free agent signing (Mulder) went down with an injury, an over-the-hill Jim Edmonds, a broken-down Scott Rolen, and David Eckstein as their playoff MVP. I'd say that the Sox will be much better on paper next year than the Cardinals were last year. I guess the lesson to be learned is: play in the NL Central, and you can be crappy and win anyway.

Hall is bad, but he isn't to blame for Floyd.

QUOTE(AirScott @ Jul 25, 2007 -> 10:58 AM) When people say that in April, it's too soon. When people say that in July...of the previous season...I mean...I'm at a loss for words. And it was kind of out of nowhere, too. I think this board has reached a new high for unsolicited pessimism. I'm being realistic, IMO. We have so many holes to fill and the Indians/Tigers are still very, very good. KC has more talent than we do, IMO, and the Twins are always better at taking advantage of things than we are. I'll be surprised, with the way the division is and the free agent class going into next year, if we even finish third. And no, it wasn't out of nowhere. It was in response to WC's comment about how next year is our "last year" to compete.

He is definitely the best. And damn, do I wish we would sign one of his deputies when they leave. Like Dayton Moore, who's now with KC. But no, that'd never happen because we keep it in The White Sox Family!