beck72

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 8, 2009 -> 02:26 AM) Dodgers might be looking for some bullpen arms, as Bellisario has some elbow problems. Dotel to the Dodgers makes a lot of sense. I'd say a NL team for sure. The sox wouldn't want Dotel to come back and throw vs. them in the playoffs if they get there.

Something to consider, Allen was from the 2004 draft, 5th round. The sox haven't had many guys make it in the bigs from those early 2000 drafts

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 8, 2009 -> 01:54 AM) I'm positive Kenny shows Cooper these guys on video and Coop gives him the thumbs up or thumbs down. My guess is Coop and Kenny identified this guy a long while ago, and he just became available now. Anyone watching the D-backs and Pena play in the 2007 postseason [and his reg. season with 30 holds] know why he would be identified by many teams to acquire. Now, he just has to get back to throwing like that.

I remember watching Pena throw in the 2007 postseason when he was part of the D-backs stellar bullpen and was pretty impressed. He had 30 holds that year and he would have been unattainable to start 2008. Looks like a good pick up. I also believe Dotel should be moving teams soon. When the market for relievers is stronger than it is for hitters [as Huston Street is supposed to have more value than the hitters out there, via numerous media reports], Dotel should be able to net a decent prospect with an upside of Brandon Allen. I have a strong suspicion that Brandon Allen won't live up the numbers he put up in AA this year. Kenny and Co. certainly do their homework on the guys in the sox system. Whether Pena lives up to his 2007 year or not, we'll see. But Allen probably won't come back and haunt the sox.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 6, 2009 -> 09:12 PM) I'd trade Poreda, Richard and Flowers for Halliday easy. If they want more, I'd throw in Getz or Fields if they're interested. If they insist on adding Allen, I'd do it but would want something else coming back. Flowers is more valuable than Allen. Flowers should be right up there with Beckham as far as being off the trading block.

QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Jul 5, 2009 -> 04:52 PM) Beck, on a side note maybe just maybe we could discuss instead of Poreda Thorton which gives them a solid late innings set up man. Dunno just throwing out some other combo. They are really thin at SP. They'll lose both Doug Davis and Garland to FA. Only Scherzer has done well for them from their other SP's. Their #1 SP prospect Jarrod Parker is 21 at AA. If Webb is the "face" of the franchise, and the D-Backs want to extend his deal after the 2010 season [which is a team option $8.5 mill], they'd have to pony up some big cash. Them getting depth at SP makes a ton of sense. My thinking is if the Padres thought a Peavy deal headlined by Richard/ Poreda was enough, even before Richard has had some success in the rotation this year, and Poreda has pitched well in limited time, other teams may like the offer as well. I know the situations are a little different, with Peavy owed a lot of cash and SD hurting. Yet, IIRC, AZ isn't exactly rolling in dough and needs young talent. Their depth in the minors is pretty sorry.

QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Jul 5, 2009 -> 02:06 PM) Beck, I posted a few days ago that even a 5 to 1 package of our prospects would almost be even or better than what AZ gave up. As noted only one of those prospects panned out into something and even then he is not doing all that great. At least the principle of the Peavy package includes 2 MLB ready pitchers in Poreda and Richard. You give up a lot for Haren but you get a legit Ace back. Looking back at some of the big trades for aces [the Haren deal, Johan, Bedard] included some major league ready players. Richard has more experience and has done better than any other guy included in those 3 deals [maybe Eveland had more IP, but hadn't thrown that well]. Whether he's got the "upside" of the key prospects in thsoe trades like Carlos Gomez, Adam Jones, and Carlos Gonzalez, prob. not. Yet the sox could add major league ready and close to ready pieces that those other deals lacked. Esp. as AZ doesn't have to be in full rebuilding mode, in the weaker NL, they can get depth to contend, opposed to getting one "star" quality headliner. Getting 2 SP's for a rotation in one deal, along with other players who could help now or soon, would have to be an impressive offer.

FWIW, Ariz.'s AA affiliate is in the SL, in the same division as the Barons. They have put a few players right from AA to the bigs this year, in players like OFer Gerardo Parra, and Reliever Daniel Schlereth. They have direct knowledge of the sox top minor leaguers.

QUOTE (103 mph screwball @ Jul 5, 2009 -> 01:11 PM) The Sox have 11 AA all stars FutureSox. (BTW, Great job with FutureSox.com, sincerely. Thanks JPN and everyone who makes that site top knotch.) I'm looking forward to a bright future. However, Haren is a stud and has performed in the AL. He and Halladay are the guys you move big talent to get. Short of Beckham, I don't care who they trade to get him. KW may just be bold enough to pull it off. Haren >> Peavy because of the AL experience alone. Haren or Halladay in place of Richard/Colon makes the Sox legit World Series contenders. The Sox have been better at drafting and finding young talent. They can restock the minors. Win NOW. It's also not a matter of mortgaging the future just to win in the present. It's a matter of trying to win for the next 4 1/2 years. What better way to try and win than by building around a rotation of Haren, Danks, Floyd and Buehrle.

I guess it's just a matter of the D-Backs and Sox matching up. If the Sox want to add that elite SP, they have to expect to pay in terms of talent. Haren would qualify for elite. And if they are serious about adding that piece, the sox will make it happen. Few GM's have the guts to make a huge trade that may be overpaying. Kenny Williams is willing to gamble on making a mistake that could cost other GM's their jobs. Kenny and Sox staff excel in knowing what the ceilings are of the players in their system. That's why few trades have come back and bitten the sox. Other teams acquire sox prospects with the expectation that they will improve on what they've done. The sox expect some level of drop off from the players they trade. For instance, Allen would be a nice addition for the sox. Yet he's likely not needed until 2011, with PK around for one more year. Yet what is his ceiling? He still has a career minor league line of .259/.329/.457, though he's hit well in the upper levels. Allen seems one of those "trade high" guys like Olivo, Reed and Chris Young. If a trade comes through, I'd expect a lot of people to say the sox "overpaid". I'd reserve judgment, based on the track of Kenny.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 5, 2009 -> 12:41 PM) http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9749600/Source:-D-backs- "almost" leaves a small possibility, but you are probably going to have to match the package the DBacks gave to the A's. That would be against the Sox best interest, even knowing how good Haren is. That's the key. If the D-Backs can say they got back at least what they gave the A's, they can save face with their fans. If the Sox truly want to add their elite SP, Haren seems ripe for being acquired. The sox are never going to add that elite SP via free agency. It has to come via the trade route or in developing one. The sox may be in the position to over pay on this one, with young position players and young pitchers available.

Phil Rogers is a little late it seems. Rosenthal wrote about this on 6-30. "I almost can't conceive of a package that would motivate us to move him," one Diamondbacks official said." It would seem to be a long shot. Yet with the D-Backs farm system depleted, esp. of position player prospects, the sox would seem to match up well with major league talent and talent near the majors. http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9749600...-of-Haren-trade

"Having used 12 starting pitchers, the Angels are talking to the Diamondbacks about Dan Haren, who leads the majors with 15 quality starts. ..." http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...0,3305872.story Very interesting. The D-Backs must be in a world of hurt financially for this to have any truth to it. The Angels have a big need for Haren, with a definite lack of starting pitching. The Angels system isn't what it once was. Yet the sox would seem to be able to offer a better package, starting with the Peavy trade principals--Richard, Poreda, 2 others--and moving up from there. The sox would seem to be able to offer more pitching that is near major league ready in return than the Angels. Not sure what the D-Backs need or want, though. But the Sox do have a history with the D-Backs, and they know the sox farm system. Something along the lines of the "Peavy package" + Fields, Anderson, Nix? Haren is under control for 4 + years.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 04:03 PM) Beckham has played 2B in the past and is a MI by trade. We won't be shifting him around from position to position, but a move from 3B to 2B would be like nothing. Maybe in the offseason. But they've already asked him to learn a new position. He's handled that fine. The Sox aren't going to ask him to learn a new one, during a pennant race, now that he's hitting and fielding well at 3b. This is on-the-job training at a new position is a rare feat for the big leagues. Most position changes occur during Spring training so they can get the extra practice. The Sox should leave Beckham alone now that he's adjusted both at the plate and in the field.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 02:12 PM) As Robins biggest fan, he was a terrible defender when he came up. He worked himself into a gold glover. IIRC, he had the tools, and wasn't horrible by a long shot. Yet made a lot of errors that young guys make. No way could he play 3b the way he did just by hard work if he didn't have the fundamentals down pat.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 01:59 PM) Honestly i'm okay with Getz at 2b. I really wanted Freddy Sanchez a couple of weeks ago when Getz was struggling pretty bad, but ever since the Sox brought up Beckham- Getz has really picked up his game. I read somewhere that Getz and Beckham are students of the game and spend a lot of time watching tape and studying opposing pitching- something rare for very young players. We get Quentin back after ASB if all goes well. That should be the best addition to an already solid lineup. As far as making a deal goes, a top of the rotation pitcher is what the doctor ordered. I'm not sure if KW will do such a thing, but damn our rotation would be stellar with one more top of the rotation guy. I too like Getz. Esp. for 2010. With one year under his belt, I'd see him hitting .280 with an .350 OBP. I'm just finding it hard to see who is the top of the rotation guy available via trade. And, while our lineup is solid now, I don't see someone else leading off if Pods gets hurt. Which, given his injury history, is very possible. With the pitching being as stellar as it has been, I'd hate to see the sox fail to advance because of the hitting. I liken it the Sox going into Spring with only Owens, BA and Wise as the CFers. Everyone knew their ceilings were very limited. Yet Kenny didn't bring in anyone else. Now might be the time to bring in another top of the order bat. It would be preferable for CF, esp for the future. Yet Pods is probably going to man CF for the rest of the year, barring injury.

QUOTE (dbaho @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 12:47 PM) Lopez ain't exactly good defensively though, which has been the main knock on him. Right now, if Getz and Nix continue to hit as they have lately, I don't see a major need to give up some spects like Dan Hudson for a 3 month rental. I was thinking with the inconsistency of Getz's defense [though he is fundamentally solid and should improve], even Lopez wouldn't be a big drop off. I, too wouldn't trade any top pitching prospects for Lopez, like Hudson. But the sox have filler that are putting up solid numbers but may not fit in the sox plans, due to being FB pitchers, SP's with not solid 3rd pitches, etc. Like Jhonny Nunez, McCulloch, etc.

I certainly think this is the last year of BA on the Sox. He should be dealt in the offseason, though he could be part of a deadline trade for a team that is out of it and wants to take an extended look at him. But right now, he offers decent value to the sox for his defense and ability to play all 3 OF spots.

Robin Ventura

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 12:16 PM) Lopez is going to bring in a couple good prospects, so I don't think the it's worth the Upgrayedd over the double dose of pimpin' at 2B with Getz and Nix. I really think if we continue to leave them out there we'll end up with some value to deal over the offseason if we decide to slide Beckham over for 2010 and going forward. I want no part of Freddy Sanchez. He's a good hitter, but he's overrated and also overpaid when his option vests. The only upgrades I'd really look forward to would be long-term solutions in the rotation, CF, RF, or 3B with Gordon moving to 2B. Short-term deals where we give up prospects don't work for me. Our pen has the ability to be possibly the best in baseball on talent alone. Jenks, Dotel, and Linebrink from the right side, plus Thornton and Poreda from the left side, with Carrasco doing a great job as a LR. This could be the best bullpen we've had down the stretch that I can remember, as even in '05 Marte fell apart and Hermanson got hurt. We had 3 awesome late-inning guys and another good LR, but this year we have a chance to have 5 awesome late inning guys if Liney steps it up. I'd like to throw one thing out there, but it's kind of scary, but kind of interesting too IMO. What about Alex Rios? Over the offseason the Jays were rumored to be offering a good prospect or young pitcher just to get someone to take Rolen off their hands. They really need to ditch some of their large, long-term contracts, and nobody would even come close to trading for Wells. My question is, if the Jays offered us Rios *and* threw in a very good prospect (not Snider or anything, but a guy who would rank in our top-10 with star potential), *and* if we could get him for basically nothing, like a package of bodies centered around Fields and Russell or something, would you do that deal? I actually might really consider it, and I'd probably make it, despite the contract. Alex Rios is a natural CF who only moved because of Vernon Wells. He's signed at basically $12M/year through 2014 (through his Age 33 season, so right through his prime). A year ago I would have wet my pants just thinking about getting him for a fair package, and I would have s*** myself and then rolled around in it and then ate some of it if someone had told me we'd be able to get him for nothing *and* get a top prospect in return, but this year, in this economy, that actually sounds doable. He'd be our long-term CF and he has the potential to, in a new environment that is a hitter's park, start hitting for power like was projected to all along. He could also play in RF too if we wanted to go with an OF of CQ-D2-Rios. It would be the ultimate high risk/high reward move, because if he can get back to putting up his 2007 numbers in the Cell through his prime, that's nothing but awesomeness, especially in CF. All he has to do is have one monster year for that deal to look like a bargain even in this economy, but right now it seems like the perfect storm for him to be dumped for garbage. A few things: *I don't mind the Getz/ Nix platoon. It's serviceable. But what happens if Pods goes down? 2b can get the sox insurance in case of injury for leadoff/ #2 hitter. Alexei is doing well hitting 2nd. Yet Lopez could also fill in there. *I'd love a long term option for the sox in CF, RF, 3b. But that is likely coming in the offseason. Say the sox get on OFer at the deadline, who is leftout? Pods? Q? Dye? Pods has to be out there with his bat. Same goes with SP. I don't see a name that fits what the sox were looking for, though I'd love the sox to upgrade there. *Rios is an interesting name. Yet his bat doesn't match his contract, both in dollars and years. And he has a complete NTC for the next 2 years. IIRC, Rios is a natural RF, and doesn't have the speed/ range/ etc for CF. Vernon Wells is in the same boat as Rios--long term deal, NTC, big money for little production. IMO, I'd rather have Wells but I still don't think the sox would take on his deal.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 06:44 AM) Sanchez would be a great fit for this team. Hes 31, and could help propel us to another division title; also he would be a nice player to have while third base fleshes itself out(Dayan, Morel) with Gordon eventually moving to second. I don't think it would take to much to get him; especially if you offer to pick up snell along the way and take on all the payroll. The sox would likely be paying Sanchez $8 mill for them in 2010. I think that is grossly overpaying in this economy. The sox have options in the IF that being stuck with a large contract for 2010 may not make sense. I think Sanchez would be good for this year. It's just next year that's the problem. And they wouldn't get anything back for Sanchez like they would with Lopez. No way would the sox offer him arb after 2010, as he'd accept it.

QUOTE (TheHolyBovine @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 05:15 AM) Good post. Lopez and Sanchez are essentially the same player. However, Lopez is cheap, and wouldn't cost us anything beyond this year. I'd like us to stay far away from Sanchez. Career OBP of .338, on the wrong side of 30, and has a very expensive option that automatically vests. No thanks. That's what I was thinking. The sox could still stick with Getz for 2b next year. I like him at 2b for the long term. Though who knows what the sox will do with Beckham. But Lopez would help the sox this year, and net the sox draft picks as they should be able to offer him arb, [which he'd decline as he stands to make a decent increase from his $3.5 mill].

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 4, 2009 -> 05:09 AM) Getz/Nix is fine for the rest of the year. The only move I'd make is perhaps is for a 3B like Scott Rolen and move Slayer to 2B. However, for next year, I think we'll see Alexei in CF (Now, I think he'd make a better OF than INF), and Beck at SS. Getz/Nix is decent, but I would love to make a play for the O-Dog and stick him in the 2 hole. The sox aren't going to ask Gordon to learn how to play 2b this year-another position he hasn't played. He's playing decently at 3b and his bat has come around. So an upgrade at 3b isn't coming this year.

Few position player options are out there that seem ripe for the sox to upgrade. The sox are rolling and have Quentin likely coming back in LF. Yet one spot is at 2b, with the Getz/ Nix platoon holding water. I've always liked Getz, and think he'll be a fine regular. Yet the sox can make a small move that could yield big results. Felipe Lopez from the D-Backs is said to be available, as he's only signed for 2009. He signed for $3.5 mill, which means the sox could offer him arb. and get picks back for him. Right now, he's hitting .299/.355/.405. A switch hitter, he can also play SS, [which would be good insurance in case Alexei went down]. He's also a top of the order hitter, leading off this year, with a .311 avg. and .366 OBP from there. In case Pods gets hurt, the sox would be in bad shape at the top, with no apparent replacement. I'm not sure the price in terms of talent. They could use someone for 2b, and maybe the OF. I could see something along the lines of Nix, Brian Anderson [who played college ball in AZ], and a minor league prospect having a good year but might not be a good fit long term for the sox [maybe a FB pitcher]. And the sox could afford to pay the rest of his salary without a problem--owed something like $1.5 mill. I'd like the sox to hold onto Getz, but I can see Ariz. wanting him as a key piece. I know Freddy Sanchez is another name out there, as well. He's owed more this year $6 mill total, [a little less than $3 mill this year] and has a $8 mill. 2010 option, that is picked up if he gets 600 ab's. Thoughts?

I like Getz going forward. Yet I see the sox making a deal at 2b to upgrade. If that happens, maybe one of Getz or Nix is included. I could see a guy like Felipe Lopez from the D-Backs be targeted. He'll be a free agent, who they can offer arb. to and get picks back. Or Freddy Sanchez, who has a 2010 team option. Either way, one of Getz or Nix would likely be included