caulfield12

QUOTE (TheHolyBovine @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 03:31 PM) We're on page 8, so I would say that people have opinions on this topic. Isn't that the point of a message board? Is there an approved list of topics we can talk about? I think there are several points to this thread: a) People are pissed about the CF situation (deservedly so) B) Many potential acquisitions exist that would at least temporarily solve the problem (including Dukes) CF has been a problem for this team FOR YEARS. KW's insistence that we "can't afford" a CF, either financially or in the players it would take to acquire such a player, is complete bulls***. The truth is, they have been counting on Ownes to take over the job for years, and cannot publically admit that their player evaluation skills were abysmal in this case. Well, there's a couple of other theories...1) Lillibridge would/could evolve into the leadoff hitter and CFer and 2) they could muddle through the first half of the season and wait for Beckham to come up, putting Ramirez in CF (although Ramirez looks like he's becoming more and more comfortable at SS) and 3) the asking price and/or available options like Pierre or Mathews, Jr., weren't viable

Something like Nunez/Santeliz/Omogrosso AND Broadway/Egbert/Marquez/Ely...along those lines. Actually, that seems to be TOO much to give up for Willits. I wouldn't mind giving up those starters, but I think Santeliz and Omogrosso should be retained if at all possible to see what they can do...not to mention the fact that odds are Carasco or MacDougal will need to be replaced this season due to non-performance.

Someone like Frank Catalanotto five years ago would have been perfect, if he could actually play CF adequately. That's the problem...there are a lot of corner outfielders that can give you decent numbers offensively, but the combination of the range and defensive ability AND the 350+ OBP is much harder to come by. It doesn't even have to be a player with blinding speed (and BA definitely isn't that), but then the leadoff issue comes up in combination, we've been talking about this over and over and over again for months with no easy solutions. I'm sure that quote was taken out of context...and made to look more dramatic. It was probably something along the lines of he was the best of the FEW/LIMITED options immediately available and they weren't ready to move Getz up until he got his feet under him and a little confidence to start the season.

Wise failure (inevitable)=200-250 at-bats for Anderson and playing 80% of the time that's going to be enough to get a good read before the end of July as far as which directiion KW has to go (and also what to do with Beckham and Ramirez as well)

So if Getz were to flop in the leadoff spot and have to go back down to the minors, who would be blamed? Everyone blames Ozzie and Walker for Anderson's 2006 season and not Brian himself...so I am just curious?

Is Toe Nash still available?

Forgot Shawn Chacon and Manny Ramirez.

But if you say you are misusing Wise, then that means that the only way NOT to do that would be 1) to play Anderson everyday and bat him 9th and 2) to leadoff with Getz against righties and lefties. So wouldn't, by definition, that be also "misusing" both of those guys as well? What could Ozzie do that wouldn't be bad with the options he has? Do you really want him to move Ramirez to CF and bring up Beckham to play SS and lead off, today?

Well, I don't think many teams would be able to absorb Viciedo's contract...which leaves the usual suspects of Allen, Danks can't be traded, Shelby and Escobar...if we trade Allen, we have NO LH depth to take Thome's DH spot though.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/Jonny-Gomes.shtml We might as well stick Jonny Gomes in CF since we've never cared about defense in the past five years...maybe we could catch lightning in a bottle. He's still under 30 years old, even though it seems like he has been around forever. And we wouldn't have to give up anything of value...

Albert Belle has to be on the roster somewhere too...maybe Strawberry, Howe or Gooden for some drug problems. What, no Cabrera or Swisher? Lofton? D'Angelo Jimenez for the bench? No Bonds, Clemens or Sosa?

Here's the problem...let's say Ozzie and KW do decide to stick Getz in the leadoff role and he doesn't respond well (like Swisher, who was a veteran player) and he ends up having his whole season ruined. I mean, it's not like having AJ hit 2nd or Cabrera leading off last year were optimal choices, either. Now it's not like Getz is our best prospect, but everyone would be calling for Ozzie's and KW's head if he ended up messed up like BA in 2006, right? It's just as logical to say we should bring up Beckham (he of the most supreme confidence of any player in our organization, majors and minors) and stick him in the leadoff spot, right? I mean, how can one of the Top Ten prospects in all of baseball, and someone who claims he wants to be the "Derek Jeter of the White Sox," not be ready? If anything, Ozzie is showing a willingness to sacrifice a pawn on the chessboard for the good of the team, just like he sacrificed Boone Logan last year. I can just see the outrage if Getz (who has gone to Ozzie and volunteered to lead off) went into the tank...KW would get vilified even more.

Ramirez: better speed, better ability to make contact, bunt (although Josh did a nice job yesterday), not as selective at the plate...better ability to hit to the right side of the field (Josh has shown some signs here too), classic FB hitter Fields: higher OBP, decent speed, has to prove he has the bat speed (which is looking good so far) JOSH as #2 hitter in 2007=.230 .297 .500 .797 I don't think we can call a .297 OBP and .230 BA "raking," although his OBP was decent because of his SLG.

Bad defense cost the Tigers a lot last season. Now the Tigers have one of the best left-side infield defenses in baseball with Brandon Inge back at third base and Adam Everett aboard to play shortstop. The ever-trusty Placido Polanco plays second. And yet: One national publication acknowledged the Tigers might have the best defense in baseball -- but picked them to finish last in the AL Central. Another publication headlined its Tigers preview "Dee-fense! Dee-fense!" -- and picked them fourth. In 1991, the Atlanta Braves made the one-season vault from last to first. After they finished last in '90, they added three infielders, all tremendous defenders: third baseman Terry Pendleton, first baseman Sid Bream and shortstop Rafael Belliard, who's now the Tigers' infield coach. Here's the rest of the article... http://www.freep.com/article/20090406/SPOR...0377/0/SPORTS02 Everett is very good, but aging, certainly not a Gold Glover anymore and won't hit much over .200. Inge is OKAY at 3B, but he makes a ton of mental mistakes. Polanco is solid...so are Granderson and Laird. None of those guys are going to win the GG...I guess Granderson has a shot if he really puts up huge offensive numbers. And Guillen in LF and Ordonez in RF are both below average fielders. To compare them to the Rays or early 90's Braves is ridiculous. If Miguel Cabrera or Thames are anywhere near the field, that's even more of a problem for the Tigers. Let's just to be thankful they don't have Mr. Jair Jurrgens, Cameron Maybin and even Andrew Miller (if he ever gets his head screwed on straight). Happy News Press *International edition* Tigers outhit Jays at Rogres Centre ballprak TORONTO—Led by the “relief” efforts of Brandon “Heart Of A” Lyon, the Tigers came within one out of forcing the Toronto Blue Jays into extra innings on Tuesday night, Detroit’s most successful outing so far this season. As Edwin Jackson toiled on the mound inning after inning, a wave of nostalgia washed over Tiger fans as they witnessed a phenomenon unseen for many, many moons—pitching. Fortunately, skipper Jim Leyland yanked fans back to present reality by his deft handling of the bullpen, causing baseballs to ricochet wildly around the stadium until the Blue Jays got tired of running the bases and everyone went home. Adam Everett continued his lusty batting, nearly hitting the ball out of the infield at one point and keeping his average steady at .000. Blue Jays fans, the big babies that they are, were treated to milk and cookies by the "No-Beer Brigade of Canada," which sponsored the game.

I was watching ESPN Gameday when Gomez was up with 2 outs and nobody on. There was a 2.43% chance (according to ESPN Gameday) of MN scoring 2 runs or more. 40 to 1 chance of winning! No matter the ump'ing or pitching I like that comeback!!! from a Twins fan... Thought it was funny that everyone is complaining that beat writer LaVelle Neal at the Star Tribune is a "closet" White Sox fan, that the Twins won't win games like that next year (Span's infield chopper would have been a routine putout) in the new stadium AND that Carlos Gomez is now better than even Harrelson thinks he is because he was able to coax a walk in that situation. Actually prefer the idea of the White Sox "stalking" the Twins like the Twins stalked us all throughout the second half of the season last year...with us taking another one game playoff after the Twins have led for most of the year. By the way, it looks like Redmond will be DLed too. Maybe we can swap Lucy/Armstrong/Flowers for Delmon Young? Like that would ever happen!!! This first series against the Twins at home will be very interesting, these series are always about momentum and one team or the other usually sweeps or makes the other team look like a pretender temporarily. And least the Tigers are demonstrating that their bullpen acquisition Brandon Lyon is far from a sure thing. Will be a rough week in DET if the Tigers get off to another slow start after the MSU debacle. There will be a ton of pressure on young Mr. Porcello to come through.

WHITE SOX IN BRIEF: Ozzie being patient with Wise, but Getz looks up to the job Recommend Comments April 8, 2009 BY JOE COWLEY AND TONI GINNETTI [email protected] [email protected] The White Sox' leadoff role goes to Dewayne Wise -- for now. In manager Ozzie Guillen's mind, Chris Getz is ready if a change is necessary. ''I don't want to put [Wise] on the spot where he's like, 'Wow, I've got to do [something] right away or I'm out,''' Guillen said. ''I want to see how good his at-bats are, what kind of at-bats he's going to give us. RELATED STORIES SURPRISE, SURPRISE: SAME OLD WHITE SOX ''But Getz can lead off anytime easily. In the meantime, I don't want to just throw that kid in that situation.'' Wise went 0-for-4 with three strikeouts Tuesday and failed to get down a sacrifice bunt in the eighth inning with Josh Fields at first. That was corrected when Getz singled and Jim Thome homered. ''Your teammates pick you up,'' Wise said, adding he wasn't surprised by boos from the crowd. ''Fans want you to do good. You have a bad game, they'll boo. It's part of the game. ''I didn't have a good game, but we won. Tomorrow could be a better day, and the crowd will be back on my side.'' General manager Ken Williams called Wise ''a fighter'' who fits the mold of players he likes to nurture. But Williams admitted the job stayed in house because of the lack of prototypical leadoff men available in trade. ''The easiest thing in the world is to say you have to go out and get a leadoff hitter ... who can hit .300 and get on base, steal 50 bases,'' Williams said. ''But when people are pressed to say where are you going to get that guy, it's 'Don't worry -- you just go get him.' ''Rest assured we've been aggressive and tried to get those guys. That's no slap on Dewayne. It's not a matter of price. There is no price. [Teams] don't even want to talk about [trading] those guys.'' Better option? Not surprisingly, Sox general manager Kenny Williams said he has looked around for a more established leadoff man than Dewayne Wise. Williams said there are none to be found. "The easiest thing in the world is to say you have to go out and get a leadoff hitter, get the prototypical guy who can hit you .300 and get on base at .370, steal 50 bases," Williams said. "But when people are pressed to say where are you going to get that guy it's, 'Don't worry about it; you just go get him.' "I have to go back in the lab and create that guy. Rest assured, we have been looking for one, and aggressively. We've asked about them and tried to get them, and that's no slight on Dewayne. You can't create something that's not there, so you make do." Williams said the White Sox have no interest in two expensive leadoff hitters that are supposedly available - the Dodgers' Juan Pierre and the Angels' Gary Matthews Jr. "We weren't on those particular players at any price," Williams said. "I wouldn't say any price. It wasn't something we thought was a fit." dailyherald.com

WHITE SOX IN BRIEF: Ozzie being patient with Wise, but Getz looks up to the job Recommend Comments April 8, 2009 BY JOE COWLEY AND TONI GINNETTI [email protected] [email protected] The White Sox' leadoff role goes to Dewayne Wise -- for now. In manager Ozzie Guillen's mind, Chris Getz is ready if a change is necessary. ''I don't want to put [Wise] on the spot where he's like, 'Wow, I've got to do [something] right away or I'm out,''' Guillen said. ''I want to see how good his at-bats are, what kind of at-bats he's going to give us. RELATED STORIES SURPRISE, SURPRISE: SAME OLD WHITE SOX ''But Getz can lead off anytime easily. In the meantime, I don't want to just throw that kid in that situation.'' Wise went 0-for-4 with three strikeouts Tuesday and failed to get down a sacrifice bunt in the eighth inning with Josh Fields at first. That was corrected when Getz singled and Jim Thome homered. ''Your teammates pick you up,'' Wise said, adding he wasn't surprised by boos from the crowd. ''Fans want you to do good. You have a bad game, they'll boo. It's part of the game. ''I didn't have a good game, but we won. Tomorrow could be a better day, and the crowd will be back on my side.'' General manager Ken Williams called Wise ''a fighter'' who fits the mold of players he likes to nurture. But Williams admitted the job stayed in house because of the lack of prototypical leadoff men available in trade. ''The easiest thing in the world is to say you have to go out and get a leadoff hitter ... who can hit .300 and get on base, steal 50 bases,'' Williams said. ''But when people are pressed to say where are you going to get that guy, it's 'Don't worry -- you just go get him.' ''Rest assured we've been aggressive and tried to get those guys. That's no slap on Dewayne. It's not a matter of price. There is no price. [Teams] don't even want to talk about [trading] those guys.'' Better option? Not surprisingly, Sox general manager Kenny Williams said he has looked around for a more established leadoff man than Dewayne Wise. Williams said there are none to be found. "The easiest thing in the world is to say you have to go out and get a leadoff hitter, get the prototypical guy who can hit you .300 and get on base at .370, steal 50 bases," Williams said. "But when people are pressed to say where are you going to get that guy it's, 'Don't worry about it; you just go get him.' "I have to go back in the lab and create that guy. Rest assured, we have been looking for one, and aggressively. We've asked about them and tried to get them, and that's no slight on Dewayne. You can't create something that's not there, so you make do." Williams said the White Sox have no interest in two expensive leadoff hitters that are supposedly available - the Dodgers' Juan Pierre and the Angels' Gary Matthews Jr. "We weren't on those particular players at any price," Williams said. "I wouldn't say any price. It wasn't something we thought was a fit." from dailyherald.com

Well, one thing's for sure, they have a powerhouse down in AA. Guess we can pretty much skip even looking at the Charlotte results...all the action will be in AA and lower levels of the system. Assumption is Torres would be playing SS with Gookie Dawkins at 2B...although L. Nix will take his spot eventually.

Kenny Williams, Jr. can be our leadoff hitter, just like his dad!!! If he can subject Wise to all the booing, I wonder if he could do that to his own son?

I would rather bring in Edmonds and Pedro Martinez than trade for Dukes.

While we're at it, bring back Albert Belle and Wilfredo Cordero. No thanks on Dukes...unless we get restraining orders to protect all ticket buyers from Elijah on Family Fun Day.

Ryan Sweeney would actually be perfect for the #2 spot, but he's not really a true leadoff hitter or CFer either, not on a really good team.

3 years/$30M (2008-10) signed extension 8/7/07 $2M signing bonus (paid in 2 installments in 2008) 08:$6M, 09:$11M, 10:$11M no-trade protection No, no and no on that idea...if we're going to do that, we might as well just bring back Aaron Rowand. KW HAS to give Anderson one last chance to play everyday b4 making that kind of a desperation move. And Eric is ALWAYS hurt seemingly.

QUOTE (WilliamTell @ Apr 7, 2009 -> 09:23 PM) Yeah I see your point for sure. But at the same time, if they're very close to the division lead, or have the division lead by the time Mauer comes back, it's going to be hard to beat them. That's why it's horrible seeing the Mariners gift wrap this game and send it in the mail for the Twins. Well, the Cubs lost. It's a sign of our fandom we're more upset when the Indians or Twins escape with a victory...a positive evolution. I really don't expect for the White Sox to win this division unless everything goes exactly right and nobody gets injured. In some ways, 2009 is just like the 2008 season was for the Twins. We're in that transition year from some of the veterans to Beckham, Viciedo and Allen and possibly Flowers. The first phase is Fields and Getz paired with CQ and Alisay...KW has to turn over this roster for obvious reasons which stood out like a sore thumb today. OTOH, the biggest concern is replacing the back of our rotation...starting 2010 with the likes of Richard/Poreda/Marquez doesn't bode well for competing next year unless someone really emerges or we can make another trade acquisition or FA move. At least we'll have the payroll flexibility if we have a competitive season this year and don't go below 2,000,000 in attendance. I just don't like how JR is already talking about losing sponsors for next season and having to cut back again. Which is why it's so critical we're in the race for most of the season.

Is Dickerson in the rotation over in Cincy? I know they have Taveras and Darnell McDonald (their version of Wise) in CF...and Jay Bruce in RF. Hairston in LF?