BlackSox13

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 09:17 PM) there is no scenario where this is true. The teams trading for Q want to make the playoffs. Sale is better than Q. sale has a better chance of getting the team to the playoffs and WS. The Sox will not get the same talent in return for Q that they did for Sale. Looking at the month of September over the last two seasons, in '16 ERA 4.35 , in '15 ERA 4.34. Sale has been fading down the stretch which doesn't bode well heading into the playoffs. This is one of the reasons I had preferred to keep Q over Sale. I don't mean to kick anyone's puppy but if Sale continues fading in September, he may end up pitching more like David Price in the playoffs.

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 08:23 PM) Barring a surprise Abreu trade, I think I'm gonna miss Q more than anyone else dealt this offseason. I thought the Sale trade was pretty bad, but at least I had come around to letting go of Sale. Same goes for Eaton, and the return in that trade really washed away any tears about his departure. But there is a workmanlike quality to Quintana that will not be easy to replicate with the kind of production Q has provided. He's gotta go, it's what is best long term, but in my heart of hearts I'd rather keep him. I'm with ya. Going into the off season I think there was a thread about which pitcher fans would prefer to trade/keep. My choice was trade Sale and keep Q. I like Q's consistency, durability and I like how he quietly goes about his business. He and Abreu both are the quiet leader types. Honestly, if the pitching market wasn't so bare I'd rather keep Q but if a team is willing to meet Hahn's high price then go for it. If Q ends up staying with the Sox I sure as hell won't complain.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 06:45 PM) Heyman on MLBN: Q to Pittsburgh Longshot Q to Yankees not serious Thinks he winds up in Houston Well, yesterday's discussions were about the Yanks, today about Pitt so should we expect an Astros rumor/tweet sometime tomorrow morning? That would bring us back full circle.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 07:51 PM) Q's curveball at :58 is so beautiful. The one that buckled big Papi for a called strike three? Nasty!

QUOTE (bighurt574 @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 07:36 PM) Unless the Sox are flat out lying, they've made pretty clear they'll be giving these guys plenty of time to develop in the minors. And if this wasn't a rebuild, they would have seemingly been more active on the free agent market. Agreed. Hahn has said plenty of times these guys are likely starting the season in the minors and will not be rushed which makes sense when looking at the Sox roster as of now. There's only a small market for Frazier/ Robertson and literally none for Melky/Lowrie so we likely start the season with them and look to move Frazier/Robertson in July and hope that Melky/Lowrie can play well enough to get something in return. There's no need to trade Q if teams won't pay and with four years of control left he will have plenty of value at the deadline and next winter. None the less I still think a team will blink and trade for Q. As for Abreu, I don't think the Sox are too interested in trading Abreu and probably prefer to keep him around to mentor Moncada when he's ready for a call up which IMO is the right move unless a team offers a big overpay. Another point is a team does not trade it's best pitcher and overall hitter for prospects that very from A to 3A experience if they are not rebuilding. This is a different and better strategy than what the Sox have used in recent years with the "rebuilding on the fly" and " retooling" routes previously taken. I've taken my fair share of shots at JR but I give him credit for going ahead and rebuilding. Never thought he would do it at 80 years old but he's proved me wrong.

The tone of this article sounds all too familiar. As a Sox fan I've had that feeling once or twice. http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/sean-ge...es/201612210195 It's easy to see why Pirates fans are more sensible in what they would be willing to give up for Q and that they recognize how good Q really is.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 02:23 PM) This is coming to a head IMO. I honestly expect it to happen sooner than later. Same here. It's very interesting that Pitt had an article about Q on their MLB site. Could be a slow leak while med reports are exchanged?

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 12:16 PM) Now is probably a great time to trade him then. QFT

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 12:05 PM) I've always thought the Pirates made sense. Before the rebuild became official, I was afraid of a Cutch-Q trade (considering Williams, and by association, Hahn, seem to look at statistics from at least 2 years prior, when they make trades for veteran players). They have the prospects. And they want to contend. The Pirates want to dump players before their contract runs out; they will look to dump Cole next year, and Q is the perfect replacement. The Pirates also draft well, so they are probably reasonably confident in their ability to regenerate more prospects. And unless they sell-off goes perfectly, which it won't, the Sox will have to create some of their own elite prospects to build this thing back up. That, coupled with their ongoing inability to evaluate veterans (which they will have to do when building back up) is the big risk in this Sox rebuild. Garrit Cole is just about to enter his first year of arbitration and won't become a FA until the after the '19 season is over.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 09:23 AM) Cy Acosta, where are ya buddy? There is finally a legit rumor involving the Pirates. biggrin.gif How about Meadows (#9), Newman (#42), Keller (#72) and Diaz? Gives the Sox a return of two top 50's, a top 100 and a catcher that profiles to at least be a backup MLB C with good defensive skills and strong arm. Meadows + Newman + Keller + Diaz would be a nice haul for Quintana How dare you plagiarise my post!

QUOTE (CyAcosta41 @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 09:18 AM) Right here, man! Like most of us -- watching, with great interest. It ain't over 'til it's over, but, yeah, for the longest time I've been thinking the Pirates would be a serious contender for either Sale or Q (most likely Q) since it became obvious the Sox were going to auction off their prime assets. Baseball is just like most businesses, heck, like most relationships. "Need" trump "like." Every single team with any reasonable chance of contending would "like" a Sale or a Q. Not only for their talent, but also for the contract attached to the talent. But a team like the Pirates truly "need" this kind of asset because they can never win a FA bidding war against the big boys. Push come to shove, I always suspected the Pirates would likely step-up and, in the end, would be willing to pay MORE out of the warchest from which they could actually compete -- young talent. Take a team that needs to pay more like the Pirates, factor in that their available currency (young talent) is what they have in significant quantities and is exactly what the Sox need out of this "auction," and then add that the centerpiece of any likely trade -- Meadows -- is exactly the kind of everday stud OF'er the Sox need ... well, they always seemed to be a super-likely trade partner to me. Good grief i wish you woukd post more often. I REALLY enjoy your insights my man! Yep, as I recall you were the first to mention the Pirates and that was weeks ago. Heck, at the time I questioned it because it's just not like the Pirates to give a haul for a player but according to the latest rumor that could change. Who knows, maybe the Pirates go for it since Q has had success against their division rival cubs.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 08:33 AM) I would imagine that acquiring Quintana and moving McCutchen are mutually exclusive. If the former occurs, it's because they've moved away from the latter. From the sense I'm getting from the blog/chat/tweet universe, it sounds like the industry is souring a bit on Glasnow. Seems like it now looks that he may not be able to develop enough command to stock as a starter. I noticed Glasnow walked a ton of hitters last year so I guess it would come down to how the Sox feel about Glasnow and if there's anything they can do to help his control issues. I prefer something along the lines of Meadows, Newman, Keller and Diaz. What do ya think, too much, not enough or am I just crazy?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 08:24 AM) The Pirates need pitching and are not going to trade Glasnow. If they're actually going for it, which a Quintana move would suggest, they'll most likely hold onto Cutch and use Meadows as a headliner. I agree and would prefer a package that brings back more hitting than pitching but trading for Q would make it easier for the Pirates to part with Glasnow. That's just an uneducated guess on my part though. I'm hoping that if a deal is struck with the Pirates that one of Meadows/Bell is the headliner with Newman as the secondary piece. After that, not sure what to ask for.

Starting to think these cash trades have been about opening up space in the minors for the next haul the Sox bring in.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 07:58 AM) I'm saying our hypotheticals have been over each time. It's unlikely we get three top 100 prospects when one of those is a near ready top ten. Ah, OK, I follow ya now. Still waiting for my coffee to wake my brain up. I wonder if Meadows is a potential sticking point. From what I've read the Pirates are counting on Meadows to be McCutchen's replacement if they find a suitor for Cutch. Also sounds as though the Pirates do not want to part with Bell so if that's the case then Glasnow has to be the headliner or the Pirates are SOL. Glasnow is the type of pitcher that would make the Sox FO drool over.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 21, 2016 -> 07:23 AM) There's no need for Keller, our other deals have not included a third top 100 guy. No need for a strike thrower with the potential of being a ground ball machine?

Cy Acosta, where are ya buddy? There is finally a legit rumor involving the Pirates. How about Meadows (#9), Newman (#42), Keller (#72) and Diaz? Gives the Sox a return of two top 50's, a top 100 and a catcher that profiles to at least be a backup MLB C with good defensive skills and strong arm.

Well good morning Wednesday! This is interesting to say the least.

Quick question for Quinarvy. What are you thoughts on Yankees prospects Clint Frazier and Dustin Fowler. Been looking at both and to be honest I kinda prefer Fowler over Frazier. I'm guessing Fowler jumps into the top 100 when it comes out. Think I just like Fowler's overall tools better.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 08:06 PM) But why would the Yankees trade Frazier when they need him in 2017? Also, if Benintendi was "untouchable," it's hard to imagine turning down him and Kopech for Q (and NOT getting him for Sale)...that doesn't make any sense, because that makes it seem as if the entire deal hinged on Basabe being included as the 3rd piece AND the choice between Benintendi vs. Moncada (ceiling/floor). Frazier could use more time at AAA and the Yanks have Ellsbury, Gardner, Hicks and Holliday in their outfield so at this point there's no room for Frazier.

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 06:33 PM) And what I'm saying is that if the choice is between a big power, high K guy or a guy who makes better contact, has very good plate discipline, but doesn't have good power, I'd prefer to see the Sox gravitate toward the latter player. The entire point in the discussion between bmags and I was how we can see why some Sox fans would be interested in a power bat like Judge because the Sox have been devoid of power despite playing in a HR friendly ballpark. That's it, nothing more. Feel free to read the last few pages.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 06:36 PM) Sports mockery is reporting the white sox asked for severing, Mateo and Frazier for Quintana. I highly doubt that was their request Ya, that sounds more like a guess by sports mockery. Unless for some reason the Sox see something in Severino they can fix/tweek. Sports mockery should be shut down for spewing fake news, lol.

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 05:56 PM) I would rather see the Sox target players they are more likely to succeed in developing than keep hitting their head into the brick wall of failure with these high K power guys. As I said in my post you quoted, there's not enough of those high OBP/power players to go around so if power is the desire then sometimes we have to take the strike outs that come with that power.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 03:15 PM) There's a weird piling on of judge right now. I don't necessarily want him in a Q deal, but sometimes players do need time to develop. He dramatically improved between years 1 and 2 in AAA as you'd like to see. He strikes out, but he was still k'ing at under 30% in AAA and walking at a nice 12% clip. In his abysmal, small sample size, he still walked 10% of the time. QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 03:33 PM) 25 is relatively old for a prospect. As a third piece to a Quintana deal he is worth a gamble, but not as the first or second piece I agree but my post was in response to the quoted post above highlighted in bold. I don't recall anyone saying they wanted Judge as a first or second piece, but I could be wrong.

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Dec 20, 2016 -> 04:09 PM) The answer was right in front of (technically above) you(r post). And every team in the league would love to fill their rosters with those types of players but the problem is there aren't enough high OBP power hitters that don't strike out alot to go round. Next best option is the Todd Frazier types where strike outs come with their power potential. As bad as the Sox offense was last year imagine how much worse they would have been without Frazier's 40 hr and 98 RBI. I don't deny past failures in the development of power hitters but I would rather see the Sox keep trying than give up.