BlackSox13

It's been so boring I decided to make a thread about it, so shoot me. And Sox fans think they have it bad with LaRoche. Yep, things could be worse. Thankfully the Sox only have one horrible contract for one more year.. http://m.braves.mlb.com/news/article/16041...n-braves-future "Though Swisher and Bourn are positioned to serve as backup options for the projected starting outfielders (Olivera, Inciarte and Markakis), the Braves are trying to trade at least one of them with the understanding the team would have to eat a significant portion of the salary."

Sources have said that up to this point, the Sox have not signed a free agent outfielder. These are the same sources that were correct in past predictions when they were the first to claim that the sky is blue on a sunny day and that grass truely is green. All of this is earth shattering news and shall forever change your existence. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it, L Ron Hubbard!

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 06:34 PM) I didn't expect anything this weekend (rumor wise). I hear ya. I didn't expect any signings but did think there would be something new to discuss, even the off-kiltered tweet. The Upton rumors are so eerily quiet it makes a library sound like a heavy metal concert venue.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 06:32 PM) Constipated market, there is. Seriously constipated. An endless game of Circle Jerk with the Butthole Surfers playing pop goes the weezle, except it never pops! Just caught in a timeless/endless loop... No kiss kiss, no bang bang! Sigh...

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 06:14 PM) Maybe a new sexual innuendo has been born... Aka: Give her a Gordon in the two hole. Hmm, could be. Ventura: " think I'll put Gordon's bat in the chili hole.". Also, corn hole can be used for an ethanol-like flavor. Chili-cornqueso wrapped tube-steak, perhaps? I'm so fricked baseball bored, like, Napoleon Dynamite bored! GAWD! Ya, its that bad... There are exactly zero new rumors today as far as the free agent outfielders are concerned. Hell, not even OF trade rumors either but that's likely due to the lack of FA movement.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 06:04 PM) Abreu and Cespe 3/4 sure sounds sexy but so does Gordon in the two hole. The chili hole?

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 05:50 PM) I just hope we strike first. Yes and hopefully for one of Cespedes/Upton or another trade involving B level prospects or less. This market has to be somewhat confusing to GM's since they have so many quality options available to them.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 05:27 PM) I feel like these guys are getting close to signing. I'd be shocked if they didn't sign this week I agree and once the first outfielder signs the rest will be in rapid succession one after another. The pressure is building.

QUOTE (striker @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:00 AM) I don't know why everyone sells Desmond so short. His down year was Cespedes's average year before 2015. He plays a premium position and could move to 3b, 2b, or the OF later. His OPS has need sliding downward for three straight years, comp pick attached, Frazier at 3B and Lawrie at 2B for the next two years, the Sox outfield is already crowded while they seek to sign a free agent outfielder and the Sox do not want to block the SS position from Tim Anderson. There's just too many reasons as to why the Sox should not bother with Desmond.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:41 PM) Ah 32 year old free agent. Just like McCutchen who I believe is in that same class. That class is loaded. Yep, as long as McCutchen's '18 option is picked up he will be there with Jones. The winter of 18/'19 is going to be soooo interesting to follow.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:38 PM) Depends. They may have a current 1B that can move to a corner OF. It's more about the money than the position. RF and 1B aren't always interchangeable but they may be. I see what you're saying but I guess I just don't see Davis as a realistic option for RF especially having poor defense with a weak arm. Guess I should be hoping Baltimore does sign Davis, huh. Honestly I don't see why Baltimore is wasting their time on Davis although they have pulled their offer. Leads me to think they absolutely end up with one of the big three. I think Boras and Davis made a huge mistake in rejecting that 7/150M+ offer. If I was Baltimore, I'd take that money and sign Alvarez along with one of the big three. Maybe that's their plan?

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:18 PM) How long is Adam Jones signed for? If I was an O's fan I wouldn't want money tied into someone like Davis and would rather re-sign Jones when the time comes. Jones is signed through the '18 season. 2016 30 Baltimore Orioles $16,333,333 8.139 2017 31 Baltimore Orioles $16,333,333 2018 32 Baltimore Orioles $17,333,333 http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...shtml#contracts

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:07 PM) But if Baltimore signs Davis, then they're likely out of the running for the Big 3, and they're one of the few teams that seem to actually have the money available to offer a big contract to them. Good call, somehow I forgot about the Orioles since they seem somewhat fixated on Davis and have been linked more to 2nd tier free agent outfielders. If they decide to move on from Davis they likely do sign one of Upton/Cespedes/Gordon.

QUOTE (bschmaranz @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 12:16 PM) He does have time in the outfield as late as last season (30 games in right). Davis is knocked for his poor base running and defense at 1B so is he really an outfield option? QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 12:47 PM) Sure it does. The team that signs him most likely will not sign another big FA deal and takes away a competitor for their services. Thus drives the market down. But the team that signs Davis was not really in the market for an outfielder in the first place considering Davis is a 1B/DH which correlates with my response above.

Not in the least bit concerned with the tigers going after one of Cespedes/Upton/Gordon and its likely if they are in talks its to help drive the price up on the Sox. I think it's more likely the Tigers are looking at the 2Nd tier of outfield free agents like Parra, Fowler, Jackson and Span, if they are even seriously in the market for an outfielder. As for Davis. He's a 1B/DH and has nothing to do with FA outfielders not signing. There are more outfielders available through the FA and trade markets than there are teams looking for outfielders which is why its such a buyers market. Plus, the big spenders like NYY, Boston, Dodgers and cubs are out of the picture. This is why the free agents are slow to sign and interested teams are offering lower than the free agent's expectations. It's a buyers market for outfielders.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:10 AM) I am saying if the Sox go to camp RV, Hahn and Dan Hayes are saying that Saladino/Sanchez are battling it out in a SS competeition that it's Saladino's job. Saying Sanchez/Saladino are in a competition is a formality of rhetoric. Makes sense. Goes in line with when the SS position is mentioned, Hahn refers to Saladino first and foremost. IIRC the FO was pretty high on Saladino before he went down for TJ surgery and the FO was pretty bummed about it.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 10:35 AM) You are my sunshine, my only sunshine. You make me happy - in times of grey. Dude, you are my inspiration for hero worship!

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 10:32 AM) It's not a bad stance by the sox because no one is offering big money long term deals. If a team did the player would have signed. If the sox offer more aav in a 3 year deal it may make it attractive to the player. This type of deal is better for the team than the opt out deal as they are not stuck with a poorly performing player. I really do like the stance if what Nightengale says is true which in the case of Gordon I believe it is but not with Cespedes as I think the Sox would be willing to go further with Cespedes, just my humble opinion. If no team has offered more than three years yet then I think it's smart for the Sox to not be the first to do so. I think the Sox are deep enough in negotiations to the point where if a team offered Cespedes an additional year or two, his agent would come back to the Sox for a counter offer before signing. I also like the idea of offering a higher AAV for less years and agree it could help entice the player to take the three year deal. This could be what the Sox are trying to do. For Cespedes, I like the idea of either offering a higher AAV or offering a fourth and possible fifth year mutual options with buy outs. For Upton, given his age the opt-out idea would probably make more sense from his perspective but then again, there is so little info on what Upton is seeking I really have no clue what to think or speculate on. He and his agent have been very tight lipped.

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 10:08 AM) Good post I agree with a lot of what you are saying. Especially about Gordon, I don't really want him on much more than a three year deal. But one thing I differ on is the fallback OFs available. I want one of the big three or none. No one else really makes me excited. I would like Fowler but he costs a pick. I would be okay with Span but who knows how he bounces back after injury and he's a Boras guy. Finally I really don't want to trade any more prospects to acquire someone from CoL. One player I'd be more than happy to trade for and I have said so for a year is Puig. Look at how the Yankees stole Chapman for basically nada. If we could get him relatively cheap id be happy. But in the end one of the big three is the most logical route to getting better quickly There's alot of outfielders on the trade market so the trade costs should be reasonable. Doesn't sound like the Dodgers will move Puig with the DV lingering over his head and coming off of a down season, the Dodgers would be selling quite low which doesn't sound like a typical Dodger move. As for the FA outfielders. Outside of Cespedes and Upton, the only one I would be interested in would be Parra and I'm straddling the fence big time with him. I have no interest in the rest of the the free agents. QUOTE (soxfan85 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 10:09 AM) I am trying to be as optimistic as I can This whole process is not over yet. However, I just get fed up with their whole "Holier than thou" attitude. They act like they are kings of the baseball world with this type of attitude, and that they can get anybody they want on their terms. However, what have we proven? We hardly ever win anything, and the biggest contract we have ever given out was Abreu at $68M. The behavior of the FO is just bizarre. Two things to remember. 1) its all part of negotiations. 2) Nightengale is the only one saying the Sox are not willing to go more than three years.

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:41 AM) It was stated that none of the three would want to do this because then the opt out kicks in for 2018 and that FA class is loaded. Which kinda of makes it stupid for us to offer 3 years knowing that these guys will be old and entering a crowded market and what could be arguably the best FA class in the history of the MLB. Personally I think four years gets it done with Gordon or Cespedes but I don't think JR is comfortable with that. My confidence level of us landing one of these guys is starting to decrease. I think if we are firm on three years it allows another team to jump in to steal one of these guys and shake the market up. With regards to Cespedes, I'm talking mutual options and not opt-out. Something similar to the Sale and Quintana- contracts that have two years of mutual options at the end of the guaranteed contract. I agree that four years gets it done with Cespedes and I think the Sox are actually willing to go four years. It's just posturing by the Sox and part of the negotiating process. Garfien did say that up to this point no team has offered more than three years and I believe what he says in this particular case. In the end some team will offer four years, possibly five if enough teams are genuinely interested in Cespedes. As for Gordon. IMHO, the Sox would be stupid to go more than three years and I think the Sox are doing the right thing by not offering more. There's just too many outfield options available for the Sox to give it up like a desperate prom date. I have no doubt the Sox will address the outfield need although it may end up not being what fans have their sights set on. I remain open minded and willing to sit back and enjoy the off season ride.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:28 AM) Here we go... Says it sounds like it's 3yrs or nothing instead of a 5 year opt out after 3 for the White Sox. I don't buy this info at all. Hasn't said anything informative at all which is what we all thought. I can believe the Sox not willing to go more than three years on Gordon due to his age but I think it's posturing with regards to Cespedes. Could be as simple as Cespedes has come down to seeking five years, the Sox offer three and in the end they meet in the middle on a four year deal. Maybe offer Cespedes three years with two additional years of mutual options?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 08:46 AM) What have the White Sox publicly announced as their 2016 payroll budget? I read somewhere a month or so ago that Hahn had the '15 payroll budget to work with. Right now, if we take committed salaries+speculated arbitration salaries +league minimum salaries to fill out the roster it adds up to about 119M at the moment. So we're already at the '15 payroll. I think it's a situation which JR bumps the payroll up for the right player or the Sox would not be rumored so heavily to be involved in the FA rumors.

Well, nothing new as of 8:30am. No surprise since its early morning.

QUOTE (SoCalSox @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 09:18 PM) I think it's posturing for sure, I just don't know why the Sox would have done that. Garfien seems to think they could have done this as well, too. I guess what it does confirm, yet again, is that they are right in the mix for one of these guys. Cespedes said when the off season began that he wanted 6 years. If what Garfien says is true, I believe him, then Cespedes only being offered 3 years sounds more like a ploy from his agent in an effort to get more teams into the mix to up the ante in years. Makes some sense since there's so many outfielders available and the usual big spenders like the Yanks, Boston, Dodgers and cubs are out of it. Sounds as though the FA outfielders asking prices have had no choice but to come down. Interesting things going on right now.

QUOTE (SoCalSox @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 09:10 PM) Max Wildstein is a buddy of mine & just told me that he spoke w/ a source that told him Nightengale's tweet was pure posturing on the White Sox's part. Take it FWIW but he went out of his way to tell me about it. Thanks for the heads up. Many of us suspected that's what was going on.