3 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

And all because of one individual.

Rick Hahn, of course

27 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Rick Hahn, of course

Jeremy Haber lol.

Look no further than who really runs the Bulls.

Everyone else just a scapegoat for the real culprit.

Edited Tuesday at 11:01 PM4 days by caulfield12

55 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Maintaining the worst ownership, front offices, and coaching staffs in two sports for decades is impressive.

Edited Wednesday at 04:14 AM4 days by WhiteSox2023

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Maintaining the worst ownership, front offices, and coaching staffs in two sports for decades is impressive.

As a much bigger Sox fan than I am a Bulls fan, I'm just thankful that it's not the White Sox that the Reinsdorfs want to keep in the family.

Doe anybody believe the White Sox have lost money the last 6 years? I'll believe it when JR opens the financial books to the public, which he won't do.

9 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Doe anybody believe the White Sox have lost money the last 6 years? I'll believe it when JR opens the financial books to the public, which he won't do.

If you can explain to me how the White Sox would have taken on a newer ownership investment to pay off operations debt without accruing any operations debt, I will listen. Until then, yes I believe it, considering Ishbia was brought in early to pay off the money the Sox have spent the last 6 years losing.

12 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

If you can explain to me how the White Sox would have taken on a newer ownership investment to pay off operations debt without accruing any operations debt, I will listen. Until then, yes I believe it, considering Ishbia was brought in early to pay off the money the Sox have spent the last 6 years losing.

And chose over a team already laden with $450/500 million debt that he believed was being over valued by the Pohlads...and with no opportunity to build a new stadium.

Also, not his adopted hometown.

1 hour ago, WBWSF said:

Doe anybody believe the White Sox have lost money the last 6 years? I'll believe it when JR opens the financial books to the public, which he won't do.

As the Forbes article points out, the Sox rank 30th in terms of revenue generated and well below the 29th team. They're bringing in significantly less money than the Marlins, Rays, and homeless A's. Think about that for a second, teams like the Marlins and A's are bringing in more money than the White Sox. As a fan worried about the future viability of this franchise, I find that very disturbing

It's not hard to believe they lost money this decade with Covid and trying to start up a new RSN that carries 3 crappy teams, but where would they bring in the money to pay down that debt? Attendance is near the bottom of the league, TV revenue is down, I can only imagine sponsorship revenue has cratered, they don't get the revenue sharing that small market teams do.

The economics of baseball have changed. There was a time when it was profitable for JR to play in a stadium where he paid little to no rent and got to keep the parking revenue. That's no longer the case. Teams that are making enough money to have huge payrolls are doing so through developments around their ballparks like The Battery or Gallagher Way, high attendance, and the teams with massive fan bases can still bring in a lot of money through their TV deals.

Edited Wednesday at 03:51 PM3 days by 77 Hitmen

5 minutes ago, 77 Hitmen said:

As the Forbes article points out, the Sox rank 30th in terms of revenue generated and well below the 29th team. They're bringing in significantly less money than the Marlins, Rays, and homeless A's. Think about that for a second, teams like the Marlins and A's are bringing in more money than the White Sox. As a fan worried about the future viability of this franchise, I find that very disturbing

It's not hard to believe they lost money this decade with Covid and trying to start up a new RSN that carries 3 crappy teams, but where would they bring in the money to pay down that debt? Attendance is near the bottom of the league, TV revenue is down, I can only imagine sponsorship revenue has cratered, they don't get the revenue sharing that small market teams do.

The economics of baseball have changed. There was a time when it was profitable for JR to play in a stadium where he paid little to no rent and got to keep the parking revenue. That's no longer the case. Teams that are making enough money to have huge payrolls are doing so through developments around their ballparks like The Battery or Gallagher Way, high attendance, and the teams with massive fan bases can still bring in a lot of money through their TV deals.

Honestly, it was one disaster after another.

-COVID

-The collapse of the local TV revenue machine right as their deal was running out

-TLR and the complete collapse of the franchise just as everyone was getting expensive.

-The worst season in the history of MLB.

I mean look at the park on a daily basis. There is zero energy. Their TV deal is a fraction of what it was, no one is going to games, their advertising eyes are down. Keep going.

Again, you may not WANT to believe it. I didn't really believe it until they brought in a guy to pay off their debts. Seeing as they don't own their park, nor the mortgage on it, why would they have have debt if they weren't losing money? Until someone can explain that to me, I will assume that the franchise that studies the franchise of the biggest companies on the planet for a business can handle a professional baseball team's numbers.

For what this is worth I was told by an individual in the front office that a lot of the financial issues were caused by the banks refusing to loan JR any more money.

As I was told JR was borrowing from banks who were happy to loan it to him because they assumed that when the team was sold they'd get their money back plus interest.

But given JR's reluctance to sell and the on and off the field issues they stopped doing so. That put him in a real bind and he had to go outside the organization and bring in Ishbia.

I wasn't told specific numbers so I can't tell you how much or if JR was losing money only that he like many owners was borrowing money but that was stopped.

1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said:

For what this is worth I was told by an individual in the front office that a lot of the financial issues were caused by the banks refusing to loan JR any more money.

As I was told JR was borrowing from banks who were happy to loan it to him because they assumed that when the team was sold they'd get their money back plus interest.

But given JR's reluctance to sell and the on and off the field issues they stopped doing so. That put him in a real bind and he had to go outside the organization and bring in Ishbia.

I wasn't told specific numbers so I can't tell you how much or if JR was losing money only that he like many owners was borrowing money but that was stopped.

MLB also has a limited fund for low interest loans to teams but usually not over $100 million.

SI

Enjoy the Final Season of Baseball As We Know It

The 2026 MLB season will likely be the last of its era, as several converging factors could turn the sport on its head by this time next year.

11 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

Honestly, it was one disaster after another.

-COVID

-The collapse of the local TV revenue machine right as their deal was running out

-TLR and the complete collapse of the franchise just as everyone was getting expensive.

-The worst season in the history of MLB.

I mean look at the park on a daily basis. There is zero energy. Their TV deal is a fraction of what it was, no one is going to games, their advertising eyes are down. Keep going.

Again, you may not WANT to believe it. I didn't really believe it until they brought in a guy to pay off their debts. Seeing as they don't own their park, nor the mortgage on it, why would they have have debt if they weren't losing money? Until someone can explain that to me, I will assume that the franchise that studies the franchise of the biggest companies on the planet for a business can handle a professional baseball team's numbers.

Yes, it was a perfect storm of financial hits. Many of this problems were self-inflicted but others (Covid, the collapse of the RSN gravy train) were out of their control. The team completed a rebuild just in time for attendance to be shutdown and then restricted due to Covid and then when things got back to normal, the rebuild utterly collapsed. The timing of if all couldn't have been any worse.

The fact that Jerry was able to lock in Ishbia as the next team owner before he went ahead and bought the Twins might turn out to be one of the best moves he's made for the Sox franchise in at least a couple of decades. The Ishbia brothers have the liquidity that JR doesn't and they can do things like pay off that debt, bankroll a new ballpark, and get this franchise out of its death spiral. It's too bad this might have to drag out another 8 years, but better late than never. At least it doesn't look like Ishbia will be totally sitting on the sidelines for the next 3-8 years as shown by his intent to buy that Amtrak yard across the river from the 78.

Edited Thursday at 04:12 AM3 days by 77 Hitmen

https://www.si.com/mlb/guardians/onsi/news/how-the-cleveland-guardians-can-replicate-the-success-of-the-1980-s-and-1990-s-01km1p0swmhg&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwiwv9H72uCTAxVLPUQIHf86EGIQFnoECAYQAg&usg=AOvVaw3oI5TClz09w3CcmAJRya3G

"If anything, this year, the group of young, talented players that make up the minor league system has a chance to set the organization up for future success. Whether it's starting arms that have a chance to anchor the back of the rotation or prospective bats that are looking to be game-changing, Cleveland's young core will be what makes or breaks the upcoming season.

"After targeting hit-over-power types in the Draft and on the international market for several years, Cleveland has assembled perhaps its best collection of power prospects since Albert Belle, Brian Giles, Manny Ramirez, Richie Sexson and Jim Thome were percolating through the system in the late 1980s and early 1990s," wrote MLB Draft and prospect writer Jim Callis.

Comparing Cleveland's current makeup to the generation that helped put The Land on the map says a lot about how Callis views the organization today."

Edited Thursday at 11:57 AM2 days by caulfield12

MLB Wins 2011-2025

1. LAD 1390

2. NYY 1320

3. StL 1258

4. CLE 1249*

5. TB 1246*

6. ATL 1245

7. MIL 1239*

8. BOS 1225

9. HOU 1208

10. SFG 1186

11. TOR 1181

12. CUBS 1179

13. PHA 1168

14. SEA 1167

15. NYM 1165

16. WSH 1164

17. TEX 1152

18. OAK 1135*

19. AZ 1132

20. LAA 1126

21. SD 1119*

22. DET 1118*

23. BAL 1116*

24. CIN 1102*

25. PIT 1100*

26. MIN 1097*

27. KCR 1080* Getz Team 1

28. CHW 1030 Getz Team 2

29. MIA 1026*

30. COL 1000

Edited Thursday at 03:13 PM2 days by caulfield12

CHW 1030

Miami 1027

LET’S extend from 2011-2026...

Imagine that the owners were motivated enough to offer a “grand bargain” for a salary cap and floor system. MLB (Luxury Tax) salaries across the 30 teams will be $6.087 billion with average spend of $202.9 million. Any proposal is likely to have to guarantee an increase in total spend, in other words the players as a group will likely need a meaningful raise in order to give up what they consider their crown jewel. Of course, an increase in MLB payroll is only one component of a grand bargain, other components might involve changes to team control of players, roster sizes, minor league compensation, MLB and MiLB minimum salary. — Jay O.

The owners clearly would like to be able to implement a salary floor and cap with the idea of offering players more of a share of the revenues to get an infrastructure in place like the other major sports leagues (NBA, NHL and NFL). This would include a significant increase in floors for small-market teams and a significant raise for the minimum salaries.

Jom Bowden The Athletic

White Sox only need to spend about $115 million to get to an average mlb payroll level lol.

At least the Marlins Pirates and Rockies realize getting off to decent April starts is pretty important...while the White Sox obsess over service time while losing sight of the forest for the trees.

“I think belief is really important for any team, whether you're young or experienced,” said Rockies president of baseball operations Paul DePodesta. “Whenever you get off to a good start, it's easier for guys to believe not only themselves, but also in each other and their ability to be competitive day in and day out.”

Colorado’s three-game sweep of the Astros this week evened its record at 6-6 before the club suffered a walk-off loss to the Padres on Thursday night. After losing three straight one-run games to the Marlins to open the year, the Rockies went 6-3 in their next nine games.

“I think they are starting to see what's possible,” DePodesta said. “We've already faced some adversity and we've been able to bounce back from it and be successful. Those types of experiences relatively early in the season can be helpful." mlb.com

Edited Friday at 04:25 PM1 day by caulfield12