Sox might have resigned Freddy

[ZoomSlowik]

The Yankees are not going to offer a huge deal to Maggs. They have a lot of money committed to Matsui and Sheffield, and are going to invest a lot of money in getting another starting pitcher or a second basemen. The Dodgers are more likely going to cut payroll. They have a $95 million payroll and not a lot to show for it. While they do need offense, I find it hard to believe that they would let Perez go considering they already unloaded Brown. The Pardres are a possibility, but they are spending good money on Giles, Nevin, and Klesko, and are likely to call up Nady if they don't trade him. They would also likely be trying to lure a starter, and I'm not sure they are going to push past $80 in payroll that fast. Baltimore already gave backloaded deals to Tejada and Lopez, and are desperately seeking pitching. I forgot Boston as a possibility, assuming they lose Nomar, but they will also be trying to either resign or replace Pedro and Lowe. Overall, there don't look to be a large number of huge spenders, and there are numerous good players out there. Most of the teams seem more likely to add a stud pitcher than a hitter. I doubt Maggs will be offered much more than Tejada was, who is also younger and plays at a premium position. That would make the Sox offer much more appealing. Why risk it if the money is already on the table?

[Goober]

Garcia is much younger, much healthier, is having every bit as good a year as Unit

what? johnson's numbers are way better. and he also threw a perfect game

[Wedge]

No trade clause whatever, if Yankees are rumored to be the front-runners in the Randy Johnson sweepstakes, then it's obvious that Unit's mind can be swayed and there is NO reason to think Sox can't join in.    If they get outbid, fine. But I want a serious attempt to be made.

Do you think we'd even hear about such an offer, though?

 

If KW puts together a package to get Unit and it doesn't get him here, that could seriously affect the morale of the players that would have been traded.

[BrandoFan]

Do you think we'd even hear about such an offer, though?

With Kenny's ego, they'd WANT to advertise such attempt -- even if Johnson ends up shooting the deal down or Sox get outbid.

 

They'd get major points for trying. As they should.

[israel4ever]

Ordonez and A-Rod are best friends; they work out together during the off-season.

 

A-Rod is gonna make a big push to get Mags over there, especially sice Bernie Williams probably won't be with them next year.

[Wedge]

Ordonez and A-Rod are best friends; they work out together during the off-season.

 

A-Rod is gonna make a big push to get Mags over there, especially sice Bernie Williams probably won't be with them next year.

of sheffield, matsui, and ordonez, which one could play CF?

[ZoomSlowik]

For the rest of this year, Johnson is affordable, but those last two could be killers. With that much money left, it has the potential to kill the Sox payroll. That's an awful lot of money to be investing in a 40 year old. If he gets hurt or decides to retire, that's going to be one heck of a problem for the Sox those two years. Besides, there are other problems. First, there is no guarantee he will be available. Second, the cost in prospects would be crushing. We complained about losing Reed and Olivo, we would probably lose two or three more stud prospects, and potentially Maggs or Lee. Third, he has total power over a trade, and even if everything else worked out, he could still just say no. Yeah, it would be nice to see a pitcher of RJ's caliber on the Sox for the playoffs, but there are a whole lot of obstacles, and I don't really see anyone but the Yankees taking on all of that money.

[Goober]

off topic but u.s cellular field is the 5th most dangerous baseball stadium

 

http://www.coldpizza.tv/stadiums.html

[ZoomSlowik]

of sheffield, matsui, and ordonez, which one could play CF?

The right answer is none. Matsui played center briefly last year when Williams was hurt, and from what I remember it was rather ugly. If the Yankees were going add another outfielder(and my guess is they won't, unless Steinbrenner gets pissed again and decides to add another $40 mil to the payroll), it would make much more sense to get Beltran.

[ZoomSlowik]

Just a side note about the Diamondbacks, does anyone know if they resigned Sexon, or is he still a free agent at the end of the year? That could make for some intruiging situation in any potential Johnson deal, although it would still be a long shot. Lee, Konerko, Rauch, and Anderson for Johnson, try to keep Maggs and sign Sexon in the offseason? I don't even know if that would be financially feasible, but wow.

[upnorthsox]

Torre didn't pick him; he's in on the player's vote.

So if Torre was picking we'd have no one going.

[BrandoFan]

..

For the rest of this year, Johnson is affordable, but those last two could be killers.

 

He is signed through 2005, not 2006.

 

With that much money left, it has the potential to kill the Sox payroll.

 

You know what else has the potential to kill the Sox payroll? Missing playoffs by 2-3 games because Rauch or Diaz made one too many starts. What else? Losing in the 1st round because Garcia couldn't handle the pressure of Game 1 in Fenway or Yankee stadium and Sox had to pitch Loaiza/Garland in Game 3.

 

Those things have the potential to piss Sox fans and JR off, and payroll might not be so pretty in 2005 and beyond ANYWAY.

 

Risk is always there with this franchise, so you have to pick your poison. After 86 years, playing it safe ain't cool. Not when Cubs are trying to bury your franchise by winning the World Series.

 

That's an awful lot of money to be investing in a 40 year old. If he gets hurt or decides to retire, that's going to be one heck of a problem for the Sox those two years.

 

He'll play in 2005 - and Astros are doing just fine with 41yo Clemens aren't they.

 

Besides, there are other problems. First, there is no guarantee he will be available

.

 

He'll be available with the right offer. Zona is in bad shape.

 

Second, the cost in prospects would be crushing.

 

Hold up. Given his age, health risk and somewhat diminished skills (check out his 2003-2004, still damn good but no longer 1999-2002 great), to say nothing of Arizona's money problems.......Why should they get everything they want? f*** them, those hellhole lizzard land-inhabiting b****es.

 

We complained about losing Reed and Olivo, we would probably lose two or three more stud prospects, and potentially Maggs or Lee.

 

Given how Sox overrate prospects, I honestly wouldn't mind losing a couple of them.

 

And losing Lee (or even Magglioverrated) won't be terrible at all the way he's hitting RHP this year. If anything that's 9 Mill off the books in 2005.

 

Third, he has total power over a trade, and even if everything else worked out, he could still just say no.

 

So he does, why are you all scared of it? Minds are meant to be changed.

 

If he listens to the offer and shoots the deal down, so be it - you can always look at other options with clean conscience that you've done everything within reason to get the best and it just didn't work out. That's all I ask.

[ZoomSlowik]

I doubt Loaiza would go to the Yankees. He seems more like a guy a mid market team desperate for pitching would overpay for(hopefully not us). Yankees will probably try to add Johnson now, Clement, Pavano, Perez, Radke, or Ortiz in the offseason.

[Controlled Chaos]

Torre didn't pick him; he's in on the player's vote.

I read that Torre picked him. Here's a section from the article on the sox site....

 

The reserves were picked, in part, through the ballots of players, managers and coaches from around the American League. Loaiza was one of the players named to the team by manage Joe Torre, in conjunction with Major League Baseball.

 

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb...s_cws&fext=.jsp

[ZoomSlowik]

Last I checked, Randy spent most of last year on the DL, and he isn't getting any younger. I think it's funny how you say he's a great player and he would greatly increase our chances, but screw Arizona, he's old, fragile, and not as good as he used to be, so they shouldn't get anyone good. Make up your mind. Just because Arizona is in bad shape financially doesn't mean they shouldn't get anything for him. He's their best and most popular player, and people would be unhappy with him gone. He's about the only thing worth watching on that team now. How much do you think it would piss of THEIR fans if they didn't get a great package for him. They've been in financial trouble for a while, and all they really did about it this offseason was trade Schilling and add Sexon, which I believe is virtually a draw on money. Besides, according to Selig, 20 teams in baseball are losing money. As for pissing off the fans, their attendance can't get much lower. The Sox are going to make the playoffs this year whether or not they get Johnson. Just look at the Twins schedule for the second half and you'll see why. Even if they lose in the 1st round, their revenue would still increase, and their is no telling if Johnson will actually make a difference. If their offense is so pitiful, as you have claimed before, then it won't matter how well we pitch, we'll lose 1-0. How did Houston do when they got him from Seattle? I would rather have Maggs for the next 5 than Randy for 1 1/2. And not every Sox prospect is overrated. Maggs, Lee and Buehrle have done fine, and Garland is better than a lot of pitchers. Giving up someone like Anderson could hurt a ton in the future.

[BrandoFan]

Last I checked, Randy spent most of last year on the DL, and he isn't getting any younger. I think it's funny how you say he's a great player and he would greatly increase our chances, but screw Arizona, he's old, fragile, and not as good as he used to be, so they shouldn't get anyone good. Make up your mind.

 

There is no contradiction here whatsoever.

 

Where did I say they "shouldn't get anyone good"? Getting quality in return doesn't imply a card blanche to rape and pillage another team's farm system. Especially when your franchise is treading bancruptcy.

 

And yes, because of those considerations (huge contract, age, health history, and somewhat diminished skills the last 2 years), Arizona shouldn't get what they would have gotten for Unit just 3-4 years ago. Once again....we're not talking about Prior, Sheets or Zambrano here.

 

Just because Arizona is in bad shape financially doesn't mean they shouldn't get anything for him.

 

It also doesn't mean they should get 3 or 4 cream of the crop prospects and not have to pay a chunk of Unit's salary, either.

 

He's their best and most popular player, and people would be unhappy with him gone. He's about the only thing worth watching on that team now. How much do you think it would piss of THEIR fans if they didn't get a great package for him.

 

f*** them and their fans. What do you think Yankees are willing to give? A Young Sheffield and a Young A-Rod?

 

Maggs, Lee and Buehrle have done fine, and Garland is better than a lot of pitchers. Giving up someone like Anderson could hurt a ton in the future.

 

Garland is utterly mediocre. And those other 3 have been either signed as amateur free agents or are late-late draft pick gems who came out of nowhere.

 

Baldwin, Ruffcorn, Seau, Dellaero, Caruso, Mark Johnson, Leifer, Bobby Hill, Stumm, Borchard and Ring are closer to reality.

 

I have no problem with parting with Anderson and Munoz, for instance.

[Steff]

I don't know it for sure, Steff, but, from what I've read, deferred money is the sticking point in the negotiations.

 

PR-wise, that works well for JR and the ownership...they can say that they made a "very competitive offer", and that the "money was the same (or more)" than what he untimately signed for...blah, blah, blah.

 

I hate JR and his BS! I wish he'd sell the team.

Yea... I know you do. And when you get it past that thick skull of yours that it's NOT HIS TEAM TO SELL.... you might get past the hatred.

[Steff]

Ordonez and A-Rod are best friends; they work out together during the off-season.

 

A-Rod is gonna make a big push to get Mags over there, especially sice Bernie Williams probably won't be with them next year.

Which Ordonez... Maggs Ordonez...? Maggs and ARod..? Where on earth did you hear that..??

[greasywheels121]

Which Ordonez... Maggs Ordonez...? Maggs and ARod..? Where on earth did you hear that..??

I don't know about them being best friends or A-Rod making a push for Mags; however, it has been noted that Mags and A-Rod do work out in the offseason.

[Wedge]

I don't know about them being best friends or A-Rod making a push for Mags; however, it has been noted that Mags and A-Rod do work out in the offseason.

I would hope most ballplayers work-out in the offseason :-p

[Guest JimH]

Brando, why don't you send all these Randy Johnson posts in to Ken Williams/Eddie Einhorn/Jerry Reinsdorf?

 

Why are you wasting your analysis on the Sox Talk Influential Audience of Give or Take 100?

 

Two things to consider:

 

- Johnson is a big drawing card both in Arizona and around the league. Even at his high salary, he is an economic asset for the Diamondbacks.

 

- Colangelo stated as recently as last week he wants Johnson to retire as a D-Back so he can wear the Arizona cap into the Hall of Fame.

 

You told some guy yesterday to just ignore your posts ... well fine, but this is about the 200th time you've told the Randy Johnson tale. Maybe you can plant the seed in Sox ownerships head instead.

[ZoomSlowik]

You never said nothing, but you made contradictory comments in two different parts of the post. Such as, he's going to play nexxt year and won't cost that much, and he's an injury risk and has a bloated contract. The point is you wouldn't have even thought of trading him 3 years ago, much like you wouldn't trade those other guys. You would still have to give up some good players to get him, again, assuming they even trade him. I do not want to touch Anderson, but that is who they are going to want. Throwing 4 okay prospects together isn't going to cut it. Obviously, you're going to be able to come up with more guys from the minors that didn't make it than one's that did, because there are a huge number of guys and only a small percentage of players make it. Hill never even signed with the Sox, I blame that one on the Cubs, and Stumm and Borchard aren't done yet. As for first rounders that have done well, how about Baines and Thomas? If you can go all the way back to Ruffcorn, I can start there. Plus Honel and Anderson are two of our top prospects that are kicking ass(well, Honel was before he got hurt), and we drafted guys like Reed, Ring, and Francisco that brought us valuable pieces. You don't just trade away your guys with a chance to help your team and call them useless.

Garland is better than medicore. Decent would be my word of choice. There are a whole lot of pitchers out there performing a lot worse than him. Come on, when Tayon Sturtze is starting for the Yankees, I'm not complaining about Garland much. As for what the Yankees would deal, they would almost certainly give up Dionar Navarro, their stud catching prospect, Contreras, a guy that has some problems but has great stuff as their centerpieces. They have a few other decent prospects that would probably be involved, but I can't remember who. We don't have anyone at the same point that Navarro is, so we would have to give up a few good prospects to beat that, plus the Yankees wouldn't have to make the Dbacks eat any of his salary, meaning they wouldn't have to give up as much.

[BrandoFan]

;/

You never said nothing, but you made contradictory comments in two different parts of the post. Such as, he's going to play nexxt year and won't cost that much, and he's an injury risk and has a bloated contract.

 

I've made plenty of qualifications and clarifications to my point. I am not going to repeat myself. There is no contradiction here.

 

You would still have to give up some good players to get him, again, assuming they even trade him

 

Well, no s***. Giving up "something" is NOT = giving up "everything".

 

Munoz and Anderson are "something". As are a lot of different prospect permutations.

 

I do not want to touch Anderson, but that is who they are going to want

 

Who do you think Anderson is? Bo Diddley? I'd give him up for Unit and 2 runs at the world series (2004 and 2005) in a SECOND.

 

As for what the Yankees would deal, they would almost certainly give up Dionar Navarro, their stud catching prospect, Contreras, a guy that has some problems but has great stuff as their centerpieces.

 

Contreras makes a lot of money, had some health problems in the past as well. If Arizona is dealing Unit out of financial considerations, it wouldn't be Contreras who is still a big question mark in many respects.

 

Contreras + Navarro + lesser prospect. Sounds good.

 

All Sox need is to match it (say, Loaiza + Anderson + 2 lesser prospects?), and wouldn't Colangelo go with the Sox because of his Steinbrenner Grudge?

 

Unit will be very hard to swing that goes without saying, but if the URGENCY and DESIRE are there, it's totally doable.

 

And prospects are just that - Alex Escobar, Bandon Phillips and Casey Fossum were "untouchable" 3 years ago. Look at them now. :puke

 

There are currently no Mark Priors or Albert Pujolses in our organization, suffice to say.

[ZoomSlowik]

Ugh, Contreras is making a lot more than I thought. $9 mil?! :puke God, Steinbrenner has too much money. He could still be in it with the Yankees paying part of his salary. I don't want to trade Anderson because he is probably our best prospect right now, he is a true centerfielder, he's been killing the ball, and he is at AA in only his second season(even though he missed a good chunk of last year with an injury). If any of our prospects are going to be solid players, he's my vote. I also don't see why they would want Loaiza since he is a free agent at the end of the year, and they aren't going anywhere(Maggs would fall into this category too). If any of our pitchers were to go it would be someone signed for a while, making Garland more likely. Plus we would still end up dealing several prospects unless we eat all or most of the money. If we could get away with Borchard and Rauch with the DBacks eating a some money, then hell yeah go for it, but that's not likely, even if he wants to come. No GM is going to take a package just to piss off another team, so the Sox would have to come up with significantly better package considering they are not likely to cough up all of the money. Obviously Phillps wasn't untouchable, since he was traded for Colon, and Escobar is still a decent prospect. You never know which one is going to pan out. Albert Pujols wasn't that good a prospect when they got him. Seattle raped Houston on the last Randy Johnson deal. Garcia and Guillen would still be helping them out significantly if they had kept them, and Johnson is long gone from Houston. I don't want to be saying that about Anderson. However, I could care less about guys like Rauch, Borchard(assuming we keep Maggs, otherwise we would need him), and Diaz. Munoz I kind of want to keep, but for someone like Johnson fine, but these guys don't have enough value. Plus the Johnson deal would probably make Reinsdorf get rid of Maggs for sure, which I don't want. Look at what KC got for Beltran. The got Teahan, Wood, and a good catcher(his name escapes me). Wood is already with them, and the other two will be shortly. We don't have 3 guys that will start for the DBacks in the next two years in our Farm System. Maybe 2 in Rauch and Anderson, but that's about all I see above A ball.

[hi8is]

from rotoworld.com

 

White Sox signed RHP Freddy Garcia to a three-year, $27 million contract extension.

Garcia, who would have become a free agent at season's end, will earn $8 million in 2005, $9 million in 2006 and $10 million in 2007. It seems like a fair deal for both sides. The White Sox will just have to hope that Garcia continues to avoid arm problems. He's on pace to make 33 starts for the fifth time in six major league seasons. Jul. 6 - 3:05 pm et