September 19, 200421 yr There have been many calls to trade PK and/or Carlos for "ozzieball" players. For those who support such trades, what do you expect to get? When you look at trades of premier players during the last off-season, I think of Brian Giles, Curt Schilling, Richie Sexson, Javy Vazquez, and Eric Milton. The first 2 were traded for prospects. The 3rd was traded for a bunch of prospects and middle-of-the-road major leaguers. The 4th was traded for a promising young player (Nick Johnson) and some players that were, essentially, prospects. And the 5th was traded for some promising ML talent -- but there were a lot of people saying Milton was overrated the whole time. I can imagine a Konerko for Pierre trade, straight-up (player-wise, the Sox would probably have to throw in some money), or maybe w/ the Sox throwing in a prospect or 2 -- nothing much better than that. (The Marlins may need some sluggers, w/ Lowell's contract & all.) What is the general opinion on that? Pierre's obp is not much better than Konerko's (.370 v .360), and his slg is much worse (.550 v .406). Of course, he is much faster. Is that a worthwhile trade, to you? More generally, what do you expect? Remember, these are not video game trades -- don't just talk about one-dimensional value, justify your proposition with a need and value on the opposing side of the trade.
September 19, 200421 yr Author What the hell are "Ozzie Ball" players fast, bunting players...I guess It's a phrase that I usually translate to "smallball", but, c'mon, I know you've heard this phrase before, you know it as well as I do.
September 19, 200421 yr Author If we could get an Oliver Perez and Jason Bay for Konerko, Kenny should get a raise. That trade was awesome for Pitt. Perez is a stud. Bay has looked good this season also. Konerko for Pierre I like because we fill a few holes with the move IMO. We get a TRUE leadoff hitter, a guy that can steal 50 a year, and basically fill the RF spot by moving ARow over. Now that also leaves us with a hole at 1b, which I AM NOT for having Gload as the full-time 1b man, but he might have to be, or some sort of FA fill in. We won't get that for Konerko, b/c PK is not thought of as highly as Brian Giles. And PK and some cash for Pierre straight up, is that okay? Will we be a better team?
September 19, 200421 yr Who's going to want Konerko? NY Yankees - fine at 1B/DH w/ Giambi Boston - fine at 1B/DH Toronto - won't spend $8 million, burned by Delgado Orioles - a possibility. Devil Rays - a possibility Forget the Central Division. Oakland - Have Hatteberg/Durazo Texas - Texeira is just as good Anaheim - this makes some sense, Erstad is horrible offensively Seattle - I could see this as well NY Mets - perhaps, but who do they have left to trade? ATL - I don't think they're giving up on their cheap, young 1B yet. Phillies - They got a guy. He's pretty good. Marlins - Won't take on $8 mil. Expos - Have Nick Johnson Cards - Fuhgeddaboutit. 1B is taken, thank you very much Cubs - D. Lee is pretty solid Astros - Bagwell Brewers - Overbay is cheap and good. Reds - Casey OK for now, Dunn probably becomes 1B of future Pirates - Bay cheap and good. Giants - A possibility, but they have ZIPPY to trade Dodgers - Hee Sop Choi is productive (and cheap) DBacks - Unless they don't resign Sexson Padres - 1B is covered by Klesko/Nevin, etc. Rockies - Oh, that guy Helton plays 1B So I can see the Giants, Mets, Anaheim, Seattle, Baltimore and possibly Tampa Bay interested in Konerko. I'm not sure what any of those teams could offer in terms of value. Tampa isn't going to be stupid enough to give away BJ Upton or Scott Kazmir. So who you going to get from these teams?
September 20, 200421 yr Who's going to want Konerko? Cards - Fuhgeddaboutit. 1B is taken, thank you very much Don't forget though that Pujols can play 4 positions - first, left, right, and third. He could easily go back to the outfield (left field). That would make the Cards' lineup something like this: 1B - Konerko (39 HR, 1 SB ROFLMAO) 2B - Womack (5 HR, 23 SB) SS - Renteria (10 HR, 16 SB) 3B - Rolen (33 HR, 4 SB) LF - Pujols (44 HR, 5 SB), backup - Sanders (22 HR, 21 SB) CF - Edmonds (42 HR, 7 SB) RF - Walker (15 HR, 6 SB in 70 games this year) C - Matheny (5 HR, 0 SB) If Walker walks, Pujols or Sanders could go to right and not miss a beat. That's a freakin' SICK lineup!
September 20, 200421 yr Who's going to want Konerko? NY Yankees - fine at 1B/DH w/ Giambi Boston - fine at 1B/DH Toronto - won't spend $8 million, burned by Delgado Orioles - a possibility. Devil Rays - a possibility Forget the Central Division. Oakland - Have Hatteberg/Durazo Texas - Texeira is just as good Anaheim - this makes some sense, Erstad is horrible offensively Seattle - I could see this as well NY Mets - perhaps, but who do they have left to trade? ATL - I don't think they're giving up on their cheap, young 1B yet. Phillies - They got a guy. He's pretty good. Marlins - Won't take on $8 mil. Expos - Have Nick Johnson Cards - Fuhgeddaboutit. 1B is taken, thank you very much Cubs - D. Lee is pretty solid Astros - Bagwell Brewers - Overbay is cheap and good. Reds - Casey OK for now, Dunn probably becomes 1B of future Pirates - Bay cheap and good. Giants - A possibility, but they have ZIPPY to trade Dodgers - Hee Sop Choi is productive (and cheap) DBacks - Unless they don't resign Sexson Padres - 1B is covered by Klesko/Nevin, etc. Rockies - Oh, that guy Helton plays 1B So I can see the Giants, Mets, Anaheim, Seattle, Baltimore and possibly Tampa Bay interested in Konerko. I'm not sure what any of those teams could offer in terms of value. Tampa isn't going to be stupid enough to give away BJ Upton or Scott Kazmir. So who you going to get from these teams? The Brewers could actually be looking to trade Overbay this offseason to a rebuilding team, with the emergence of Prince Fielder from their system. He is thought higher of and will be a bigger power then then Overbay. However, I do agree with that list, though I wouldn't count Atlanta out of needing a 1Bman. I don't think they'd trade for Konerko, but they are a possibility. Here's what I'm thinking, however. We trade PK straight up for Luis Castillo...Castillo has a little bigger contract then Pierre, and would not cost the Sox nearly as much money. Assuming we do save money, we can invest in a RFer, a potential backup for 1B if Gload cannot play everyday(so we would end up with a platoon at 1B basically), we trade Crede for a reliever or two(I'm wondering what we could get for Crede from Tampa Bay, personally), sign Koskie to play 3B, and then the rest goes towards pitching.
September 20, 200421 yr Here's what I'm thinking, however. We trade PK straight up for Luis Castillo...Castillo has a little bigger contract then Pierre, and would not cost the Sox nearly as much money. Assuming we do save money, we can invest in a RFer, a potential backup for 1B if Gload cannot play everyday(so we would end up with a platoon at 1B basically), we trade Crede for a reliever or two(I'm wondering what we could get for Crede from Tampa Bay, personally), sign Koskie to play 3B, and then the rest goes towards pitching. Why would the Marlins make this trade? Because they like having a lot of salary on the books? Because they would like making the Sox better? Luis Castillo gets on base and plays good defense. Why would the Marlins give him up? And why for Konerko? Power hitting 1B men are a dime a dozen. I don't know why the Marlins would give up great value in a premium position for Konerko. They didn't win the World Series last year by giving up value. By the way, on the Sox e-mail list, I said Castillo was the one guy the White Sox should sign last year. At his current salary, he was a steal.
September 20, 200421 yr Wite, doesnt Huff pretty much have 3b locked up in Tampa?? From what i know yes he does. Does not play excellent defense but his offense more than makes up for it.
September 20, 200421 yr Sexson is going to be a FA this offseason. He's a similar player to PK who should get a similar contract and a team won't have to give up anything player-wise to get him. That hurts the Sox bargaining position.
September 20, 200421 yr Sexson is going to be a FA this offseason. He's a similar player to PK who should get a similar contract and a team won't have to give up anything player-wise to get him. That hurts the Sox bargaining position. He is also coming off season-ending surgury...so I question he is going to get too much guarenteed money. PK could also go to a team looking to put it all into a one season run.
September 20, 200421 yr Dodgers - Hee Sop Choi is productive (and cheap) He hasn't been productive in the least for the Dodgers. He is all potential and no production as of yet. I wonder if LA would look to deal this winter, since the LoDuca deal was a bust. They're a pretty solid team, and they've been able to shuffle Shawn Green around from the OF to 1B when they need to.
September 20, 200421 yr He hasn't been productive in the least for the Dodgers. He is all potential and no production as of yet. I wonder if LA would look to deal this winter, since the LoDuca deal was a bust. They're a pretty solid team, and they've been able to shuffle Shawn Green around from the OF to 1B when they need to. How about Konerko and a prospect for Cesar Izturis and Edwin Jackson or one of their other good pitching prospects?
September 20, 200421 yr How about Konerko and a prospect for Cesar Izturis and Edwin Jackson or one of their other good pitching prospects? My uninformed opinion is that since they already dealt Mota, they'd be reluctant to deal any of their other highly-regarded prospects, but I could absolutely be wrong. I'd take Izturis - we need a SS pretty badly, especially if the Sox brass feel that Willie is a flop so Uribe would be the regular 2B.
September 20, 200421 yr Why would the Marlins make this trade? Because they like having a lot of salary on the books? Because they would like making the Sox better? Luis Castillo gets on base and plays good defense. Why would the Marlins give him up? And why for Konerko? Power hitting 1B men are a dime a dozen. I don't know why the Marlins would give up great value in a premium position for Konerko. They didn't win the World Series last year by giving up value. By the way, on the Sox e-mail list, I said Castillo was the one guy the White Sox should sign last year. At his current salary, he was a steal. No thanks anyway, we could get a much more valuable player than another 2b. In all honesty, we need a SS or another pitcher more than an ok 2b. Hes not even really a lead-off hitter, he hits well in the 2 hole, because there is some nice power behind him, and the pitcher is usually worried about Pierre on base. If they are going to get rid of their most powerful hitter, they better get a solid starter at a crucial position in return. I mean, you are saying that power-hitting 1b are a dime a dozen. Well there arent too many players that have 40 bombs, last time I checked there were 8 in the MLB while 2 are 1b. Paulie is def going to hit 40 this year, which maybe will only include 10 players in the entire league. I think if you are going to trade him, he will bring more value than maybe that 4th or 5th best player on a second place team
September 20, 200421 yr Wite, doesnt Huff pretty much have 3b locked up in Tampa?? I know for a fact that he has not made the transition well defensively, and that this is either the last year of Tino's contract(though it may end next year too...I am unsure of that), so Huff may move back to 1B. The one thing I was wondering was if BJ Upton would move to 3B, because I know they had considered that...that would also block a trade of Crede to Tampa Bay. BlackBetsy...the reason I brought that idea up was because the creater of the thread mentioned Konerko for Pierre as a possibility...I figured that, if Florida wants to get rid of salary, one would think they'd get rid of the one that makes the most. Obviously, we'd have to throw some cash into the deal, but I was just basically mentioning a brief idea. Perhaps it could be Konerko, Harris, and cash for Castillo.
September 21, 200421 yr He hasn't been productive in the least for the Dodgers. He is all potential and no production as of yet. I wonder if LA would look to deal this winter, since the LoDuca deal was a bust. They're a pretty solid team, and they've been able to shuffle Shawn Green around from the OF to 1B when they need to. He does strike out alot but his obp is not too bad at .371
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