DBAHO Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(rangercal @ May 10, 2005 -> 04:54 PM) Phoenix has: an Mvp Point Guard Nash 2 4/5 star shooting guards Joe Johson, Q richardson 2 all star fowards stoudamire, Marion a great 6th man off the bench Jim jackson. skiles has: 4 rookies 1 hot/cold pg/sg hinrich 2 1 dimensional big men chandler and curry and role players like harrington, Davis, Pargo, Pike, griffin You make it sound like Phoenix has a bunch of all - star's and Chicago has a bunch of scrubs. Couldn't be further from the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(rangercal @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:48 AM) You will support anything suns because of steven Hunter and Q. I pose a question for you. How would skiles do with suns ? How would D'antoni do with this year's bulls? I just think that the gm for the suns is more to credit for building that offensive beast in phoenix. Paxson did a great job bringing in the rookies for skiles, but C'mon how often do you see coaches win with a team as young as the bulls? You see coaches win with the type of talent phoenix has all the time. Suns would still do what they do best which is score but they would not give up 103.3 points per game with skiles as their coach that is for damn sure. The bulls would probally be a little worse consider d'antoni doesn't focus on defense which the bulls specialize at. His rotations are also pretty weak ( going by when he coached the nuggets and not now since he only really has a 7-8 man team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Ha I love how Bulls fans have no problem trashing their players, the players they defended to no end during the season, for the sake of saying their coach was the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:53 AM) So if Johnny Davis coached the Suns they would still have the same record? I think not. But Chicago's slow start wrecked all hope Skiles had of winning the coach of the year. Where would you put Nate McMillian into all of this as well? I think Mcmillon should get recognized in the top five, not win it. Johnny Davis was just a horrible coach, I feel for you Orlando fans. I think even he would have gotten phoenix in the playoffs though. Not 1 seed but at least 4 or 5 seed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ May 10, 2005 -> 04:56 PM) Ha I love how Bulls fans have no problem trashing their players, the players they defended to no end during the season, for the sake of saying their coach was the best. 1 Dimensional Big Man in Curry. Uh - Oh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:56 AM) Ha I love how Bulls fans have no problem trashing their players, the players they defended to no end during the season, for the sake of saying their coach was the best. I was not bashing them. They will be a lot better next year , a year older. I never claimed eddy had great d, but on the same token, Tyson can't shoot for s***. Skiles should be given credit for finding roles for the players he has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(rangercal @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:54 AM) Phoenix has: an Mvp Point Guard Nash 2 4/5 star shooting guards Joe Johson, Q richardson 2 all star fowards stoudamire, Marion a great 6th man off the bench Jim jackson. skiles has: 4 rookies 1 hot/cold pg/sg hinrich 2 1 dimensional big men chandler and curry and role players like harrington, Davis, Pargo, Pike, griffin DBAHO, break down what I said here that is not true. FWIW Curry is closer to being a good defensive player than Tyson is as an offensive player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:56 AM) Ha I love how Bulls fans have no problem trashing their players, the players they defended to no end during the season, for the sake of saying their coach was the best. You're crazy. Curry-bashing has been a season-long trend for some Bulls "fans." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:50 AM) Oh, so you were saying that Nash was the MVP that drove them to win. They weren't the same team without him. He deserved the MVP award. I agree. Lol. The opposite actually. If a fairly raw second year player can lead them to score 103 points per game, which is 7 points less than when nash is in the game what does that say for nash? Several other point guards could have made this offense flow as good as nash whether you think that is hypothetical or not it is the truth. He is the catalyst of the suns and is in the right place at the right time, therefore the mvp. I would say shaq's 20+ points on over 60% shooting ( only two players have done that in the past twenty years is more impressive) his defensive presence also means a s*** load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(rangercal @ May 10, 2005 -> 01:56 AM) I think Mcmillon should get recognized in the top five, not win it. Johnny Davis was just a horrible coach, I feel for you Orlando fans. I think even he would have gotten phoenix in the playoffs though. Not 1 seed but at least 4 or 5 seed. So d'antoni made the suns who the suns are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ May 10, 2005 -> 02:03 AM) So d'antoni made the suns who the suns are? No. I'm not making a point of D'antoni being a great coach. I'm pointing how bad davis is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ May 10, 2005 -> 02:02 AM) Lol. The opposite actually. If a fairly raw second year player can lead them to score 103 points per game, which is 7 points less than when nash is in the game what does that say for nash? Several other point guards could have made this offense flow as good as nash whether you think that is hypothetical or not it is the truth. He is the catalyst of the suns and is in the right place at the right time, therefore the mvp. I would say shaq's 20+ points on over 60% shooting ( only two players have done that in the past twenty years is more impressive) his defensive presence also means a s*** load. You make 7 points sound like nothing. That's usually the difference between a win and a loss. What's your point? By the way, I'm glad you recognize why Nash won now: "He is the catalyst of the suns and is in the right place at the right time, therefore the mvp. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ May 10, 2005 -> 02:06 AM) You make 7 points sound like nothing. That's usually the difference between a win and a loss. What's your point? By the way, I'm glad you recognize why Nash won now: "He is the catalyst of the suns and is in the right place at the right time, therefore the mvp. " Seven points is a big deal but it's not like they are going from 103 to 96, they are going from 110 to 103. You should be able to win at a higher winning percentage than around 30 % when scoring 103 points per game, no? He had a very good season on a very, very potent offensive team i am not saying other wise. But could they have one without steve nash? Yes. Could they have been one of the best teams in the nba without steve nash? Yes. Why were they 2 and 5 in the seven games he missed? Was it due to lack of points? No. Many players could have been their ''catalyst'' aka their point guard and over a full season they would be over 105 points per game... more than enough to be very, very successful unless you don't play defense like them. Not like when nash is in the line-up he is locking down his defenders and really helping them defensively. When i think of an mvp i think of a player that could step in on practically any team in the nba and steve nash is not that type of player. I also think of it as if you take that player off the team they are currently on how well would they do? Take nash off they would be fine if they could play defense, if you take shaq, dirk, duncan, etc... of their teams they would not be very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Amare-Marion and Joe Johnson didn't win last year and Q-Richardson wasn't the reason for the turnaround, Nash was. The argument that Nash isn't the mvp, as employed by the Sports Guy, is flawed. His reasoning is that Nash is just doing what a good point guard should do. Unfortunately, he leaves out that Shaq does what a good post man should do. Clearly, both players far exceed the average expectations of their positions which is why the "doing their jobs" argument is stupid and not wel thought out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(Punch and Judy Garland @ May 10, 2005 -> 02:42 AM) Amare-Marion and Joe Johnson didn't win last year and Q-Richardson wasn't the reason for the turnaround, Nash was. The argument that Nash isn't the mvp, as employed by the Sports Guy, is flawed. His reasoning is that Nash is just doing what a good point guard should do. Unfortunately, he leaves out that Shaq does what a good post man should do. Clearly, both players far exceed the average expectations of their positions which is why the "doing their jobs" argument is stupid and not wel thought out You can make an argument for either man being 2005 NBA MVP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 I wouldn't argue much with Shaq being the mvp. I think what happens is that everyone realizes that they have failed to properly embrace a guy, which happened with Nash. Plus, it just seems like a charmed year for him with getting shown the door in Dallas, the best record in basketball, and the all-star weekend Suns domination. It's the year of the Suns and Nash. Hopefully there will be a showdown with Miami in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AssHatSoxFan Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 too tired to read through all this but another good choice for coach of the year would have been nate mcmillan(sp?) and the job he did with the sonics, they also had a great year and no one expected much from them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(AssHatSoxFan @ May 10, 2005 -> 10:53 PM) too tired to read through all this but another good choice for coach of the year would have been nate mcmillan(sp?) and the job he did with the sonics, they also had a great year and no one expected much from them You're right........... you are too tired. Check 1 page ahead, although their bad finish would have hurt his chances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AssHatSoxFan Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 10, 2005 -> 09:00 AM) You're right........... you are too tired. Check 1 page ahead, although their bad finish would have hurt his chances. yeah i mean if you want to consider rick carlisle as well for what he did after the brawl keeping his team alive...there's always going to be a big debate for coach of the year just based on teams turning things around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWRoCk2 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 no big deal, obviously they dont care how bad your team looks they just give it to teams who are the number one seed, always happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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