"Respect"

[DukeNukeEm]

Fixed the spelling and grammar errors, so dont bust my balls on that.

[qwerty]

Do we want to give up BMac, Anderson, Gio, Sweeney for a rental on somebody who cant do anything these guys are doing now?  Where do you put Chavez?  Are you going to demote (basically punish) Dye and AJ by bumping them down the order even though the way theve performed has been awesome?  Same goes with Randa.

 

I would give up anyone of out minor leaguers for the right player. I am not talking a player that is a free agent at the end of the year, a player with multiple years left on their contract.

 

Another SP?  Duque is injury prone, yeah.  But we have f***ing Cotts who's been awesome this year, he's eventually going to get some starts, because Ozzie and KW know Bmac cannot get it done.

 

Yes, we do need another starter for insurance case. One reason like you said he is injury prone. Another is he is just not that good. he has gotten very lucky this season to have the record he does.

 

You guys are too stuck on this "you gotta get all the best players at every position to even stand a shot at hte WS" idea.  It's really not like that, the Marlins had a good manager who never gave up on them and some serious luck and they won the WS.  Now who says we cannot just stand pat with our awesome manager, and our awesome luck and play the same ball we've been playing all year.

 

 

It's not Ozzieball, Smartball or Smallball, its winning f***ing baseball.  And bringing in some overpaid slouch (Chavez) or a former division rival (Randa) isnt going to help us.  We have a team of White Sox players and I dont think it would help to pollute it with people from the A's, Giants, Reds, or whatnot.

 

Is chavez overpaid? Yes. Is chavez a slouch? I think not. So randa couldn't help because he played on a ''division rival'' as you call it? I bet carlos beltran, crain, nathan, santana, i-rod, polanco, sweeney, etc... couldn't help us either.

 

Why exactly would getting a good player from another team ''pollute'' us? Team chemistry? Is someone on our team gonna cry if they get knocked down a spot or two in the order/rotation? If they do i don't want them on the team.

 

Sometimes you gotta make a sacrifice to keep the team proud.  This is a proud group of guys, no doubt about.  They arent entitled, they arent overconfident, but they are proud and they are demanding respect.  If Kenny goes out and brings in some guy it's like saying "You know, I'm afraid you wont get the job done, so heres some help."

 

Or it's more like realizing that the sox can use an upgrade over meatball/shingo and hernandez.

 

They dont want help.  They want to win it.  They want no midseason carryovers, they want no overpaid 3B's and sure as hell dont want El Duque banned from the rotation.

 

You sure the white sox starting pitchers and the whole team in general wouldn't like to be able to rely on their whole bullpen. You put either meatball or shingo out there and they give up multiple runs every other time out.

 

You all are too into tinkering.  And it's gonna screw us so bad if we do.  Youre gonna f*** up this chemistry, this is really fragile what we have, and getting rid of one and replacing him with another has a definite possibility of throwing it off.

 

Are you in the club house to tell if the sox are a really fragile team? From everything i have heard/ read the sox are as close knit as it comes.

Edited June 26, 2005 by qwerty

[DukeNukeEm]

Why do I think it's fragile. B/c if it wasnt every single team would have the chemistry we have.

 

It's useless even trying to argue anything, you all are so bent on trading becuase for some reason I cannot understand you arent happy with what you see. You want more.

 

I think that's disrespectful considering all they've done, but thats just me.

[qwerty]

Why do I think it's fragile.  B/c if it wasnt every single team would have the chemistry we have.

 

It's useless even trying to argue anything, you all are so bent on trading becuase for some reason I cannot understand you arent happy with what you see.  You want more.

 

I think that's disrespectful considering all they've done, but thats just me.

 

Who said we aren't happy? Many of of just feel like we could still use minor upgrades if we are series about the world series.

[DukeNukeEm]

Who said we aren't happy? Many of of just feel like we could still use minor upgrades if we are series about the world series.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If you are happy with the product then why do you want to mess with it.

 

Why run the risk of screwing things up by adding somebody when we could sit tight and try not f***ing with our team for once, because every time we've made some trades at the deadline or before it for that matter with Kenny we havent even come out of the division.

 

My goal right now, win the division. Get to the playoffs? Win the Pennant. Win the Pennant? Take the series.

 

I will only be satisfied with a World Series when it comes to this group of guys. But we have to win the division first, and it's proven by history that when we trade too much, the Twins come back and smoke us.

[qwerty]

If you are happy with the product then why do you want to mess with it.

 

Why run the risk of screwing things up by adding somebody when we could sit tight and try not f***ing with our team for once, because every time we've made some trades at the deadline or before it for that matter with Kenny we havent even come out of the division.

 

My goal right now, win the division.  Get to the playoffs?  Win the Pennant.  Win the Pennant?  Take the series.

 

I will only be satisfied with a World Series when it comes to this group of guys.  But we have to win the division first, and it's proven by history that when we trade too much, the Twins come back and smoke us.

 

We are always behind when making those trades. This time it is totally different than the past three years.

 

I don't think this current team is a world series caliber. Now am i saying make a huge trade for a big name player? No. I am talking about a trade that won't be big news but will help us with our ultimate goal. We need at least one more consistent reliever, we also need timo off of the major league roster and we need a back up first baseman not named timo perez.

[DukeNukeEm]

I wouldnt mind picking up a Guillermo Mota. But thats about it.

 

Screwing the Batting and Starting rotation is what freaks me out. The bullpen could use some help, a guy like Mota (in the same caliber) would mean I see less of Vizcaino and Walker-ish players, guys who have LOST us games.

 

I see where youre coming from now, and I like it better than I thought I would.

[DukeNukeEm]

I think we have a backup 1st basemen in Gload, we just have to be patient.

[southsideirish71]

I would ditch Crede in a second. He cant hit when it counts. The occasional home run when up by 8 is nice and all, but it doesnt pay for the times when he has men on and cant drive them in when the game is on the line. This lets sit on our laurels because we have a great record. Well guess what when the playoffs start the only thing a great record gets you is home advantage. Wild Card teams beat Divisional Champs all the time. Crede is batting under .200 in RISP with 2 outs. Joe Randa is batting .333 in the same respects. That is the clutch stat. When the playoffs begin we start facing the best of the best from the other team. We are not facing some 8 ERA scrub anymore, we are facing Schilling, Santana, Johnson types. And guess what, it can be the difference between one good ab from someone in your lineup. As much as his defense has been spectacular we cant have a situation where we have a few auto outs at the end of lineup.

 

And for your everyone loves Crede and the organization is behind him. I would suspect that they are completely frustrated with him and his reluctance to change his hitting. They were upset with him last year and hoped that he would finally break out. Walker was quoted on the radio as saying, well he plays good defense but we expect nothing but a .240 average. We hoped he made progress but he has reverted to last year after a good start.

 

We need another starter. We cant have either Cuban pitching in the playoffs. I know everyone will say "El Duque" has playoff experience. Well he is barely hitting 85 on the gun and his WHIP is rediculus. He has a good record based on a lot of getting out of jams where a line drive was caught that could of broken the game out for the other team.

[DukeNukeEm]

We have both Everett and Thomas who can pitch hit.

 

Uribe can play 3rd too.

[DukeNukeEm]

I would ditch Crede in a second.  He cant hit when it counts. The occasional home run when up by 8 is nice and all, but it doesnt pay for the times when he has men on and cant drive them in when the game is on the line.  This lets sit on our laurels because we have a great record.  Well guess what when the playoffs start the only thing a great record gets you is home advantage.  Wild Card teams beat Divisional Champs all the time.  Crede is batting under .200 in RISP with 2 outs.  Joe Randa is batting .333 in the same respects.  That is the clutch stat. When the playoffs begin we start facing the best of the best from the other team.  We are not facing some 8 ERA scrub anymore, we are facing Schilling, Santana, Johnson types.  And guess what, it can be the difference between one good ab from someone in your lineup.  As much as his defense has been spectacular we cant have a situation where we have a few auto outs at the end of lineup. 

 

And for your everyone loves Crede and the organization is behind him.  I would suspect that they are completely frustrated with him and his reluctance to change his hitting.  They were upset with him last year and hoped that he would finally break out.  Walker was quoted on the radio as saying, well he plays good defense but we expect nothing but a .240 average.  We hoped he made progress but he has reverted to last year after a good start. 

 

We need another starter.  We cant have either Cuban pitching in the playoffs.  I know everyone will say "El Duque" has playoff experience.  Well he is barely hitting 85 on the gun and his WHIP is rediculus.  He has a good record based on a lot of getting out of jams where a line drive was caught that could of broken the game out for the other team.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Wow. I read this again. And this is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Congrats on becoming the official poster boy for disrespectful and spoiled rotten Sox fan!

[southsideirish71]

We have both Everett and Thomas who can pitch hit.

 

Uribe can play 3rd too.

 

Uribe has been eratic at the plate also. He cant control himself and swings for everything including things over his head. Putting him at third solves nothing. We need another bat in the lineup that is a control bat, someone that hits to right field, someone that can bunt, someone who can hit to right side to move a runner over. Also someone who can play good defense. Aka Joe Randa

[DukeNukeEm]

Uribe has been eratic at the plate also.  He cant control himself and swings for everything including things over his head.  Putting him at third solves nothing.    We need another bat in the lineup that is a control bat, someone that hits to right field, someone that can bunt, someone who can hit to right side to move a runner over.  Also someone who can play good defense.  Aka Joe Randa

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Are you satisfied with ANYTHING?

 

There is no perfect team. You seem to think only a perfect team can win the WS.

[southsideirish71]

Wow.  I read this again.  And this is EXACTLY what I'm talking about.  Congrats on becoming the official poster boy for disrespectful and spoiled rotten Sox fan!

 

Thanks for backing your facts up with conjecture and bulls*** noob. I state facts and you state wishy washy bulls***. Teams improve themselves with some moves. It will happen. Just because you have this cutesy little idea of how the shower will not be the same if Crede isnt in there with them, hey thats life. He cant hit, 1400 ABS tell us this. He has regressed. And after watching KW get Alomar and Everett a few times over the years should tell you that he will make a move or two.

[southsideirish71]

Are you satisfied with ANYTHING?

 

There is no perfect team.  You seem to think only a perfect team can win the WS.

 

 

How about this stick your head in the sand and proclaim we are the best team. And then when we face good to great pitching in the playoffs then complain when Crede is up and Schilling tosses him a slider on the outside corner with men on and he steps in the bucket and K's.

[DukeNukeEm]

Thanks for backing your facts up with conjecture and bulls*** noob.  I state facts and you state wishy washy bulls***.  Teams improve themselves with some moves.    It will happen.  Just because you have this cutesy little idea of how the shower will not be the same if Crede isnt in there with them, hey thats life.  He cant hit, 1400 ABS tell us this.  He has regressed.  And after watching KW get Alomar and Everett a few times over the years should tell you that he will make a move or two.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

How about commen f***ing sense?

 

You take the good with the bad. Paulies slow, are you calling for his head? No.

 

Uribe and Crede play AWESOME "D", do you want them gone? Yes. We got our run scorers at the top of the order. We have our D in the bottom, It's called balance, just trading and trading isnt going to win you anything.

 

You call it Wishy-Washy, I call it sensical.

[southsideirish71]

How about commen f***ing sense?

 

You take the good with the bad.  Paulies slow, are you calling for his head? No.

 

Uribe and Crede play AWESOME "D", do you want them gone?  Yes.  We got our run scorers at the top of the order.  We have our D in the bottom, It's called balance, just trading and trading isnt going to win you anything.

 

You call it Wishy-Washy, I call it sensical.

 

 

Well how about defense and hitting. You know some hitters can actually do both. Check out randa defensive stats, or hey watch a game or too and you will see he is a solid defender and we wont lose much at the corner. Most teams dont have too many 240 hitters in their lineup yet you want 2. Good. We can have a few runners on and watch Uribe tomahawk at one over his head, then crede pop out to the 2nd baseman. 2 outs, rally over.

[DukeNukeEm]

How about this stick your head in the sand and proclaim we are the best team.  And then when we face good to great pitching in the playoffs then complain when Crede is up and Schilling tosses him a slider on the outside corner with men on and he steps in the bucket and K's.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

See, we are a lucky team, and I am confident in our ability to produce luck. That situation wont arise. Call me nuts. I dont care.

[southsideirish71]

See, we are a lucky team, and I am confident in our ability to produce luck.  That situation wont arise.  Call me nuts.  I dont care.

 

 

Your basis for your arguement is "LUCK" and the ability to produce "Luck". Well that explains everything.

 

Dont forget your lucky rabbits foot for tomorrows game.

[BigSqwert]

Although I'm not as concerned with the hitting I wouldn't be mad if we got a new 3rd baseman. At least Uribe is more than a 1 tool guy. If he ever gets on base he can steal a base. He also is a much better bunter than Crede...but that's not saying much.

 

We definitely need to tweak the pitching. Stud reliever or another proven starter. The Cubans are a liability.

[Guest JimH]

I would ditch Crede in a second.  He cant hit when it counts. The occasional home run when up by 8 is nice and all, but it doesnt pay for the times when he has men on and cant drive them in when the game is on the line.  This lets sit on our laurels because we have a great record.  Well guess what when the playoffs start the only thing a great record gets you is home advantage.  Wild Card teams beat Divisional Champs all the time.  Crede is batting under .200 in RISP with 2 outs.  Joe Randa is batting .333 in the same respects.  That is the clutch stat. When the playoffs begin we start facing the best of the best from the other team.  We are not facing some 8 ERA scrub anymore, we are facing Schilling, Santana, Johnson types.  And guess what, it can be the difference between one good ab from someone in your lineup.  As much as his defense has been spectacular we cant have a situation where we have a few auto outs at the end of lineup. 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Maybe we should tell the whole story instead of looking at one aspect of a stat.

------------------------------------------------------------------

2005 Hitting With Runners in Scoring Position:

 

Joe Randa: 61 at bats, 23 RBI's, .262 batting average

 

Joe Crede: 52 at bats, 23 RBI's, .269 batting average

-----------------------------------------------------------------

 

Damn near identical.

[DukeNukeEm]

Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity.

 

Stay calm, do what we've done all season and the right guys will be up inthe right sitatuons.

 

We'll get our Opportunities, and we'll always be prepared.

[DukeNukeEm]

Maybe we should tell the whole story instead of looking at one aspect of a stat.

------------------------------------------------------------------

2005 Hitting With Runners in Scoring Position:

 

Joe Randa:  61 at bats, 23 RBI's, .262 batting average

 

Joe Crede:  52 at bats, 23 RBI's, .269 batting average

-----------------------------------------------------------------

 

Damn near identical.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

CAN I GET A "OWNED"?

Edited June 26, 2005 by DukeNukeEm

[southsideirish71]

Although I'm not as concerned with the hitting I wouldn't be mad if we got a new 3rd baseman.  At least Uribe is more than a 1 tool guy.  If he ever gets on base he can steal a base.  He also is a much better bunter than Crede...but that's not saying much.

 

We definitely need to tweak the pitching.  Stud reliever or another proven starter.  The Cubans are a liability.

 

 

Uribe plays good defense and can play 2nd, SS and 3rd. He has a terrible hitting style yet when he makes contact he hits a lot of line drives to the gap. If he could cut down on his swinging at pitches over his head he would be fine. Last year he didnt pull so much and had a better idea of the strikezone. This year he is going for the fences more and doesnt have any control of the strikezone. If he was hitting at all, Crede wouldnt be that much of an issue. However we cannot have 2 guys hitting at the end that cant hit above 240.

[DukeNukeEm]

  However we cannot have 2 guys hitting at the end that cant hit above 240.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But according to a comment you made about 2 sentences earlier, Uribe can hit about .240 with line shots to the gap.