Matt Smith outrighted to Charlotte...

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Aug 25, 2005 -> 09:35 PM)

he is in a slump, thats for sure.  But you have to admit.  He is due, and I want him to be out there when he breaks out of it.  Heres to hoping sept is one of Joe's "on" months.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Whats so comical about this entire thing with Crede is that alot of times people will discard how bad a players been by simply looking at a certain month that he excellend in; there is no such month for Joe Crede. The guy is hornary, won't shortern his swing, and is an automatic out.

 

But he does play some solid defense :headshake

[Rex Hudler]

The whole idea of opening up a roster spot in case the Sox want to make a move makes no sense at all. If the Sox made a trade, they could outright Smith or someone from the 40-man then. They don't have to have one open ahead of time. The moves are often made simultaneously.

 

And capn12, I have been slumming over on other threads more this year. All this winning doesn't find much interesting stuff to talk about for me. When you are winning at the clip the Sox have been, who the hell cares whether Timo plays too much or whether Crede is good enough. Bring that stuff up once, fine, but this whole season has been about the same stuff.

 

I prefer to just sit back and enjoy the winning.

[GoSoxGo]

They arent comparable to crede's defensive ability.  And bellhorn is not your offensive savior.  Thats why nobody wants him, because he isnt that damn good.  On this team, with our budget and our focus, I would rather have dependable defense than mashers in my lineup.  We had that the last few years, and it didnt work.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Budget? Bellhorn was designated for assignment and the season is almost over. It would only cost us $725,000 to claim him. That doesn't seem like a lot of money to me if Crede has a broken finger or wrist that will make him miss the rest of the season.

 

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view...557&format=text

Because Bellhorn is earning a base salary of $2.75 million this year, it seems unlikely that another team would claim him on waivers. Any club doing so would be obligated to pay the estimated $725,000 remaining on Bellhorn's contract.

By the way, Bellhorn isn't exactly a "masher." He draws walks and hits doubles and a few homeruns. Crede is more of a "masher" than Bellhorn is. I would rather see Bellhorn's bat and OBP at the bottom of our lineup than either Crede's or Blum's. If Crede's hand is truly injured and he is going to miss an extended period of time, I would be claiming Bellhorn off waivers right about now. With Matt Smith being outrighted to Charlotte, we do have the extra space on the 40-man roster to claim him.

Edited August 25, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[Colorado Sox Fan]

Budget?  Bellhorn was designated for assignment and the season is almost over.  It would only cost us $725,000 to claim him.  That doesn't seem like a lot of money to me if Crede has a broken finger or wrist that will make him miss the rest of the season.

 

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view...557&format=text

By the way, Bellhorn isn't exactly a "masher."  He draws walks and hits doubles and a few homeruns.  Crede is more of a "masher" than Bellhorn is.  I would rather see Bellhorn's bat and OBP at the bottom of our lineup than either Crede's or Blum's.  If Crede's hand is truly injured and he is going to miss an extended period of time, I would be claiming Bellhorn off waivers right about now.  With Matt Smith being outrighted to Charlotte, we do have the extra space on the 40-man roster to claim him.

"a whopping 109 strikeouts in 283 at-bats."

[GoSoxGo]

"a whopping 109 strikeouts in 283 at-bats." 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What's the difference between making an out on a strikeout like Bellhorn or making an out on a pop-up like Crede? Either way, Bellhorn would have a higher OBP and OPS than both Crede and Blum at the bottom of our lineup. Blum has a .312 OBP. Crede has a .285 OBP. That is just simply disgusting. Bellhorn at least has a .328 OBP which is higher than both Crede's and Blum's. The only reason I can see someone not wanting Bellhorn is for his defense at 3rd base. He is most definately an offensive upgrade over Crede and Blum.

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[redandwhite]

He cleared waivers and therefore must be acquired through trade. Odds are if the White Sox are willing to give up any type of prospect, the Red Sox would pay a good portion of that 725,000 he's owed.

[GoSoxGo]

He cleared waivers and therefore must be acquired through trade.  Odds are if the White Sox are willing to give up any type of prospect, the Red Sox would pay a good portion of that 725,000 he's owed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh, he did clear waivers? Well, that sucks. If Crede is injured, I don't see the Red Sox helping us out in a trade.

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(GoSoxGo @ Aug 26, 2005 -> 01:22 AM)

Oh, he did clear waivers?  Well, that sucks.  If Crede is injured, I don't see the Red Sox helping us out in a trade.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Theo Epstein wants him to go somewhere he'll play. I don't think it would be a problem.

[Guest JimH]

Oh, he did clear waivers?  Well, that sucks.  If Crede is injured, I don't see the Red Sox helping us out in a trade.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It would make sense he cleared waivers because he's on Day 5 or 6 of the DFA and waivers are 72 hrs. as I understand it. I didn't think of this in the other thread, but it makes sense, and it also stands to reason either no one is interested in this guy or a couple of teams are fighting it out for him.

 

Another logical scenario is now that the Red Sox have gotten him thru waivers they might be asking for a lot, because Bellhorm might accept an assignment to the minors just to stay in Boston's organization.

[redandwhite]

Jim,

 

According to some quotes in the globe, Mark Bellhorn's agent is looking for the "perfect place" that would fit his needs and give him a good amount of playing time.

[GoSoxGo]

It would make sense he cleared waivers because he's on Day 5 or 6 of the DFA and waivers are 72 hrs. as I understand it.  I didn't think of this in the other thread, but it makes sense, and it also stands to reason either no one is interested in this guy or a couple of teams are fighting it out for him.

 

Another logical scenario is now that the Red Sox have gotten him thru waivers they might be asking for a lot, because Bellhorm might accept an assignment to the minors just to stay in Boston's organization.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No one was interested in Bellhorn because they either didn't want to pay the $750,000 prorated portion left on his contract or they didn't need a 2nd or 3rd baseman. Since Bellhorn is only under a 1-year deal, only contenders would be interested in him anyways. I'm pretty sure most contenders have quality 2nd and 3rd basemen already. If Crede's finger is broken, we may need a 3rd baseman.

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Mark (of the beast) Hellborn is Satan's spawn. Sorry, just felt like being stupid.

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Aug 26, 2005 -> 04:24 AM)

Mark (of the beast) Hellborn is Satan's spawn. Sorry, just felt like being stupid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

ban him.

[YASNY]

If Bellhorn is so good, why in the hell was DFA'd by Boston? That speaks for itself, I believe.

[GoSoxGo]

If Bellhorn is so good, why in the hell was DFA'd by Boston?  That speaks for itself, I believe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bellhorn got injured with a sprained thumb and struggled to hit so he was placed on the DL. The Red Sox traded for Tony Graffanino as a replacement and he is currently playing way above his head so they have no need for Bellhorn now. Look at Bellhorn's stats last season for Boston. They also speak for itself. Bellhorn does not possess the glove that Crede has but he is damn sure better at the plate. Crede couldn't sniff the OBP that Bellhorn can put up.

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[YASNY]

Bellhorn got injured with a sprained thumb and struggled to hit.  The Red Sox traded for Tony Graffanino and he is currently playing way above his head so they have no need for Bellhorn now.  Look at Bellhorn's stats last season for Boston.  They also speak for itself.  Bellhorn does not possess the glove that Crede has but he is damn sure better at the plate.

 

That was last season. It doesn't mean squat this season.

[GoSoxGo]

That was last season.  It doesn't mean squat this season.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has Crede EVER had a season like Bellhorn had last year?

[YASNY]

Has Crede EVER had a season like Bellhorn had last year?

 

Has Crede ever had a season which caused him to basically be cut?

[GoSoxGo]

Has Crede ever had a season which caused him to basically be cut?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOL, Crede's past two seasons have been horrible enough that he wouldn't be starting on most teams in the MLB. His defense is the only thing saving him. Most guys with a career .251 AVG and career .300 OBP are bench players. Just to put that into perspective, Neifi Perez owns a career .270 AVG and a career .300 OBP. Yes, Neifi Perez is a better hitter than Joe Crede. How pathetic is that? :puke

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[YASNY]

LOL, Crede's past two seasons have been horrible enough that he wouldn't be starting on most teams in the MLB.  His defense is the only thing saving him.  Most guys with a career .251 AVG and career .300 OBP are bench players.  Just to put that into perspective, Neifi Perez owns a career .270 AVG and a career .300 OBP.  Yes, Neifi Perez is a better hitter than Joe Crede. :puke

 

Bellhorn was cut. THIS season.

[GoSoxGo]

Bellhorn was cut.  THIS season.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So because Bellhorn was DFA'ed, that somehow makes Crede better? Give me a break. Crede has worse stats than Neifi freaking Perez. If Crede was on almost any other team than the Sox he damn sure wouldn't be starting with a .239 AVG / .299 OBP last season and a .232 AVG / .285 OBP this season. Those are just godawful numbers to be putting up as a 3rd baseman. Saying that Bellhorn was cut THIS season over and over again doesn't make Crede any better.

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[YASNY]

So because Bellhorn was DFA'ed, that somehow makes Crede better?  Give me a break.  Crede has worse stats than Neifi freaking Perez.  If Crede was on almost any other team than the Sox he damn sure wouldn't be starting with a .239 AVG / .299 OBP last season and a .232 AVG / .285 OBP this season.  Those are just godawful numbers to be putting up as a 3rd baseman.

 

Let's just agree to disagree. I'm not changing my mind and I'm sure you won't either.

[GoSoxGo]

Let's just agree to disagree.  I'm not changing my mind and I'm sure you won't either.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

By the way, are you Hawk Harrelson? Would you rather have Aaron Rowand over Ken Griffey?

 

But seriously, have you been watching Crede at the plate the past two seasons? I just don't see how anyone could defend him. His bat is so bad that he is a defensive replacement in my mind. I would never wish injury on anyone but sadly, if Crede is hurt and Blum replaces him full-time at 3rd base it would actually be an improvement to the bottom of our lineup.

 

Joe Crede: .251 career AVG | .300 career OBP

Geoff Blum: .253 career AVG | .316 career OBP

 

And Blum was brought here to be a BACKUP 3rd baseman!

Edited August 26, 2005 by GoSoxGo

[TLAK]

By the way, are you Hawk Harrelson? Would you rather have Aaron Rowand over Ken Griffey?

 

But seriously, have you been watching Crede at the plate the past two seasons?  I just don't see how anyone could defend him.  His bat is so bad that he is a defensive replacement in my mind.  I would never wish injury on anyone but sadly, if Crede is hurt and Blum replaces him full-time at 3rd base it would actually be an improvement to the bottom of our lineup.

 

Joe Crede:  .251 career AVG | .300 career OBP

Geoff Blum:  .253 career AVG | .316 career OBP

 

And Blum was brought here to be a BACKUP 3rd baseman!

A lot of these comments, not just you GOSOXGO, make me wonder what team folks have been watching this season. The White sox have been winning due to above average pitching and above average defense. Added together this equals outstanding. They lead the league in fewest runs yielded. Giving up the fewest runs means fewer runs are enough to win. They rank 10th in runs scored, yet have won the most games.

 

So the imperative, to keep this machine running, is defense. I don’t think the White Sox should contemplate any personnel change that would weaken the defense.

 

Bellhorn doesn’t have Crede’s glove in the field. As fine a hitter as he is he would be a square peg in a round hole on this team. As Tom Kelly used to tell his rookies on the Twins, if you can't play defense we can't use you.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(GoSoxGo @ Aug 26, 2005 -> 09:03 AM)

By the way, are you Hawk Harrelson? Would you rather have Aaron Rowand over Ken Griffey?

 

But seriously, have you been watching Crede at the plate the past two seasons?  I just don't see how anyone could defend him.  His bat is so bad that he is a defensive replacement in my mind.  I would never wish injury on anyone but sadly, if Crede is hurt and Blum replaces him full-time at 3rd base it would actually be an improvement to the bottom of our lineup.

 

Joe Crede:  .251 career AVG | .300 career OBP

Geoff Blum:  .253 career AVG | .316 career OBP

 

And Blum was brought here to be a BACKUP 3rd baseman!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You know this team is built on defense and pitching. Giving up a great defensive 3rd baseman in Crede to get a 3rd baseman that can't field for crap would be a terrible decision. I would rather have Rowand in center than Jr, but I would rather have Jr. to play primarily DH while giving all of our OFers a breather as well. Come one now man, if you have really been watching this team all year and the way they have been winning you should know that Bellhorn would be an awful fit for this team. Crede is a much better fit. Would I rather have a better bat to go with that great glove? Of course, but other than the top notch 3rd basemen, where are you going to find that?