http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...id=opinionsbox1

 

Even the Washington Post, that bastion of conservative thought thinks Carter is wrong. Just how are we supposed to get anything sone in the middle east when we have this guy running around lending legitimacy to a known terrorist leader? Seems Mr Carter is getting a little senile in his old age and now he's every bit as bad of an EX-president as he was an actual one.

Yeah, I'm really not sure what he thinks he's trying to do either.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...id=opinionsbox1

 

Even the Washington Post, that bastion of conservative thought thinks Carter is wrong. Just how are we supposed to get anything sone in the middle east when we have this guy running around lending legitimacy to a known terrorist leader? Seems Mr Carter is getting a little senile in his old age and now he's every bit as bad of an EX-president as he was an actual one.

Doesn't the fact that they won the Gaza elections grant them legitimacy?

 

How exactly has our policy of totally turning our backs on the people of Gaza and allowing seemingly everyone to wall off that area and block its contact to the outside world strengthened the position of either us or Israel or anyone in the Middle East that we like?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...id=opinionsbox1

 

Even the Washington Post, that bastion of conservative thought thinks Carter is wrong. Just how are we supposed to get anything sone in the middle east when we have this guy running around lending legitimacy to a known terrorist leader? Seems Mr Carter is getting a little senile in his old age and now he's every bit as bad of an EX-president as he was an actual one.

I think you are barking up the same tree I was with the flag. All you will hear about is how repressed the poor Palistinians are, and that they just want a state of their own, and if the eeeevil jooooos would just leave them alone, there would be a paradise in the desert. People wonder why the Jews don't like the Palistinians, they SHOULD wonder why the rest of their arab brothers don't like them. I did find it funny that even Kofi wouldn't back him on this.

I think you are barking up the same tree I was with the flag. All you will hear about is how repressed the poor Palistinians are, and that they just want a state of their own, and if the eeeevil jooooos would just leave them alone, there would be a paradise in the desert. People wonder why the Jews don't like the Palistinians, they SHOULD wonder why the rest of their arab brothers don't like them. I did find it funny that even Kofi wouldn't back him on this.

I wouldn't go that far.

I wouldn't go that far.

If the other arab countries in the area cared one bit for the Pali's, there would be no refugees. Israel isn't the only one that has a wall to keep them out. Egypt doesn't want them, Jordan doesn't want them, and so on. I would go that far.

If the other arab countries in the area cared one bit for the Pali's, there would be no refugees. Israel isn't the only one that has a wall to keep them out. Egypt doesn't want them, Jordan doesn't want them, and so on. I would go that far.

To say they "don't care one bit" is a little extreme considering public support for them in that part of the world is pretty overwhelming. And tangible. Not wanting to take refugees doesn't indicate a lack of support especially when you've got people sending money to Hizballah, etc.

To say they "don't care one bit" is a little extreme considering public support for them in that part of the world is pretty overwhelming. And tangible. Not wanting to take refugees doesn't indicate a lack of support especially when you've got people sending money to Hizballah, etc.

For the Palestinian Authority, in 2003, the US funded $224 million, the EU $187 million, the Arab League $124 million, Norway $53 million, the World Bank $50 million, the United Kingdom $43 million, Italy $40 million, and the last $170 million by others. Norway, all by itself, gave about half as much as the whole Arab League together. $124 million is what, a days oil production? I understand that is 's not like Gaza is a resort destination, or is loaded with heavy industry. Things are tough. This isn't going to sound right, but at least Mexicans in need of work are trying to go TO the work. When you hear of Pali's crossing the border, it is only associated with blowing up busses and schools. Palis in Egypt can never gain citizenship, even if they marry an Egyptian.

 

The United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) defines a Palestinian refugee as a person "whose normal place of residence was Palestine between June 1946 and May 1948, who lost both their homes and means of livelihood as a result of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict". Few of the Palestinian refugees who fled in 1948 are still alive. However, UNRWA's definition of a refugee also covers the descendants of persons who became refugees in 1948 regardless of whether they live in refugee camps or in established, permanent communities or towns. Based on this definition the number of Palestinian refugees has grown from 711,000 in 1950 to over four million registered with the UN in 2002! OK, I am going off on a tangent here. I believe that the 'help' they get from the other Arab countries in the area is the bare minimum they can provide to say that they are doing something, and that if they really cared about them, the other countries could contribute substantially more than they do now.

 

I don't want to get too far off topic, but those are just random numbers that don't do anything by themselves. Now, if they were linked to something to make it proportional, like the GDP of the US, the EU, and the Arab League together (and without bothering to do research my gut feeling says the size of the first 2 dwarfs the size of the 3rd) then they'd be more meaningful.

 

And, what I actually get out of those numbers is that you're saying they provided $124 million of aid in spite of the fact that they don't care one bit. We haven't started talking about charities either. Like I said before... I wouldn't go that far. Sure, those countries might hesitate to take refugees. But the support is there.

 

For s***s and giggles see what happens if you ask 100 random Arabs from different countries who they support or have more positive feelings for... the Palestinians against the Israelis, or us in the war on terror.

Edited April 17, 200818 yr by lostfan

I don't want to get too far off topic, but those are just random numbers that don't do anything by themselves. Now, if they were linked to something to make it proportional, like the GDP of the US, the EU, and the Arab League together (and without bothering to do research my gut feeling says the size of the first 2 dwarfs the size of the 3rd) then they'd be more meaningful.

 

And, what I actually get out of those numbers is that you're saying they provided $124 million of aid in spite of the fact that they don't care one bit. We haven't started talking about charities either. Like I said before... I wouldn't go that far. Sure, those countries might hesitate to take refugees. But the support is there.

 

For s***s and giggles see what happens if you ask 100 random Arabs from different countries who they support or have more positive feelings for... the Palestinians against the Israelis, or us in the war on terror.

Sure, ask away. And while you are at it, them ask them if they would be willing to grant asylum and eventual citizenship to the same Palestinians?

Are you asking the people or the government?

Are you asking the people or the government?

Ask either. That whole area is very territorial. If it is any arab vs a jew or the US, of course they side with the arab. But there is a pecking order among the countries in the region, and the Palestinians are at the bottom of the s***heap.

Ask either. That whole area is very territorial. If it is any arab vs a jew or the US, of course they side with the arab. But there is a pecking order among the countries in the region, and the Palestinians are at the bottom of the s***heap.

Oh there is no doubt about that. Palestinians are known to be troublemakers. But like you said any time there is an Arab (i.e. Muslim) vs. an outsider they go with the Arab almost all the time. So even if there's some degree of hypocrisy, it's still a big deal to them.

There seems to be a pretty negative view on Palestinians in this thread.

Edited April 17, 200818 yr by GoSox05

Ask either. That whole area is very territorial. If it is any arab vs a jew or the US, of course they side with the arab. But there is a pecking order among the countries in the region, and the Palestinians are at the bottom of the s***heap.

 

Many years ago, my mom worked as a waitress near Midway airport. Met all kinds of people. A common strain was that other arabs always said something along the lines of "don't trust the Palestinians."

Many years ago, my mom worked as a waitress near Midway airport. Met all kinds of people. A common strain was that other arabs always said something along the lines of "don't trust the Palestinians."

 

 

Yeah and Nazis used to say "don't trust the jews" and look where that went.

If I could photoshop well I would make a picture of a Xbox Live achievement that says "Achievement Unlocked: Godwin's Law Invoked in First Three Pages"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...id=opinionsbox1

 

Even the Washington Post, that bastion of conservative thought thinks Carter is wrong. Just how are we supposed to get anything sone in the middle east when we have this guy running around lending legitimacy to a known terrorist leader? Seems Mr Carter is getting a little senile in his old age and now he's every bit as bad of an EX-president as he was an actual one.

 

Is this like tossing a flag on the floor?

If I could photoshop well I would make a picture of a Xbox Live achievement that says "Achievement Unlocked: Godwin's Law Invoked in First Three Pages"

 

 

Ok how about I just say that when people are thought of like that it can lead to awful things. No matter how you put it, it's not good.

If the other arab countries in the area cared one bit for the Pali's, there would be no refugees. Israel isn't the only one that has a wall to keep them out. Egypt doesn't want them, Jordan doesn't want them, and so on. I would go that far.

Is that also why we are putting up a wall against Mexicans? We just don't care about them?

Ok how about I just say that when people are thought of like that it can lead to awful things. No matter how you put it, it's not good.

I'm not really invalidating your point or anything, I just think it's funny whenever I see a reference to Hitler or Nazis so soon in a thread.

Is that also why we are putting up a wall against Mexicans? We just don't care about them?

 

And... the attempted thread hijack begins.

And... the attempted thread hijack begins.

 

Just placing the earlier comments in context. Alpha believes the reason they are not invited by other Arab countries is no one cares about them and they are not liked. I believe there are other reasons that are probably higher on the list. Using a familiar analogy usually makes that point easier and better.

Just placing the earlier comments in context. Alpha believes the reason they are not invited by other Arab countries is no one cares about them and they are not liked. I believe there are other reasons that are probably higher on the list. Using a familiar analogy usually makes that point easier and better.

 

eh, not really a good analogy IMO. i would say the circumstances are vastly different. and i'm not arguing this, as I do not feel it is relevant to the thread.

Just placing the earlier comments in context. Alpha believes the reason they are not invited by other Arab countries is no one cares about them and they are not liked. I believe there are other reasons that are probably higher on the list. Using a familiar analogy usually makes that point easier and better.

Well, let's hear your reasons. I would put it along the lines of the area still being very tribal, and that there is generally not alot of movement among the various nations. Egyptians don't want 'em because they are a different type of arab. Is that dislike? I think so, but feel free to call ti something else. But as mentioned earlier, they would be chosen over a Jew. As for the US/Mexican wall, you are half right. A lot of Americans don't want Mexicans here, that don't follow the rules for coming here. Over in the middle east, there are no rules for Palestinians to become an Egyptian or Iranian citizen. because you can't.