Kenny Hates Prospects Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Oct 28, 2008 -> 05:22 PM) Konerko had a .248 BABIP and a LD% of 21.5. He was even more "ridculously unlucky" than Swisher but put up better numbers, yet some people think Konerko must be traded for anything and Swish should be moved to first. GMAB Paulie's past history plus his .333/.483/.591 August and .260/.321/.649 September makes me believe he's at least twice as likely to rebound in '09 than Swisher is to put up the type of numbers you'd expect from a corner OF or 1B playing in the Cell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Hates Prospects Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 (edited) QUOTE (greg775 @ Oct 27, 2008 -> 11:43 PM) You know what? I respectfully disagree. The guy hit .210. That simply sucks. I don't care how many OBP stats, etc., you unveil. The guy had a very miniscule number of hits. Swisher had a s***ty season and I feel his batting average showed that. I mean Sox pitcher Gary Peters back in the day could have outhit Swisher this season. Yep. Swish in April: .211/.368/.333 Swish in May: .176/.272/.275 Swish in June: .315/.402/.630 Swish in July: .193/.327/.349 Swish in August: .224/.337/.539 Swish in September: .164/.235/.311 Yeah, um, Swish was f***ing pathetic last year. He had one great month and everything else was like looking at Andy Gonzalez version 2.0. With his lack of defensive abilities in CF there is absolutely no reason to justify those horrific numbers. Take all the stats you want, in the end the guy hit .193 or lower 3 out of 6 months of the season, he hit .224 or lower 5 out of 6 months out of the season, got on base at a .337 clip or lower 4 out of 6 months of the season, and slugged .349 or lower 4 out of 6 months of the season. June is the only month that I could safely say Brian Anderson couldn't have out-produced him. BTW, for all the people who think batting average is a dumb stat, walks don't drive in runs unless the bases are loaded. Sooner or later Major League hitters need to hit the f***ing baseball. Anyone who tries to come up with stats to put a positive spin on those frighteningly bad numbers above is embarrassing himself and every intelligent baseball fan that reads it. Edited October 29, 2008 by Kenny Hates Prospects Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Hates Prospects Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (greg775 @ Oct 28, 2008 -> 11:26 PM) Is that because you think we can't get anything good for him (which I'd agree with) or the fact you think he's going to help us win a division and advance in the playoffs (I have some serious doubts about that). I don't know if there would be any interest, but I wonder if Swisher and some other high talent headcase like Logan could fetch a guy in a contract year like Beltre, Roberts, or Figgins? If that's the case, I'd gladly send Swisher out of town for one year of a better player plus Type A compensation in the 2010 draft. Ditto with Fields for that matter. I'm liking the overall results from the 2008 draft so far and essentially swapping underachieving players for picks that the Sox might actually do something with would be fine by me. Ideally, I'd like to see Fields, Getz, and Russell or something for Roberts, then Swisher, Logan, and some other crap for Beltre. That way the team is competitive in 2009, and then after the season they've got a bunch of money coming off the books and probably at least four first round draft picks provided they don't sign a Type A (because of Dotel hitting FA as well). Then you sign a stopgap somewhere for 2010 with Beckham likely to arrive by September of that year at the latest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Oct 29, 2008 -> 01:15 AM) Yep. Swish in April: .211/.368/.333 Swish in May: .176/.272/.275 Swish in June: .315/.402/.630 Swish in July: .193/.327/.349 Swish in August: .224/.337/.539 Swish in September: .164/.235/.311 Yeah, um, Swish was f***ing pathetic last year. He had one great month and everything else was like looking at Andy Gonzalez version 2.0. With his lack of defensive abilities in CF there is absolutely no reason to justify those horrific numbers. Take all the stats you want, in the end the guy hit .193 or lower 3 out of 6 months of the season, he hit .224 or lower 5 out of 6 months out of the season, got on base at a .337 clip or lower 4 out of 6 months of the season, and slugged .349 or lower 4 out of 6 months of the season. June is the only month that I could safely say Brian Anderson couldn't have out-produced him. BTW, for all the people who think batting average is a dumb stat, walks don't drive in runs unless the bases are loaded. Sooner or later Major League hitters need to hit the f***ing baseball. Anyone who tries to come up with stats to put a positive spin on those frighteningly bad numbers above is embarrassing himself and every intelligent baseball fan that reads it. Runs scored is a statistic too, and, generally, is just as valuable as RBI is - meaning it's dependent upon every other player around you. A .368 OBP will help you score runs, no matter how many times you are on second base. From what I see, I see a run scoring month, a run producing month, an absolutely fantastic month, and 3 terrible months. Andy Gonzalez has nothing on Nick Swisher. If you would, please inform me the last year where Andy Gonzalez had two months in one season at any level where his OPS for that month was atleast .876. I'm sure he did it, but if you would point it out, that would be fantastic. KTHX. However, Russell Branyan on the other hand... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 29, 2008 -> 04:35 AM) Runs scored is a statistic too, and, generally, is just as valuable as RBI is - meaning it's dependent upon every other player around you. A .368 OBP will help you score runs, no matter how many times you are on second base. From what I see, I see a run scoring month, a run producing month, an absolutely fantastic month, and 3 terrible months. Andy Gonzalez has nothing on Nick Swisher. If you would, please inform me the last year where Andy Gonzalez had two months in one season at any level where his OPS for that month was atleast .876. I'm sure he did it, but if you would point it out, that would be fantastic. KTHX. However, Russell Branyan on the other hand... Runs scored is usually based on what others do especially when you are a guy who doesn't steal. RBI, at least you are the one doing the damage. I said it before, Swisher's walks aren't as valuable when he's batting 7th or 8th and has the worst hitters in the line-up trying to drive him in. The thing I wonder about is Swisher's home/road splits. June was a great month for him. The Sox were in Chicago most of the time. He hit below .200 with very little power on the road for the season. Makes you wonder about why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 29, 2008 -> 10:35 AM) Runs scored is usually based on what others do especially when you are a guy who doesn't steal. RBI, at least you are the one doing the damage. I said it before, Swisher's walks aren't as valuable when he's batting 7th or 8th and has the worst hitters in the line-up trying to drive him in. The thing I wonder about is Swisher's home/road splits. June was a great month for him. The Sox were in Chicago most of the time. He hit below .200 with very little power on the road for the season. Makes you wonder about why? I dont think there is any conspiracy theory behind Swish's bad year. He had an off year, tinkered with his swing, it made it worse, and then struggled trying to break out of it. He had a bad year, thats the end of it. He is a valuable hitter in this lineup if we have more contact and high batting avg guys around him, unfortunately, this wasnt the case this year and he stunk. I look for a nice rebound next season and hopefully better and more productive hitters around him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 29, 2008 -> 10:41 AM) I dont think there is any conspiracy theory behind Swish's bad year. He had an off year, tinkered with his swing, it made it worse, and then struggled trying to break out of it. He had a bad year, thats the end of it. He is a valuable hitter in this lineup if we have more contact and high batting avg guys around him, unfortunately, this wasnt the case this year and he stunk. I look for a nice rebound next season and hopefully better and more productive hitters around him. One big risk is if Swisher now is what he showed and has another bad year in 2009, his "affordable" contract becomes an albatross. Owed $6.75 million in 2010, $9 million in 2011 and a $12 million option in 2012 with a buyout. Unless you open up a spot in the OF or 1b where he can play everyday, if the rest of the league still thinks he's affordable and willing to give something up for him, I think KW should trade him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 29, 2008 -> 12:12 PM) One big risk is if Swisher now is what he showed and has another bad year in 2009, his "affordable" contract becomes an albatross. Owed $6.75 million in 2010, $9 million in 2011 and a $12 million option in 2012 with a buyout. Unless you open up a spot in the OF or 1b where he can play everyday, if the rest of the league still thinks he's affordable and willing to give something up for him, I think KW should trade him. But you have to take the risk that he has a good year and then you get better value if you want to unload him. Its a balance between whether you think unloading him after giving him only one chance vs unloading him after he has multiple chances. Right now, it just makes sense for the org to keep him to either contribute or increase his value, but Im not sure if it makes sense for the TEAM to keep him. Also Im not sure by 2012 that 12 million will be more than a slightly above avg player salary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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