WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 06:58 PM) Don't be such a stat whore. Don't get mad at me because you didn't bother to look at Upton's numbers this year. Do you really think we could get anything worth a damn if we traded Getz? When did I ever claim that? Instead of inventing desperate straw man arguments to save face, why don't you just admit that you weren't aware that Upton is having a terrible year? If the Rays traded Upton they'd get a killing. They'd get a lot less right now than they'd get after Upton rebounded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 06:58 PM) Don't be such a stat whore. Do you really think we could get anything worth a damn if we traded Getz? If the Rays traded Upton they'd get a killing. Value in a trade is not always the best indicator of a player's true value. Yeah, I'd rather have Upton than Getz too...but I don't think Getz is a .670 OPS player long-term. I think Getz looks like one of those guys that you really like having on your team because he always does something positive. And Upton...I'm kinda worried he'll never get to where he's supposed to be, and will wind up being a fringey player watching his brother kill the league. But we'll see. If nothing else, Getz's trade value is no wehre near where his value to the team would be if he can put together a solid season with teh bat (.290ish average) next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:05 PM) Getz has 2 bombs, 18 db's an 2 3b's, and. Upton has 10 bombs, 31 db's and 3 3b's. See the difference? Yeah, one has a lot more power. But we already knew that. My point is that Upton is having a Getz-like year, not that he has Chris Getz's ceiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:06 PM) And Upton...I'm kinda worried he'll never get to where he's supposed to be, and will wind up being a fringey player watching his brother kill the league. But we'll see. I think that a lot of GMs agree. If Upton had Jeter's attitude on the field, they'd probably be less concerned about Upton's current OPS+ of 74 (which probably has at least something to do with the fact that he went under the knife 10 1/2 months ago). But Upton's lackadaisical playing style is likely going to give some GMs pause. At the very least, they'd probably want to see what he'll do next year before giving up a king's ransom for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:18 PM) I think that a lot of GMs agree. If Upton had Jeter's attitude on the field, they'd probably be less concerned about Upton's current OPS+ of 74 (which probably has at least something to do with the fact that he went under the knife 10 1/2 months ago). But Upton's lackadaisical playing style is likely going to give some GMs pause. At the very least, they'd probably want to see what he'll do next year before giving up a king's ransom for him. Plus...that seems to be a weird injury he's having, or at least it's really hurting his game and he's not recovering well from it. Either way, if I were the Rays, I'd move one of them. If I'm ready to give up on Upton, I move him and shoot for a pitcher or a AA level outfielder. Someone will gamble on him (They got Garza for Delmon "Hell of a bat throw at that Ump" Young). If I think this was just an injury down year and he'll be back next ST where he was in the 2008 playoffs, then move crawford, bring the kid up, and try to reload with a AAA pitcher and a new closer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:31 PM) Plus...that seems to be a weird injury he's having, or at least it's really hurting his game and he's not recovering well from it. Either way, if I were the Rays, I'd move one of them. If I'm ready to give up on Upton, I move him and shoot for a pitcher or a AA level outfielder. Someone will gamble on him (They got Garza for Delmon "Hell of a bat throw at that Ump" Young). If I think this was just an injury down year and he'll be back next ST where he was in the 2008 playoffs, then move crawford, bring the kid up, and try to reload with a AAA pitcher and a new closer. I agree about the injury effect being odd. I'd probably move Crawford at this point, UNLESS they're convinced that Upton is just a complete whack-job and lack confidence in him getting back to form next year. They'd have a smaller market for Upton that would drive down the bidding war, but there's always that one GM who will bite. If I were a GM, I'd be suspicious of the Rays unloading Upton after a down year and surgery. He's arb-eligible through 2012, and would have significant trade value for the next couple of years. I'd suspect that Upton was damaged goods (either physically or mentally). I wonder if the Rays intentionally leaked the news about Upton being on the block to serve as a "motivating factor." Edited September 29, 2009 by WCSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Getz and Upton? Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 08:17 PM) Getz and Upton? Really? QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:07 PM) My point is that Upton is having a Getz-like year, not that he has Chris Getz's ceiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Even still Upton's ceiling is amazing. I'd give up a hell of a lot to bring a guy like him in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 08:45 PM) Even still Upton's ceiling is amazing. I'd give up a hell of a lot to bring a guy like him in. I'm sure that some GM would give up a lot (Sabean comes to mind). Like I said above, I think it's really odd that they'd shop him (1) coming off of a really bad season and (2) when he's arb-eligible for three more years. After thinking about it, I strongly suspect that their front office leaked this info on purpose to put a fire under Upton's ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 08:50 PM) I'm sure that some GM would give up a lot (Sabean comes to mind). Like I said above, I think it's really odd that they'd shop him (1) coming off of a really bad season and (2) when he's arb-eligible for three more years. After thinking about it, I strongly suspect that their front office leaked this info on purpose to put a fire under Upton's ass. On the other hand though...they have genuine reason to be excited about that other OF. So if you're a GM, you be a bit nervous, but you talk to your scouts, you talk to your doctors, and maybe you're the team that has a chance to steal a legit talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 08:57 PM) On the other hand though...they have genuine reason to be excited about that other OF. So if you're a GM, you be a bit nervous, but you talk to your scouts, you talk to your doctors, and maybe you're the team that has a chance to steal a legit talent. Yeah, that's possible as well. It's also possible that the Rays just want to get a feel for what Upton's worth right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (son of a rude @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 03:13 PM) The only untouchable player on any of Reinsdorf's teams wore the number 23. I'd deal Gavin Floyd before Dan Hudson right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Hates Prospects Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 10:57 PM) On the other hand though...they have genuine reason to be excited about that other OF. So if you're a GM, you be a bit nervous, but you talk to your scouts, you talk to your doctors, and maybe you're the team that has a chance to steal a legit talent. Even at his lowest point, Upton would cost so much it would be hard to qualify it as a steal anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 08:17 PM) Getz and Upton? Really? QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 28, 2009 -> 07:07 PM) My point is that Upton is having a Getz-like year, not that he has Chris Getz's ceiling. So then you admit you are wasting your time making a comparison you don't even believe. That's what we need is more inane arguments on Soxtalk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 05:47 AM) So then you admit you are wasting your time making a comparison you don't even believe. That's what we need is more inane arguments on Soxtalk. Upton and Getz have nearly identical OPS and OPS+ this season. Thus, it's not inaccurate to say that Upton is having a Getz-like season at the plate. Making a point via the comparison of two unlike things is not a revolutionary concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 08:16 AM) Upton and Getz have nearly identical OPS and OPS+ this season. Thus, it's not inaccurate to say that Upton is having a Getz-like season at the plate. Making a point via the comparison of two unlike things is not a revolutionary concept. So you aren't comparing him to Getz, but you are... That makes total sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 07:52 AM) So you aren't comparing him to Getz, but you are... That makes total sense. The next time that Upton posts an OBP of .306 and slugs .360 over the course of a full season, I'll be sure to compare him to Barry Bonds or Willie Mays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshot7 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 This doesn't think either will be dealt: http://www.tampabay.com/sports/baseball/ra...fseason/1039549 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (longshot7 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 02:26 PM) This doesn't think either will be dealt: http://www.tampabay.com/sports/baseball/ra...fseason/1039549 Regardless, Desmond Jennings is ready to play. He's got to play somewhere too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son of a rude Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 I'd deal Gavin Floyd before Dan Hudson right now. Maybe just because their contract status's, but i still wouldn't. I doubt Hudson will be as good as Gavin. Gavin has cy young type stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (longshot7 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 01:26 PM) This doesn't think either will be dealt: http://www.tampabay.com/sports/baseball/ra...fseason/1039549 That article stinks. Basically everyone is coming back, and none of the kids has a spot yet? Iwamura will not be the biggest name to not come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (son of a rude @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 12:16 PM) Maybe just because their contract status's, but i still wouldn't. I doubt Hudson will be as good as Gavin. Gavin has cy young type stuff. I agree with this. That said, I wouldn't want to trade Hudson right now either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 03:25 PM) That article stinks. Basically everyone is coming back, and none of the kids has a spot yet? Iwamura will not be the biggest name to not come back. Exactly, and also the trade for Sean Rodriquez and the emergence of Reid Brignac nearly necessitate a move of some kind, not just call for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshot7 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 29, 2009 -> 12:25 PM) That article stinks. Basically everyone is coming back, and none of the kids has a spot yet? Iwamura will not be the biggest name to not come back. You might be right, but wouldn't their Beat writer know more about them than Sox fans who don't live in the market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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