Meh.

 

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/...eball-hall-fame

No Minnie

hoynsie paul hoynes

Jim Kaat, with over 280 wins, received 10 of needed 12 votes to reach Hall of Fame. So close. #halloffame.

 

CST_soxvan Daryl Van Schouwen

Santo (15 votes), Kaat (10); Hodges (9); Minoso (9); Oliva (8); Buzzie Bavasi, Ken Boyer, C. Finley, Allie Reynolds, L.Tiant less than 3

 

No Minnie

 

He didn't deserve it either. Less, than Ronnie imo.

I worked for the promo tour of This Old Cub and I met Santo. He was really cool. I'm happy he finally made it even if he wont be alive to see it.

I never saw him play, so I have no idea if Santo belongs or not. I looked up his stats, and they're not overwhelming, but neither are Brooks Robinson's. Robinson was, by the way, a much better fielder according to the stats. I've heard Cubs fans and cheerleaders in the Chicago press talk about how good of a fielder Santo was, but even in his Gold Glove seasons he was making 20+ errors per game. In 23 years, Robinson made 263 errors at 3b (.971 percentage). In 15 seasons, Santo made 317 errors at 3b (.954).

 

That got me thinking. Look at Santo's stats vs. Robin Ventura.

 

Santo 15 Season Avg: 163H - 26 2b - 25 HR - 96 RBI - .277 BA - .464 SLG - .826 OPS - 317 Errors - .954 Fielding Percentage

Robin 16 Season Avg: 147H - 26 2b - 23 HR - 92 RBI - .267 BA - .444 SLG - .806 OPS - 220 Errors - .958 Fielding Percentage

 

I'm not really making an argument for Ventura either, but I think Santo might fall more into the Hall of Very Good category. I'd still rather see him in than Clemens, Bonds, or any of the other guys who cheated, though.

I never saw him play, so I have no idea if Santo belongs or not. I looked up his stats, and they're not overwhelming, but neither are Brooks Robinson's. Robinson was, by the way, a much better fielder according to the stats. I've heard Cubs fans and cheerleaders in the Chicago press talk about how good of a fielder Santo was, but even in his Gold Glove seasons he was making 20+ errors per game. In 23 years, Robinson made 263 errors at 3b (.971 percentage). In 15 seasons, Santo made 317 errors at 3b (.954).

 

That got me thinking. Look at Santo's stats vs. Robin Ventura.

 

Santo 15 Season Avg: 163H - 26 2b - 25 HR - 96 RBI - .277 BA - .464 SLG - .826 OPS - 317 Errors - .954 Fielding Percentage

Robin 16 Season Avg: 147H - 26 2b - 23 HR - 92 RBI - .267 BA - .444 SLG - .806 OPS - 220 Errors - .958 Fielding Percentage

 

I'm not really making an argument for Ventura either, but I think Santo might fall more into the Hall of Very Good category. I'd still rather see him in than Clemens, Bonds, or any of the other guys who cheated, though.

 

Don't make the mistake of comparing the dead ball era with the steroid era statistically.

Don't make the mistake of comparing the dead ball era with the steroid era statistically.

I won't. I also don't think Ventura took steroids, so his stats aren't inflated, and might actually be adversely affected by pitchers who were juicing and playing in the era of pitching changes and specialists.

 

And, as I said, I'm not making an argument for Ventura to be in the HOF, it's just interesting to compare his stats with Santo's. To me, anyway.

I won't. I also don't think Ventura took steroids, so his stats aren't inflated, and might actually be adversely affected by pitchers who were juicing and playing in the era of pitching changes and specialists.

 

And, as I said, I'm not making an argument for Ventura to be in the HOF, it's just interesting to compare his stats with Santo's. To me, anyway.

 

Even besides that we are talking about things like Maple bats, better conditioning, lower mound, smaller strike zone, machine wound ball, etc.

If you compare Santo to his peers, he begins to look much better. Plus defensively, he covered his position. No doubt he was a bubble candidate. One of those that there are great reasons for, and against.

He didn't deserve it either. Less, than Ronnie imo.

 

Except he did.

 

9 time all star, 3 GG, .298 avg, .398 OBP, .848 OPS, and thats without his negro league numbers and history.

Except he did.

 

9 time all star, 3 GG, .298 avg, .398 OBP, .848 OPS, and thats without his negro league numbers and history.

 

And those are incredible numbers for that era.

Even besides that we are talking about things like Maple bats, better conditioning, lower mound, smaller strike zone, machine wound ball, etc.

Still, many of Santo's contemporaries and players that had overlap on either side of his career managed to put up good power numbers. Prior to the steroid era, the bulk of the great power hitters in history came from the 50's, 60's and 70's. Who knows how the all-time list of hrs would look without PEDs. It might still look like the one I grew up with. Aaron, Ruth, Mays, FRobinson,...

My gripe on Santo is that Wrigley is a homer friendly park. If Williams, Santo and Banks were the HOF players that they are how was that team that bad.....oh and they had a pitcher from that team go to the HOF as well

I'd still like to go for Frank, but the Hall of Fame just lost whatever remaining credibility it had with me. It's honoring McCarver for "broadcast excellence":

 

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/story/1635747...duction-weekend