Chimpton
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Posts posted by Chimpton
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2 minutes ago, HOFHurt35 said:
I still think this is a placeholder hire to get by, a team sale will be coming within the next 24 months.
Just my opinion.
A team sale in the next 24 hours is what is needed.
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Whilst Hahn and Williams getting fired is good news, the fact is that if JR is the man picking their replacements then I will hold fire on any optimism for improvement.
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1 hour ago, ron883 said:
He tried his best at least
That is even more worrying, if that was his best!
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1 minute ago, Buehrle>Wood said:
– The Chicago White Sox are conducting a series of internal interviews to determine whether dramatic changes are needed inside the front office or the coaching staff. This has been one of the most disappointing and painful seasons in chairman Jerry Reinsdorf’s tenure.
Rick do you think dramatic changes are needed?
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1 hour ago, hankchifan said:
Burger 3 run homer at Dodgers Stadium tonight. Worst Hahn’s move of the year. Lynn won against the Marlins last night also, a 4 hitter.
To be fair no one on here was saying keep Lynn, some even wanted him Dfa'd, the fact that he is pitching better since leaving, like Diekman, like Graveman and Middleton (small sample I know) suggests that the improvement may be due to leaving the loser culture of the White Sox, or getting coached properly. The poor form of Giolito in 4 games since leaving might suggest otherwise, but it seems more than just a coincidence that so many are pitching better since leaving.
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18 minutes ago, Dominikk85 said:
I think it is good that it came out. Doesn't help for this season of course but the season is lost anyway and this means that the sox leadership will be forced to do something about it instead of ignoring it.
Maybe it means they can have a fresh start next year with less anarchy in the clubhouse.
Only if they have a stronger manager and the players who are causing the present poor culture are willing to change or are no longer at the club.
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3 hours ago, Chick Mercedes said:
Well if this is an indicator that they are gonna continue to go with an approach of throwing a bunch of bodies and question marks at right field, it’s a bad strategy. I’m hoping they have a more serious plan in mind.
Even if Hahn has a plan it is bound to be a cheap one and not very good. But eventually one of these reclamation projects will come good and Hahn will think everything was worth it.
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43 minutes ago, tray said:
Hahn could have had Cody Bellinger for next to nothing compared to his deal for Benintendi. The fool then trades away Burger, one of the most popular players on the team, a guy who brought joy to the clubhouse and to fans. His long right handed swings would have yielded many more HR and wins for the Sox. Hahn is a damn fool. Why is he still the GM? Fire him and let KW take over as interim GM until a new GM is hired. Serve up some accountability.
Trading away Burger was a difficult to understand decision except that they aren't going to bin Moncada, and unless they swallow a big chunk of salary no one would take him, so that is 3B blocked, they are not getting rid of Eloy so that is DH blocked and they are clearly investing in Vaughn as a 'franchise player' with all the positive stories about him, so that is 1B blocked. So in Hahn' mind getting a prospect for Burger made sense.
But that ignores what you say about his fan appeal and HR potential. Basically Burger was a victim of the badly built squad by Hahn which is overloaded with 1B/DH types and where Moncada and Eloy got huge deals early and have failed to deliver on them, there is still some hope that an injury free Eloy could deliver but I can't see Moncada suddenly improving.
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3 hours ago, tray said:
Of course not everyone is a racist but you cannot deny how remnants of it remain in baseball decades after Jackie Robinson, even among players like Josh Donaldson and announcers like Hamilton.
As far as who instigated the fight that is arguable. Do you defend Ramirez for his post game comments that TA has been disrespecting baseball for a long time ? That was basically an admission that he was holding a grudge against Anderson. And do you think that Hamilton announcing "Down goes Anderson, down goes Anderson" was appropriate? This stuff is part of baseball...it is unfortunate but it still exists. TA should have been the bigger man , walked away, but it would have been nice if Ramirez got taken down by Vaughn and others before the fight ensued.
I agree with you about racism still existing both in sport and society as a whole, but I genuinely can't see that as a big factor in this incident. But maybe that is because I am not African American and therefore have never been the victim of racism whether overt or covert. I respect your opinion, even if I cannot completely agree with it.
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3 minutes ago, tray said:
The perception of TA is what I was referring to. The denial that racist views are part of the reactions to this TA impress me about as much as Josh Donaldson calling TA "Jackie" and then denying he is a racist. Down goes Anderson, down goes Anderson... then getting dragged off by Vaughn. That was just too perfect of a scenario for some people, but go ahead and enjoy. Yea, he deserved it and that trumps team loyalty and even results in TA getting twice the penalty that instigator received, even though he brushed back an umpire.
As far as minority vs minority, some here may recall how a lot of people hated Ali (thus the "down goes Anderson") and wanted him to get beaten, even when he fought other African Americans. There was just something about him they didn't like, and sure, OK, it had nothing to do with race. Give me a break.
Sorry but TA was the instigator, he threw down his glove and put his fists up in a fighting pose just because someone pointed at him.
I am not denying that racism happens in sport as in real life, but the reaction here has more to do with him getting knocked down after trying to act like the tough guy.
'Team loyalty' should not be blind, if one of my players is being an idiot I will call that no matter what his ethnicity.
As for your point about Ali (before my time) undoubtedly some of that was racism but also some of it was because of the arrogant bragging persona that he adopted before fights.
I resent the implication that anyone who doesn't support TA in this is automatically a racist.
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27 minutes ago, tray said:
There is a lot of bias toward TA. There can be no doubt that some of it is due to the fact that he is an African American player...a group that did not have one player in the MLB until Jackie Robinson came up with the Dodgers. That group is still under-represented in the league. It is interesting to note how some perceived this fight from who they think started it to how they characterize AV for dragging TA off.
But he was squaring up to another 'non-white' player, so how does that fit in to your narrative?
TA did start it by throwing his glove down and then putting his fists up. It is not as if it was a fight between an African American player and a White player and people are siding with the White player. People are laughing at TA because he squared up like a tough guy and then got knocked down by one punch.
And as for AV he was trying to help out a teammate by saving him from further harm, the fact he is White is irrelevant. And not everyone is praising him some on here think he should have been throwing punches, so that equally doesn't fit your narrative.
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25 minutes ago, Texsox said:
Grandahl is one of us.
In 2020 he signed a contract expecting to be part of a window of multiple championship opportunities. Like hundreds of thousands of Sox fans, he was excited and pumped for the future. He thought one day he and Leury the Legend would be on a float heading down Michigan Avenue. 😆
By 2023 he is part of the biggest s%*# show in sports and like hundreds of thousands of Sox fans is saying "f*** this s%*#, this franchise sucks, I want out".
Like many of us, by the All Star break he didn't want to watch any games. He wanted to go to the lake with his family. Can we blame him?
He too was fooled by JR and his minions. Lucy pulled the football on him.
We can look away, he can't. Bwahahaha. Enjoy the millions, you earned it for enduring years of this.
He's one of us. Welcome to the nightmare.
You could appreciate him by spelling his name correctly!
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12 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:
No. The NHL is a physical game played within an enclosed space, and the league has largely eliminated fighting with the instigator, third men in and other offensive minded rule changes. Teams do not have the luxury of carrying a "goon" in their active roster.
Also, there is a difference in leverage in skates vs. firm ground, and NHL players have helmets and other equipment which protects the player in a fight, whereas outside of a batting helmet MLB players are more exposed to a fight injury, plus you have guys like Eloy coming close to injury just observing and milling around.
With the recent rule eliminating allowed contact with the catcher, the remaining physical contact plays (HBP and what should be unintentional contact at a base) are not common and typically do not rise to the level of fighting.
That was my best bit of this whole sorry incident, only Eloy could potentially injure himself by getting trodden on by one of his own players.
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2 hours ago, tray said:
Other than in NHL games, I have seldom seen teams in any sport back off and let two players go mono y mono. In this fight even the umpire allowed Ramirez to clear him out with one hand and that move did not result in any additional suspension. Forget this fight for a second, and ask yourself if MLB should allow itself to go down the same rabbit hole as the NHL with fighting and for that matter, what should be the policy of teams when a player gets into a fight? Let him alone or have his back and defend him ?
In football (soccer) the referee always stands back when there is a scuffle in order to see which players needs punishing. Not sure if that is the same for baseball, but it could explain why the umpire took a step back and let them fight. Mind you scuffles are rare in soccer, and rarely have I seen actual punches being thrown, the occasional headbutt.
The players did rush to intervene but by then Anderson was on his ass. Like most sporting fights only 2 or 3 actual punches were thrown, it is just that usually one of the protaganists isn't decked by one of the punches.
Basically, this whole sorry affair would normally be nothing by now but because Anderson was actually floored it has been made into a bigger thing. Obviously as the White Sox are losing and dressingroom unrest is rumoured we tend to read more into this incident in terms of did the players support Anderson enough and if they didn't does that mean they don't like him.
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TA's reaction of still spoiling for a fight despite being knocked on his ass reminds me of this Monty Python scene
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34 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said:
This isn't a playground full of second graders out on recess. This is professional sports. It's an absurdly bad look not to retaliate in a situation where reactions are read as indicators of pride, culture, cohesiveness, and brotherhood.
No manager is going to punish his guys for suspensions they may receive while sticking up for their teammates. Outside of, apparently, Pedro Grifol, most managers would applaud such a reaction.
And TA didn't start that s%*#, Ramirez's soft ass started it. TA didn't stand over him long enough for Jose to get in his feels about it. Then he poked his finger right in TA's grill. It's game on at that point.
I'm not a violent person and don't condone violence or fighting, in general. Sports are different...teammates are closer to family. Again, brotherhood. If my real-life brother were involved in a brawl, I'm going to be right there beside him serving pain to whomever I can. I'd do the same for a teammate.
Sorry but TA did start it, by throwing his glove to the floor hockey style and putting up his fists like a comedy boxer. If that is how he reacts when someone points at him he has serious anger issues.
And as for saying that punching someone in retaliation would show club pride that is utter macho drivel. Anyway retaliate for what? TA squared up, threw the first punch, then got knocked on his ass, so Ramirez was just retaliating TA's childish tantrum.
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9 minutes ago, soulfly said:
Weird, and I agree about the brotherhood part, but no one coming to his aid tells you everything you need to know how they feel about him.
But they did come to his aid by helping his wobbly ass away from further embarrassment.
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2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:
I think it depends.
That Rob Fick/Weaver brouhaha early in 2000 definitely helped to propel that team forward in the first half of the season IMO.
I would agree with you but this season is over and any effect of team bonding over a fight would have worn off by next season. Maybe something similar at the start of the season could have helped bring the clubhouse together but I think the underlying issues with this squad are far greater than being solved by a bit of team spirit.
But certainly this is a clubhouse that appears to have no spirit, no team ethic, no leadership from within and no leadership from above.
I think the biggest laugh from this incident was that Eloy managed to injure himself and it wasn't through any opposition violence it was get his toe trod on probably by one of his own team. That just about sums up this team.
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1 hour ago, tray said:
I agree with Mookie.
Vaughn and the White Sox acted like it was entirely Tim's fault and dragged him off the field. It was a pitiful show of weakness by a team already being accused of internal dysfunction, a lack of leadership and cohesiveness in the clubhouse.
It was TA's fault, he squared up like a tough guy and got put on his backside, Vaughn and the others were protecting him from himself, he was clearly concussed and barely able to walk, letting him get knocked over again would be stupid.
Not punching someone doesnt make you weak, violence is the first resort of the 'emotional retard'. It showed more 'leadership' for Vaughn to step in and protect a team mate by removing him from further harm than if he flew in like a meathead and punched a few guys.
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2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:
Would it be worth it to unify or galvanize the team around a "common external enemy" ultimately is the question...Grifol certainly proved incapable.
Maybe but that 'siege mentality' only works for a short time. I think it would take more than a good fight to sort this clubhouse out. And I certainly don't think Grifol knocking out an opponent in retaliation would make hima better manager all of a sudden.
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29 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:
Well, the argument is that the team whose player gets "knocked out" has a NATO-like responsibility to back up their teammate. regardless of the circumstances, for the sake of team chemistry.
Would they get that chemistry by also serving suspensions? TA got knocked on his backside due to his own stupidity, more players getting suspended for punching opponents would not prove anything other than they are just as stupid as TA.
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Utter nonsense, so Betts thinks more White Sox players should have been throwing punches? How come no other Guardians players threw punches? Does that mean they don't support Ramirez?
As a former teacher the 'fight' was just like so many playground fights, after 1 or 2 punches it virtually always degenerates into pushing and shoving and 'hold me back' posturing.
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1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:
Clevinger pitched 6 innings 3 H, 1 R 6 K.
Colas hit his 3rd HR a 2 run shot.
Moncada went 2 for 3 , 2 double, RBI and a walk
Grandal 2 for 3 , RBI and a walk
Andrus 2 for 4 , bases loaded double 3 RBI
Robert 1 for 1 with 2 SB, an outfield assist when he gunned down Bauers at 3rd base and a walk. He also sprained his pinky finger on his right hand when he stole 3rd and left the game.
Santos pitched 2 innings in relief after coming off the bereavement list. 0 hits, 0 runs, 3 K for his 3rd save.
When they play like this they hint at what could have been, consistency is a big issue for this team, they are either good or bad, there is nothing inbetween.
Plus it is always good to beat the Yankees no matter how good they are playing.
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3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:
Why would Hahn lie about that though? TBH, I thought it was more embarrassing that he confirmed there is a player who gets to nap in the clubhouse.
Why would Hahn even mention it? He slammed Middleton for breaking the 'what goes on in the clubhouse rule' and then promptly did it himself by teasing this story and saying Middleton himself apologised for being unprofessional.
Hahn would say anything to try an wriggle off the hook of his own incompetence. By teasing this story he just ensured it stays in the media and speculation longer than if he just said that he refuted Middleton's claims.
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After an exhaustive search, Getz named GM/VP
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted