LDF

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 27, 2015 -> 12:14 AM) Oh OK, I see the confusion. Here's the Josh Bell prospect from Pitt. http://www.baseball-reference.com/register...id=bell--007jos thanks for that link here is the org link i got from mlb trades.... there link is what i used and hit it. the josh link is to the ling i showed you http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/pittsburgh-pirates

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 27, 2015 -> 01:25 AM) They "ALREADY SIGNED SOMEONE THIS WEEK AND DECLARED HIM THEIR 1B." That's what you're ignoring. Here is the statement of their GM: That happened several days ago yet you're still talking about them as though they have need of a 1b to bridge to their prospect. They already signed that bridge. The conversation should be over yet on Dec. 26 you still brought them up, while simultaneously either ignoring that signing or not knowing about it. ok.... what is your problem i am admitting this already and again this is my post, i admitted it.... i said they already address this.... and maybe i should have added a "and" in front of 2b trade. but you are always right.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 27, 2015 -> 01:09 AM) Pitt did exactly what you might expect a smart team to do with a 1b prospect who is 1-2 years away. They spent a small amount to cover a platoon this year at 1b on a guy who hasn't got a lot of 1b experience but put up a .380 OBP last year. 2 years, $8 million. Less than what the White Sox wanted the Pirates to take on for LaRoche last year, and the Pirates got a guy who performed a lot better. Jaso and Morse give them a 1b platoon with some tolerable performace at the back side of their lineup this year, then Bell steps in either in the 2nd half of this year or to start 2017 along with Jaso. White Sox wanted them to take on salary with LaRoche but wouldn't give them anything to make it worth it, so they signed someone cheaper who performed better and was a better fit for their roster. No one here pointed out that Pitt no longer is in the 1b market, so I did. If you DFAd LaRoche and he cleared waivers, they might still offer him a minor league deal with an option to ST, but they're not in the market for LaRoche any more and should no longer be mentioned with his name. If you included Tim Anderson and asked them to pick up $10 million, they might do that. in a way, i implied it in my post, but that is beside the point, pitt has said as much, they wanted someone to bridge the position for their prospect who may be a yr away. that was why i kept mention laroche to pitt in my mock trades. but if pitt is having some so called problems with marte and what he might make next yr, i didn't think they, pitt will accept laroche. again like you said, unless they sweeten the pkg. which they didn't . anything else on this front was included.... later ..... lets not loose the point of my post.... i was congratulating blacksox13 for a nice post and mention there still may be another team in play, and that is pitt and well look at the post. btw after the fact, leake was signed by pitt...... which i said they needed another sp...... and it is my fault for reacting to some posters who is always doing this kind of s***. i should have know better.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 27, 2015 -> 12:59 AM) Pitt signed John Jaso earlier this week and emphatically declared he was the LH hitting side of their 1b platoon with Morse. I seriously doubt they're looking for a 1b unless you give them a bargain. i know, but some how someone posted about bell. if you look at my org #69 i said just that. http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...97784&st=60 i am not looking for a confrontation, i am just explaining myself. ....

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 27, 2015 -> 01:00 AM) Uh, Bell is only 23 dude. ahh then i was wrong, the josh bell i was looking at i found on baseball ref http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/belljo01.shtml different bell.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 11:56 PM) Pass the bong this way please! and the incriminating pict of someone with well....

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 04:53 PM) Marte isn't being traded. None of the OF's are. Josh Bell is the stud prospect that will be ready but he was moved to 1B. McCutchen, Marte, and Polanco will be in the Pirates OF ok, josh bell is a stud prospect at age 29 yrs old, and next yr he will be 30 and with another 1b in front of him whom they just got. however as you said, marte is the question. i tried to look for the article i read and i can't find it. but it mention that possibility of trading, b/c of 2 of'er prospects. one who is 24 yrs old and the pitt is interested him. the other may be ready next yr -2017 who is 22 yrs old. but all this is on the idea, will pitt deal with the gradual increase of salary????? they have a real nice looking farm and have been successful in developing their prospects. but who know what they will do. i suggested this as a possibility.....

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 03:00 PM) Why trade Marte, or Polanco for that matter? well, i would know the whole answer for that.... but i think, if i had to assume, polanco is 23 yrs old, and with his arb yrs sever more yrs away... whereas, marte is 26 yrs old, in the middle of a contract which is, i don't know if one would say is back loaded. these yrs now will see his salary increase. also remember the pirates are on a very strict budget and they do have a team to be taken serious. it is all about the money. look at baseball ref i http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...shtml#contracts

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 03:35 PM) Pirates have Cole, Liriano, Niese, Vogelsong, and Locke in the rotation with Taillon, Kingham, and Glanslow on the cusp of the majors. They have a good prospect in Hanson that will take over for Walker at 2B. There is 0 chance they trade Marte unless it is a massive haul. He is probably the best LFer in the game. and some are saying that they still may need another sp, as a stop gap for the young prospects. in addition, the other teams in the division are positioning themselves to also address their needs. lets look at stl, why would they still be looking for an of'er when they have a young piscotty in the outfield. a player who i like a lot,but stl does not want to put anything to trust or luck. the same thing with pitt sp, they been talking about the prospect who is ready to step in the outfield and use marte to fix, acquire other pieces. now with the cost of fa's, they are looking to extend mccutchen.... i will also be in agreement that if they move marte, it would be a bad move. but pitt, they are limited with salary and need to look at the future and still look at competing. that 0 chance is really not a hard and fast decision .

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 04:42 AM) Seattle: they are at about 142M for committed salary and arbitration players and that number doesn't include filling out the rest of the roster with league minimum players. Seattle needs a CF so they are likely looking the likes of Span, Jackson, Fowler and maybe even Parra if they can afford them. Padres: they are rebuilding so they are no threat. Heck, they are trying to trade salary (Kemp/Shields) so we can cross them off. SF: they are at 164M in committed salary and arbitration players and that doesn't include filling out their roster. If they look at signing a FA its likely one of the second tier players. TOR: they are at about 132M for committed and arbitration players not including filling out their roster. Interesting team in that they would seem to have some wiggle room but their OF is full up. Not sure what to think about TOR. Houston: they have plenty of money but they have plenty of outfielders as it is. I'm guessing they go after another starting pitcher and reliever. Curious team no doubt. Baltimore: yep, they got money to burn and surely will. Especially since their recent signee Kim can play LF or 1B. Kim allows Baltimore flexibility with signing either Davis for 1B/DH or one of the big three outfielders. Im guessing they end up with either Cespedes or Upton. As far as I can tell, the biggest players for Upton/Cespedes/Gordon are the Sox, Orio!es and the Cards. Most of the other teams are either rebuilding or pushing their payroll limitations so there is a handful of teams that could come into play like Houston, Toronto, Cleveland, Detroit and the Cubs if the prices drop enough. If I missed something please point it out but I think I covered it. One team to watch is the Orioles. They are sitting around 100-102M with committed salary and arbitration players. This doesn't include filling out their roster but the Orioles have plenty of money to burn. Wouldn't surprise me if they sign one of the big three and one of the second tier outfielders. in this post, i just remembered several other teams. i will mention 1 team in particular. Pitt. they are committed and they will need to do something. going into the off season, their press or the press of the sporting community broke them down, before the northside answered with their moves. Pitt needed a another sp, 1b they will also move both walker and marte b/c their prospects are ready to step in. looking back, they did the 1b, 2b trade now, i would pitt move marte and take a chance on 2 rookies in the lineup??? i still see them needing a better sp and if they do move marte, i can see it being done for a young cost control #2 or #3 type of sp. or would they just look into the fa market??? i am seeing teams as needing to make moves, just be keep up and to keep being competitive within their division. you know, i really do like this off season. a lot to think about.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 02:38 PM) Well, perhaps the Sox are not the right organization to do it, but some team may try to exploit this circumstance by "hoarding talent," as you put it. you may have a point, on initial impression, but the sox can do it. here is a perfect scenario.... get an additional sp. go with 5 sp's. keep ej and use him as a swing pitcher, a long relief. ease him in and let him get his feet wet. just grooming him for a bigger role in 17. in 17 do the same with fulmer if need to. that is the best way to use the resources available, hoarding talent and using them in the most judicious way possible. working from a superior position.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 12:15 PM) That's all fine and good, but we haven't had much luck since the Dunn signing pulling off this feat, or you can go back to Rios and Peavy. Jake might have had the most disappointing career overall with the Sox, but ironically he fetched us the most talent back of anyone. Actually, when they announced their resigning him, it seemed a bit nuts but it worked out fine. Just looking at everyone we brought in last year, the only player we could currently trade without eating any salary would be Robertson. This kind of "hoarding talent" type of strategy would work better for a rebuilding team with all their minor league talent at least 2-3 seasons away from being ready. With the White Sox, anything you get for Frazier, Lawrie, Cabrera is likely to be Avi Garcia type talent with flaws...but the hardest problem to resolve is selling "high" on players who are performing well when the team's contending. See Shark last July after the Blue Jays series. In the past, we held onto Crede and Jenks too long, not to mention Quentin, Ramirez, Floyd, Danks, Crain, Humber, Thornton. Also, you're looking at budgetary constraints...playing time issues...just look at all the surplus talent the Dodgers acquired the last 2-3 years and what they have to show for it all now. And that's a team spending 2.5x what the White Sox do. As it is, we're going to be 15-20% over projected budget adding one of the Big 3 (theoretically). Finally, it would make more sense to stockpile young, cost-controlled talent than veterans with a negative WAR roi unless you can hit on the perfect Tier Three veterans and flip them like Epstein has done 2-3 times in rebuilding the Cubs. nice post, i really like the bold, "hoarding talent" . with the new faces, i am or would suggest that the sox get as many draft picks, to draft the best players they can. to develop them and hoard them.... the price of fa's has gone crazy and the sox can not go into that ring and go toe to toe with the big money teams..... spend this yr and sit it out and let the farm system build itself.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 11:57 AM) Given the dearth of talent that will be available over the next two free agent classes, why not sign several players, with the idea that they could be trade pieces, to contending teams, desperate for key players, in 2017 and 2018? Sure the payroll would sky rocket this year, but the chances to win go way up, and then the front office could dump payroll and acquire top prospects, the following two years. They would be holding a lot of supply into a very limited market, with the normal demand bidding up the price for players. Trades will necessarily become the only viable means of acquiring players, which means that teams, which want to contend will have to be willing to give up prospects. Go ahead Mr. Reinsdorf, knock yourself out. Sign two outfielders, a right handed starting pitcher, and maybe even a SS. Back load the contracts as much as possible. Have a big 80TH birthday bash, and then let Hahn open the "store" for business, after the World Series. Oh, and La Roche. What to do with him? Who cares? i am in agreement with some of what you mention. i have been among those who have express that this is the time to sign fa's.... to put the pieces on the team, all the while continue to build up the farm system. pay not, where it is front loading or back loading, the contract. but the main point is to get those players and maybe by chance, the org can pull a rabbit and can be extremely competitive .... either way, the new faces on the team and the talent they bring will make next yr team exciting.

QUOTE (knightni @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 03:36 AM) The original 1947 Miracle on 34th Street is my favorite. Edmund Gwenn IS Santa Claus. No one before or since has come close. i forgot about that one... yeah the b/w version esp.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 04:42 AM) Seattle: they are at about 142M for committed salary and arbitration players and that number doesn't include filling out the rest of the roster with league minimum players. Seattle needs a CF so they are likely looking the likes of Span, Jackson, Fowler and maybe even Parra if they can afford them. Padres: they are rebuilding so they are no threat. Heck, they are trying to trade salary (Kemp/Shields) so we can cross them off. SF: they are at 164M in committed salary and arbitration players and that doesn't include filling out their roster. If they look at signing a FA its likely one of the second tier players. TOR: they are at about 132M for committed and arbitration players not including filling out their roster. Interesting team in that they would seem to have some wiggle room but their OF is full up. Not sure what to think about TOR. Houston: they have plenty of money but they have plenty of outfielders as it is. I'm guessing they go after another starting pitcher and reliever. Curious team no doubt. Baltimore: yep, they got money to burn and surely will. Especially since their recent signee Kim can play LF or 1B. Kim allows Baltimore flexibility with signing either Davis for 1B/DH or one of the big three outfielders. Im guessing they end up with either Cespedes or Upton. As far as I can tell, the biggest players for Upton/Cespedes/Gordon are the Sox, Orio!es and the Cards. Most of the other teams are either rebuilding or pushing their payroll limitations so there is a handful of teams that could come into play like Houston, Toronto, Cleveland, Detroit and the Cubs if the prices drop enough. If I missed something please point it out but I think I covered it. One team to watch is the Orioles. They are sitting around 100-102M with committed salary and arbitration players. This doesn't include filling out their roster but the Orioles have plenty of money to burn. Wouldn't surprise me if they sign one of the big three and one of the second tier outfielders. excellent break down..... you are on a roll this past couple of day.... great work.

what gets me is this, we as fans still hasn't heard much from org like balt, tor, hou, sea, and even the padres and gaints...... those are the big guns / with the money.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 02:29 AM) Don't forget Anderson. Cannot wait for Monday to get here so the hot stove fires back up. As far as Baseball is concerned, its sure looks like its going to be a rather boring holiday weekend. Understandable, just booooooring! dang it.... to much holiday ummm eggnog with cheer.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 03:15 AM) All Spielberg's movies ranked first to last. Pretty amazing career when War Horse is 28th/29. https://www.yahoo.com/movies/best-and-worst...9586109247.html Paramount's The Big Short moved up one spot from Wednesday to claim third on Thursday with an estimated $1.72 million. The critically acclaimed Adam McKay directed film was down 26 percent from Wednesday, which represented one of the day's stronger daily percentage holds among wide releases. In a similar situation back in 2009, Up in the Air increased 1 percent on Christmas Eve to gross $1.75 million. The Big Short has grossed $5.49 million in two weeks and looks like it is in store for a very solid first weekend of wide release. www.boxoffice.com Interesting counterprograming debuting quite serious (some would say depressing in the case of Up in the Air) movies at Christmas. nice link and all, but i have problems with that list.... esp in always the movie. i really like that movie and hated some of the movies in the 5-10 area.... i don't know about it.

QUOTE (longshot7 @ Dec 24, 2015 -> 09:07 PM) I really hope the Sox don't sign Cespedes - there's a reason he's been on 4 teams in like 2 years. All reports are he's a terrible teammate. Definitely not what we need - more chemistry problems. My two cents. and you may have a point, but before i judge him in that bad clubhouse group, i would like to see those articles saying that. even if it is a little tidbit info. for me, i have never heard of that, but i will not count it out that it didn't happen.

QUOTE (credezcrew24 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 09:53 PM) Byrd and Aoki are two cheap players that would still be vast upgrades over Avi. isn't there a rep with byrd and his clubhouse rep????

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 01:41 AM) This thread has over 800 posts, all of which are pure speculation. I love MLB Hot Stove. and this is the sample of the old sox army of yesteryear.....pure fan interaction.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 26, 2015 -> 12:20 AM) Thanks LDF. I've been a Sox for a long time and have had my heart broken more than a few times in the past by having a favorite SOX player traded or sign elsewhere in FA as well as getting my hopes up for signing or trading for players only to see things fall through and not happen. For me, its better to remain open minded and curb expectations to alleviate potential disappointments. What the Sox FO does is beyond my control so all I can do as a fan is sit back and hope they make the right moves. I'm not a fan of signing Gordon but if the Sox sign him you bet I'll be cheering for him as long as he's in a Sox uni. extremely great .... for me, all i ever wanted was to have the sox open their wallet and get those missing pieces. however they went for the elite players and to be honest, that is all i can ask for, i'll settle for those 2nd or 3rd tier fa's to get the missing pieces and fix this ball club. this ball club is running on 4 flat tires .... this is how the previous regime left this club. the fix, if continued in a right way, is still a far away off. the first hint of help came in the shape of rodon, the next help is fulmer, jacob may, and then that is it.... until the next wave. again, i just hope the club can and will continue to do the right thing.

i just saw a movie my brother recommended..... close circuit. 2013 movie. i like it, it has a little of the old mystery / suspense government corruption movie... like the old pelican brief movie with julie roberts and denzel washington. really nice movie. a surprise movie.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 10:28 PM) Depends on the prospects. Going into the off season Hahn said the Sox were open to trading lower level pitching prospects for hitting and they did just that with the Lawrie trade. One thing to keep in mind is that none of us Sox fans know what's being discussed so to rule out the possibility of the Sox making another trade is very short sighted. There are two benefits in going the trade route. 1) with so many outfielders available the cost of prospects shouldn't be too bad depending on the player the Sox are interested in trading for so if we're talking about young pitching like what the Sox gave up for Lawrie, those prospects will be easily replaced by possibly even better prospects in June where the Sox have three picks in the first two rounds of a draft that is supposed to have more talent than last year's. 2) trading for an outfielder will be less costly in terms of the length of contract and possibly annual salary plus the added bonus of not giving up a comp pick for free agents that come with one attached. Less costly options now leaves more financial flexibility in the short and long terms. I'm not advocating what the Sox should do as far as sign or trade, I'm just trying to keep my mind open and illustrate that there are plenty of other possibilities. We've already seen potential signings and trades fall through this off season so I'm not getting my hopes up for any one particular player. Focusing on one player leads to high hopes and if it doesn't happen, that leads to b****ing and complaining by the fans. The only thing I'm somewhat counting onnis that the Sox will add an outfield bat in some capacity. Might be a power hitter, might be a speedster with elite defense, who knows? excellent and extremely interesting post. it gives a hint of fans should be more open minded .... which i like.

QUOTE (peavy44 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 08:47 PM) If gordon getting 24 then Cespedes getting 28 million per year. i am just a fan with a little tipsy with holiday cheer. but the whole fa signing and the value has thrown me all out of wack here. what is a "too much" offer, i do not know.