LDF

QUOTE (spiderman @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 09:44 PM) 24 million per year for Gordon? It may not even take 20 if the market for these OF'S is moving the way it's been rumored to be going. i am just stating the 5 yr at 20 is 100, 4 at 24 will 96 mil, he might just be happy with that.,...

QUOTE (peavy44 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 09:40 PM) I doubt gordon gets 6 yr deal maybe 4-5. then offer 4 yr and 24 mil per

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 08:28 PM) Then he's not cold blooded. it doesn't mean if he is cold blooded. i believe most of the fans of the sox have been convince he is looking after the sox as long as the powers to be allows him.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 07:27 PM) Yeah 4 years is all I want him at. He's not my preference of the 3 but an obvious upgrade defensively and offensively anyway. i too can live with gordon if i have too. i have the feeling of a minn of 2 or 3 yr b/c i think he wants a 1 yr or 6 yr. 1 yr and loose a draft pick, too expensive. however i am soooo excited at the sox spending money and positioning themselves to what may or may not come.... but they are trying and going for the gusto ..... to make a game of it for themselves and the fans. i just hope the fans will appreciate this and get game tickets. but this is my complete thought process and wish. sign cespedes for leftfield sign span for rf/cf for a 1 yr to rebuild his value. or the next best option, that the FO feels that can help. eaton in rf. really need another sp ..... i do not trust the danks / ej slot for the whole season. esp when there is no viable backup sp. kemp for dh in a trade for salary dump. melky.... trade if able or not, do not do the kemp move. get alexei for ss, get the cuban fans esp with cuba opening up, and make a bid for the young 16 cuban phenom and have alexei, jose a and cesp to go for the showcase and do a pr move for him and any other youngster in the off season.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 05:03 PM) With the Sox trying to build a young core while attempting to contend. I would look at young players like Inciarte, Tucker and Marisnick. For the right player, I would be willing to trade anyone not named Anderson, Fulmer, Zangari, Zavala, but even then i would be willing to trade any of them but onky for the right bat. Trading from the depth of young pitching for young hitting makes sense for a team like the Sox. Many have said in the past that the Sox should keep drafting/developing pitching since they can be tradied for hitting later. Well, IMHO, its later and the time has come to balance out the team and farm with respect to pitching and hitting. Trading young minor league pitchers for young minor league hitters is a solid idea too. Trades don't always have to be about immediately helping the parent club. Even trading different positional talent should be explored. yes and i am one of the biggest proponent of that, trading the prospects on the farm for the right player. but on a side note, KW did that and believe in it.... what make us different than what he did??? for me, the difference is in the prospects. as much as anderson and fulmer is untouchable, adams and zangari is in that boat. i see great upside in adams and in azngari. i just don't know how or what i read about him. but he kinds of remind me of a great sox htter. i just leave it at that. adams i can see his potential as being on the same or a tiny bit better upside than rodon. but again this is me and maybe my wishful thinking. adams ..... his bulldog mentality is what i like from the time before the draft.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 01:11 AM) https://www.yahoo.com/movies/40-best-movies...0387052007.html Very good list of 40...with about 7 documentaries i have yet to watch Top Ten films of 2015... Top tier Spotlight Inside Out The Tribe (Ukrainian movie with no dialogue about school for deaf) The Look of Silence (companion piece to The Act of Killing) Room Sicario Others under consideration... The Revenant Beasts of No Nation Steve Jobs Creed Bridge of Spies Carol Mad Max:Fury Road The Martian Brooklyn Chi-Raq Ex Machina Yet to see Star Wars, 45 Years, The Big Short, Son of Saul, Anomalisa that was a nice find on the 40 movies. i agree with a movie i totally forgot about. straight out of compton. that was a movie that deserves some credit. now for my disclaimer, i never got into rap but i can appreciate the talent, and this movie was great .... good acting and a good story, a true story.

'BlackSox13' date='Dec 25, 2015 I think Gordon's bat could live up to the life of the contract but not necessarily his fielding. Players like him atnage 32 that go balls out on defense have the potential to become future 1B. As long as his bat holds up, I'm fine with that. Jacb May profiles as a LF anyway and he could be ready in the next year or two and during that time its possible Gordon's all out fielding regresses enough to move him to 1B with Abreu going to DH and possibly May going to LF with fresh young legs and great range/glove. May's below average arm would be a good fit for LF anyway. nice way to bring up the farm, yeah, may and even engel, if he continues to develop from ARZ performance are looking good then they have the young cuban player in the wave after that. but the idea of gordon just reminds me of paulie, dunn, laroche and how they digress. i know, i am using a few examples to deter me and my idea. but with the current ownership, they do not like eating a huge contract. even thou they are spending this yr. Opt outs for older players only benefit the player. If the player is good then they opt out for more money but if the player regresses, the player sticks with his contract and becomes an over pay player due to their regression more difficult to move in a trade if the team tries to go a different direction. I really don't see an opt out being a hangup in the Gordon negotiations, not at age 32. Imo, Gordon is looking for the long term security of a five year deal which I believe is one of the hangups. i totally agree the money in the contract, i feel confident is there, the language may be there except for the yrs.... i really think in my thought process, is as you said is the hang up. great post today..... way to go.

QUOTE (Y2HH @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 02:06 AM) They denied it before it came out. It's him, he's since admitted it. Try Google next time. https://www.google.com/search?q=daniel+crai...19&ie=UTF-8 Not to even mention he's (un)credited on IMDB.com as being in the movie. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2488496/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_2 i gotssss to give yous guys credit for hearing this. wow, i am amaze at your awareness ....

QUOTE (MnSoxFan @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 04:45 PM) what bugs me is the ability of opt out of the contract,why can't the org have the same in after a number of yrs. what is good of one should be good for the other. Marvin Miller nice, neat, short, sweet and to the point..... i like it.

i am wondering by what blacksox13 posted, if the sox do not get any of the elite fa of'ers, depending on the cost, who are good options, or should the sox explore a trade. in ref to trade, does the sox have assets to do a trade, knowing that anderson and adams and fulmer and even corey zangari will be untouchable.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 04:35 PM) Grandy: due to his age and salary, he isn't worth the world and if the Mets asked for the world they would find Grandy still playing RF for the Mets. Grandy is not the kind of player any team will over pay for with so many outfielder options on the current market. Tucker/Marisnick: both are better defensively than Avi, especially Marisnick. Tucker has shown he can hit for power in the big leagues while Marisnick has shown elite defense with potential for more power, non of which Avi has yet to prove. At this point Avi does not possess the same talent potential as either of Marisnick/Tucker. That said, I admit the Sox are probably not a match for Tucker in a trade because I think Tucker has enough value to bring back a solid return for Houston but I think something could be worked out for Marisnick between the Sox and Astros. again excellent thought process. i can't fault it.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 04:13 PM) If Gordon is unsure about an organization then what's the point in him insisting on five years? Makes no sense. As for Shark. The Sox FO were sold on the possibility of extending him but not me. Shark was very consistent with his insistence on going to FA. Anyone who though otherwise, well shame on them for not believe what Shark had been saying for nearly two years. Just my shot in the dark opinion but I'm guessing the two most important things to Gordon are the fifth year and a full NTC. An opt out for a 32 year makes no sense. excellent thought process. way to go. the 5 yr or 4 yrs. no matter, it is a financial part of this. an extra yr or two, even sitting on the bench, collecting 20 mil per, when his usefulness is in the first 2 yrs, maybe 3 yrs. what bugs me is the ability of opt out of the contract,why can't the org have the same in after a number of yrs. what is good of one should be good for the other.

'BlackSox13' date='Dec 25, 2015 The Mets are in a real financial bind since the owners have so much debt so they aren't in a position to ask for the world for Granderson. I really think Granderson can be had for a reasonable price. Something like Avi and a cost controlled bullpen arm might be enough. i knew that they were in trouble a couple of yrs ago, the old gm hinted at it esp with colon contract, what 2 yrs ago....but i do not think they will sell the farm for nothing, even thou avi is not a nobody, i think they will want a lion share of every trade..... but who is right and who is wrong, only time will tell on that. Tucker/Marisnick: they are gambled but they are also just 25/24 years old so there's still plenty of upside. They are also cheap and come with hears of control while fits for the core group Hahn is building. I would rather gamble on youth than a proven veteran that will regress with age at some point. That POV is why I would be willing to part with quality prospects for a guy like Inciarte. by that definition, isn't Avi should be considered the same way??? but i can't dispute your POV, i still like that you are looking, i just don't see it with Hou. maybe another Kemp: nice bat but horrible legs and glove on the field and was actually worse than Avi defensively in '15. No reason to trade for Kemp unless he becomes the DH or learns first base which means SD would have to take LaRoche in any deal for Kemp. I really like Kemp's bat and would like to have it in the middle of the Sox lineup, just not his defense on the field. oh i know, you are not saying nothing i didn't take into consideration. me and my crazy ideas, i still like him as a DH. he has a great glove for that position.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 04:52 PM) Unless he wanted a flexible opt-out to not be locked into a long-term relationship with an organization he was uncertain about... For Gordon, it's just as much about finding a comfortable fit with the right team and environment. We all were sold this idea Shark would be willing to sign a long-term deal, and it couldn't have turned out to be any more the opposite or both sides. Likewise, Heyward cost the Cardinals a ton in talent and he was content to jump ship from one of the best organizations in baseball after just a year, so that has to be part of the hesitation...along with the belief KC can come up with 4 years and $70 million at the last minute when the rubber hits the road on decision day in the next couple of weeks. I don't think no trade is quite so important...unless he really wants to keep his family close to Omaha. ok, lets explore this, at 32 this yr, next yr his first yr on the contract, he will be 33. and opt yr...... at what.... 34 so in essence that is a 1 yr contract. he can be a fa at 34. i just don't buy it. i still think it is the yrs in the language of the contract. that is what is holding it up. i believe the money if there, not the yrs.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 04:40 PM) I'm having a difficult time buying info the opt out nonsense myself with reference to Gordon. The guy is 32 and most players that age are looking for long term security due to they know they are likely to regress to some degree with age. Upton would make sense as an opt out candidate and to a lesser extent maybe Cespedes but Gordon? Nah, I don't buy if. My guess would be that the potential hangup is Gordon seeking a full no trade Claus in his next contract and also maybe the Sox only willing to go four year while Gordon seeks five. i too am in agreement with this, i didn't want to bring this up, well b/c of some issues i have had with other posters. i just didn't feel like a another rant. but gordon at 32, the sox really may have a problem with 5 yrs or more, maybe just maybe danks contract yrs, really soured them on that long of a contract. i am thinking that was why last yr signing laroche and melky was a good gamble in their eyes. the owner do not like to get snake bitten again and go down that road of an unmovable contract, esp if as some have said, a NTC is in the language. so gordon in a #1 choice, why, maybe b/c they thought he will not demand a 6 yr contract, maybe a contract with lesser yrs. just my oninion.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 03:41 PM) Kennedy should have taken the QO. He could have become a free agent next year in a horrible class of starting pitchers. for sure, look at those that did accept the QO, they will, if next yr, be given and i am sure some will turn down that offer. making next yr fa list a little bit better.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 06:02 AM) Thanks man. You're probably right. CarGo likely would cost more than what the Sox would be willing to give but with so many outfielders options available, I still have hope that some could be worked out. Colorado has too many left handed hitting outfielders and are said to be looking for a right handed bat. I'm wondering if Avi/Beck/Danish or Guerrero would be enough. I'm thinking Colorado would want one of Adams or Guerrero for sure but not sure if they would have interest in Beck or Avi, probably not. I think Gardner is much more plausible of an idea. Other ideas that I think we're mentioned in another thread are Marisnick or Tucker from Houston. Tucker would give the Sox the left handed bat with pop they seek while Marisnick would provide elite defense although his bat leaves something to be desired. At least Marisnick provides defense and speed unlike Avi. I also wonder about Granderson's availability. The Mets owners apparently have alot of debt so they might be willing to trade Granderson. That's about all I can come up with for now. Kemp has a nice bat but his defense fallen off pretty bad and should be looked at as a DH. ref mets, they are horrible trade partners, mainly b/c they want everything including the kitchen sink in their favor .... hou i an intriguing possibility but i really don't know. preston tucker hit 243 in 300 ab's that avg really is putting me off. marisnick is just like tucker but with more K's and less hrs in more ab's. ahh kemp, is still my option, and basically for the padres doing a salary dump. again really nice ....

QUOTE (scs787 @ Dec 23, 2015 -> 08:14 PM) I tend to agree with this. A quick go through the results last year I saw they lost 42 games by 2 runs or less. Adding Crazier and Lawrie to the offensive blackholes that were 3B and 2B, plus moderately upgrading the catchers position is gonna go a long way into winning more of those close loses. Throw in a full year of Rodon, and potentially half a season from Fulmer as well.. I would obviously love to see Cespedes/Upton/Gordon or even Parra, but I don't think the off-season would be a failure like some suggest if they don't. you should also add the idea of the dh not being a black hole and offensive help from an improve outfield.

QUOTE (dpd9189 @ Dec 23, 2015 -> 07:35 PM) Save their money for the 2018 UFA class which will be loaded with talent. and it would be a sellers market. the cost for one of those fa's is going to be more than what it is now.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 25, 2015 -> 02:19 AM) Agree with what you say here. I think Ethier would be the less costly option in a trade. One thing I didn't consider in my OP was the fact that left handed RF power hitters are few and far between on this year's market which will add even more surplus value to CarGo. It's still possible CarGo could be had at a reasonable price due to the overall abundance of outfielders available but not as cheap as Ethier. With the speculated cost of Upton/Cespedes/Gordon, I think attempting another trade could be a better idea for the Sox and more of a possibility than some may think despite the lack of depth in the upper minors. Imo, Ethier can be had without costing Fulmer or Anderson but I could be wrong. I think for a deal to work with LA, they must be willing to take a Sox outfielder not named Eaton in return as part of the trade. Problem is that the Dodgers have enough outfielders as is. Here's a look at the balance of Ethier's contract. I don't consider this bad at all to be honest. 2016 34 Los Angeles Dodgers $18,000,000 2017 35 Los Angeles Dodgers $17,500,000 2018 36 Los Angeles Dodgers *$17,500,000 $17.5M Vesting Option, $2.5M Buyout Another alternative would be to see what the Yanks want for Gardner. Problem is he's really never played RF and should probably stay in LF but he is a much cheaper alternative to signing a FA which could leave some money to be spent elsewhere or mid-season if the Sox are legit contenders. Here's Gardner's contract... 2016 32 New York Yankees $13,500,000 2017 33 New York Yankees $12,500,000 2018 34 New York Yankees $11,500,000 2019 35 New York Yankees *$12,500,000 $12.5M Team Option, $2M Buyout Not sure what the Yanks would want in return though they are reportedly seeking a RH starting pitcher. It does seem as though they are looking to lower their payroll so maybe Gardner can be had for something like Beck/Avi? Not sure to be honest. I'm just entertaining alternatives to the Sox OF search. I'm not completely sold that the Sox are going to sign a FA and especially one with a comp pick. There's so many conflicting rumors going on I kind of think the Sox end up doing something we may not see coming. Hahn said he many irons in the fire and I do believe that. this is excellent and very informative. well put together. the main problem I see is this, the sox do not have the assets to make it work. but you really got a point.

the bishop wife nightmare before xmas - i admit on being a huge danny elfman fan the xmas carol 2 movies. the 1938 and the 1951 movie. xmas holiday.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Dec 24, 2015 -> 07:12 PM) So P.K. Subban seems like a pretty good dude. (Warning: this video may cause tears) https://twitter.com/PKSubban1/status/679990515954102272 that was a great vid..... i am more impress with subban now as person, than a hockey player. many thanks for finding this and sharing it.

QUOTE (glangon @ Dec 24, 2015 -> 02:56 PM) There were points last year where Danks steadied the ship and was pitching well, added to the mix that he owns the Royals, this trade would be daft imo. Personally, I'd see if some Japanese team fancies La Roche. Keep Garza away from our rotation. I think we are in a healthy state. We have a clear 5 man staff with Chris Beck, Carson Fulmer, Spencer Adams and Tyler Danish all in the minors ready to step up if needed. Danks is in the last year of his contract and he'll probably be replaced by one of the above when he goes. Pitching is an area of strength where we have a conveyor belt of talent waiting in the wings. Let's not screw that up and screw over the budget by bringing in Matt Garza nice post. and for me, i still would love the sox to pick up a pitcher. just for the "what if" scenario .

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Dec 24, 2015 -> 02:54 PM) Edit: sorry not Hossa. All the other FAs that summer. I had almost forgotten about this,but the link below explains this better than I ever could. It wasn't the deal itself but a potentially costly misstep the Blackhawks leveraged to fire Tallon. This was all despite the obvious sentiment that Bowman was groomed as his replacement all along. http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_dadd...?urn=nhl,174746 i was totally way wrong in what i thought you were referring to. on what you posted, i forgot about that clerical mistake..... i still, imo think something else might have happen, but no gossip, rumors or anything on those events. then again maybe it was a screw up as it was said.

QUOTE (Brian @ Dec 24, 2015 -> 12:53 PM) Oh it got plenty of news. 9-11 just delayed it. You can read the real editorials online still at the Globes website. wow, many thanks for that info. i guess i missed it here in LA and all that. what is still alarming, even after i slept, is the number of a. the unknown people who called in after and b. the scope of this cover up. it is soooo freaking shocking on any level, and the churches attitude on covering it up. this was a great ensemble of actors in this movie.