sox4lifeinPA

QUOTE(KipWellsFan @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:23 PM) hehe, that's two times tonight! Who's next?!? by the way no one likes canada, but I like your ginger ale though.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:27 PM) The "American Church" is disgusting. Pathetic. Moronic. Misses the whole point. "Religion" and "Church" is so bastardized. That's one of the best things about where I go to worship. The preacher stand up there and says I messed up BAD, but this is the one place where you should be able to come and be who you are with NO criticism whatsoever. And he's the first preacher who I can honestly tell that he means it. He holds up the bible and says we need to live that life and screw what the "churches" think. Pretty innovative for today's "church". Coincidentially, it's in one of the most affluent areas in the United States. I think that way too often, we totally miss the boat because of our silver spoons in the United States. Would we have the beliefs we do if our lives were on the line like first Century Christians? Probably not. Interesting topic, as long as it holds ... good call, Soxy. two sleepy eyed thumbs up. your church and my church in texas need to go out on a date sometime.... they'd like each other

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:22 PM) After you get a good nights sleep, think about this statement: There is no "American Church". Nor should there be. Is there room on this planet for a society where every lawful belief system is allowed? And along a parallel line, is there room on this planet for a mono-belief country? The American Church is the evangelical church in the United states. Some people know what that means, others not. my bad. I don't mean that as a proper name, but I mean that in the post-modern state. My church in the US practices a different form of christianity than a fledgling church in a developing country. I mean that in a somewhat condemning way towards "our" church...the extremely wealthy church of the united states which chisoxygirl was describing most bitingly.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:15 PM) PA, how do you reconcile this with the GOP view that we should only feed someone for two years than let the lazy bum starve? I want to live on a commune and partake in acts 2 style living. When it comes to government I'm quasi-liberitarian, when it comes to the church I'm quite socialist. I think that's my issue. I don't want the government to do what the church is supposed to be doing. The church is a billion dollar "corporation" with thousands of branches throughout the US. Acting independently but in conjunction with each other, we should be able to feed the poor, defended the fatherless, the widow and the alien. I like the GOP because they at least pretend to care about my faith. (at least the core principles) The Dems seem to fill in the blanks from a secular standpoint, but they can't even seem to feign interest in my beliefs

QUOTE(ChiSoxyGirl @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:14 PM) Exactly! Right there! That's the disconnect. I mean, I think that part of it really is that we're wealthy. I also think part of it might be a lot of the protestent churches docterine of faith and faith alone. But I also think that it's much easier to point the finger at someone else (wearing J Crew, driving a Benz, and in the comfort of our own home) than to give all that you have. I will never forget sitting in my ethics class with these really condescending and condeming kids as they lectured to the rest of us about what terrible Christians we were for this and that as they sat there in Abercrombie, Nike, and other overpriced stuff. The irony of it almost made me laugh. That's why I am amazed when people say we give enough in foreign aid, to charities, etc. Would Jesus have said we give enough as we live in this lap of luxury? I doubt it.... I'd like to restate your thesis, which is that THIS is what Jesus' message was far more than other issues. However, we cannot just look past those other things. I think there's a need to do a major "spring cleaning" of the american church. I totally agree with you about the abercrombie, Benz, etc stuff. I need sleep however.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:04 PM) You don't think they are waving little American flags and thanking George Bush? I was referring to Winodj and Flasoxxjim. "Look over there guys, graves of Italian soldiers you can piss on next!"

QUOTE(CrimsonWeltall @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:05 PM) For pity's sake, I can't respond to that sad, sad post. Use your mind to respond to me, not your little brother.

QUOTE(ChiSoxyGirl @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:03 PM) Not to totally hijack this thread, but.... I think it's interesting that the biggest debate in religion seems to be the debate on gay marriage. While, it appears, a myriad of things Jesus was much more fervent about seem to fall to the wayside because they affect more people. One of the things Jesus went on about most in the Gospels was the evils of possessions--how they end up owning you, you can't serve 2 masters, harder for a camel to get through the eye of a needle than a rich man enter heaven, sending away the young man because he wouldn't give it all up, the widow's offering and the poor man's offering, Zacchieus, Judas selling Christ for silver (and those are the few examples I can think of off the top of my head--I know there's more). Yet we live in a country that is the wealthiest in the world--and prides itself on its overwhelmingly Christian majority. I think there's a disconnect there. Why, oh, why isn't this one of the MOST talked about issues facing Christianity? I am honestly, honestly baffled by this. Wow, now we're talking. I'd much rather talk about this to be honest. 1 John 3:16 "This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers. 17If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? 18Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth. "

QUOTE(CrimsonWeltall @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 10:52 PM) Jim didn't seem the least bit annoyed. He very calmly pointed out you were just plain wrong. go drink your kool-aid elsewhere and stop sucking up...

QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 08:12 PM) yeah, I'm sure the families of the 16 Polish Soldiers killed in Iraq think that's hilarious, you "bleeding heart it's all about the love" f***ers.....

Jim, isn't it interesting how personal an "attack" on one's belief system can be? Maybe the inequal treatment of religious views makes a little more sense to you now. "Levels of goodness" is a completely subjective principle. In my belief system, I encourage at least 6 other wives beside miss PA. That works for us and is an agreeable situation where we all share money and my sperm. What happens then to the violater of the "good of the group/society"? should we exterminate them? Where do values like grace and mercy come from then? and if think that "buddy jesus" or "hulk jesus" come close to anything that I've posted, we really have to take a step back and analyze the spices you're using in your tobacco

Without absolute Good, how can you even begin to place value on things or actions? You can't be an atheist and claim any legitimate value system, because the things you place your beliefs in are arbitrary and completely based on the whims of the population...there's no absolute truth. By definition, there must exist a higher power.

QUOTE(EvilJester99 @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 02:59 PM) That's what I love about religion...the moralists always trying to tell people how to live their lives. uh, I'm not telling you how to do anything. I love the prejudices and assumptions made by people who don't know anything about the subject.

QUOTE(Wong & Owens @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 01:20 PM) Society is nose-diving? Get YOUR nose out of mass-media reporting and try some independent thought. The society we live in is less racist than it was 100 years ago for example. It is also a better time to live in if you're a woman. Is it better overall? No. Is it worse overall? Hardly. Society has not gotten wholly better or worse, just different. Old problems or issues get resolved, and new ones pop up. Some issues stay constant. But to say that it is "nose diving" is more than a bit on the over-exaggeration side of things. Unless you have some basis for making this statement. Do you? Cause I'd love to hear it. First of all, don't pretend to know me or catagorize me as any bit of a stereotype. It's grossly unappealing and not helpful for dialogue. I LOVE the fact that when someone's opinion isn't the popular "cool" opinion, it's somehow not independent thought. That's the biggest JOKE of leftist thought. You can't fathom how anyone would choose to believe things that I believe without them having somehow been brainwashed. Someone else needs to stop listening to Air America. I don't really know how much less racist our society really is. we've only had about 40 years of true "freedom" for black individuals, and that's questionable. As for women, being a CEO or owning your own business is now a reality, but destroying life with ease and the "sex sells" approach to our media seems to take a massive dump on women's rights and equality. I can definitely say that our society is worse off. In the name of "freedom" and "the self," we have devalued the family and relationships. I won't pretend I know what it was like in the earlier part of the 20th Century, but as a student of history I can look at causality. I'll be the first to say that it has to do alot with the failures of the church of the 20th Century....so please don't let me give you the opinion that "Christians" are blameless. In the end, I think it's about perception. You probably don't believe things like underaged drinking or premarital sex are bad. So, ultimately, we'll never agree on anything.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 01:12 PM) WDJ, I know you accept some boundaries in all this. Age for one. I will assume mental and physical condition. Would you agree it is wrong to fall in love (and let's assume sex is involved) with a 15 year old when you are 30? Would you agree if someone does not have the mental capacity to agree, that sex with that person is immoral also? Once we have barriers, I can understand, but not agree, with people who feel that gender barriers are natural as well. I've read scripture regarding the issue, read various studies on the "meaning" in Hebrew, Greek, etc. and feel that since it is unclear, and since so many homosexuals I know have fought hard to live a straight life, that it isn't up to me to judge, but to accept. Maybe it's the cowards way out. I respect PAs character to stand up and proclaim his belief without apologizing and I hope he respects my beliefs as well. Further, I think to be polite we are using "love" to mean both the emotion and a sexual act. I don't believe anyone would disagree with loving anyone, it's the physical act that gets some people's tightly whities in a bundle. I'm failing to come up with the right words for a response to this. Honestly, I tend to express more fundamental beliefs at times when I'm alot more accepting in reality because I just don't think The Bible is supposed to have alot of grey areas. To think we could pull one over on God is a joke. I do accept that life DOES have grey areas. It's also hard to discuss this because those without the spirit just won't get it. You can't understand biblical truth without being a Christian. I'm not saying you can get love and honesty and such values, I just think that those who don't seek with sincerity and humility are going to have things revealed to them by God. He intentionally veils himself to keep us guessing. call me naive, ignorant, whatever... it all continues to prove my thesis anyway.

QUOTE(winodj @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 11:22 AM) Loving who you choose to love = evil. Ok, then. no, ignoring doctrine and fundemental teachings of Jesus, Paul, and other early church leaders= evil. ok, then.

I believe Poland has continued to back us in iraq start to finish...IIRC

Which country DOESN'T have their own best interest in mind??? We act like the United States are the only ones who inact policies that look out for their own best interest first. We're just the biggest and the baddest, and that pisses beliguim and france off.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 10:34 AM) Nothing like making fun and casting doubt on every Purple Heart ever awarded. Oh wait, Out of the tens of thousands of recipients, Kerry's was the only one in question. :headshake I was merely agreeing with his point that anyone can make anything they want, but I was ultimately saying all of that crap is worthless and devoid of anything positive.

take a look out of your nu-punk posters plastered bed room.... the society we live in is nose diving... but I can't expect the blind to see

QUOTE(Cerbaho-WG @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 09:49 AM) Thank God, music overall just got slightly better. now only if interpol, the vines, the yeah yeah yeahs, (insert carbon copy throw back band) would all follow suit....

QUOTE(LowerCaseRepublican @ Feb 23, 2005 -> 10:27 AM) Well if there is a market for them, I say let the free market dictate the outcome of the product. where were my purple heart band-aids again?

*raises hand* call me old fashion, but I don't have much of a "golden shower" fetish

I guess we can officially call them Freedom Waffles now.... My only concern is if the porno industry gets a hold of this "fad"... I have a feeling it wouldn't be about pissing...

I've never been much for the pope, but thank God he's saying this now. The Truth never smelled sweeter.