iamshack

QUOTE (raBBit @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 03:53 PM) I agree with this. I think Tony is looking at it from what is best for Eaton, or what Tony would do if he was Eaton. That's a fair take. Tony's also been very clear Eaton said nothing offensive and acknowledged his first amendment rights. This issue has been interesting to watch because a good deal of people are saying "Eaton said nothing wrong" or "Eaton has free speech" and the other group is saying "Eaton shouldn't have said anything even if he wasn't wrong." These two opinions are NOT mutually exclusive, yet the contrasting views are still going up against each other. It doesn't make sense. When it comes down to it, do you think Eaton wanted to apologize for something when he didn't do anything wrong? Do you think he wanted his name dragged in the mud with the word racist? Do you think he wanted to talk with his reps and the Sox to prepare to talk to the media? Do you think he wanted to look Kenny Williams in the eye and have a conversation with him about it? Operate with the understanding of the environment you're in. Everybody is offending by everything now. You will be ridiculed if you're a white male and talk about race in any way that could be misconstrued as anything other than an altruistic view point. If you're a baseball player you should have like three types of tweets. 1.) Charity stuff 2.) Team did awesome today keep it up. 3.) Nice, simple interactions with young fans. Eaton had his issues in the clubhouse in AZ, he has had his issues here and this type of controversy is terrible for him. The only people who will remember the details of this stuff is us, big Sox fans. To execs and evaluators they'll remember some Twitter controversy with him talking about black people. He doesn't need this stuff. During his prime, when he's a great player, nobody is going to fret over it. When he's 36 and coming off an injury-ridden year with poor stats and he wants one more chance, his poor reputation is going to be a big factor on whether a team wants to bring him aboard. Jimmy Rollins can suck for two more years and he'll still get a shot because he's been a consummate pro. If you're a player with a bad rep at the end of your career that rep will play a role in whether you get a last shot. No doubt about it. I honestly take offense to the bolded. You are arguing from an extremely narrow viewpoint of what's best from a risk standpoint for a player, agent, or organization. That perspective is so absolutely minor in the context of what was initially posted so as to make it nearly irrelevant. I won't even argue that from a risk aversion standpoint, it only exponentially increases the risk of financial loss to make comments like Eaton did. That is not being disputed here. What I will dispute is that this is the best outcome for society and the world in general. Sporting events are one of the few things in modern civilization that have the ability to unite people across lines of various inequalities. All one needs to do is look at history to recognize that perhaps some of the greatest drivers of progress occurred on a track, a diamond, a court or a field. To devalue that by stating that the very athletes that have this ability to unite and to drive progress should do nothing other than spew innocuous positive drivel could not be more false in my opinion. I find that suggestion to be patently ridiculous.

QUOTE (Tony @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 03:35 PM) Can you link me to all the moving tweets from Arthur Ashe? As I said in my ORIGINAL post, unless you want to use your celebrity and salary for real change, shut the hell up. Those athletes you quoted did a tad more than pulling up their Twitter app and posting whatever thought that popped into their head. This entire topic, at least for me has been about social media and it's uses. You aren't doing anything in 140 characters. It's irresponsible to yourself, the people you are reaching and your employer. Instead, they used the methods that were available to them at the time. They would likely have utilized Twitter then, had it been available. If you are arguing that you cannot effectuate real change through social media, I don't think I could possibly dream up a worse argument one could take. That is simply as false as false gets.

QUOTE (Tony @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 03:06 PM) As I should be, as that is a huge part of the equation. And my original point still stands. Can they post whatever they want? Yes, it's their right. Should they post whatever they want? Probably not. Their opinion is just as valid as yours or mine, yet holds more weight given their celebrity of playing a game. You want to post about your kids? The video games you play in your downtime? Plug your favorite clothing line? Cool. I don't want to hear about your feeling on Syria, our current president, race relations or religion. Arthur Ashe, Billie Jean King, Muhammad Ali, Jesse Owens, Jackie Robinson....

QUOTE (Tony @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 02:41 PM) That is your argument? Since everyone does something stupid, they should too? I'm not saying athletes should be silenced. They are free to post whatever they choose, it's their social media account. No one owns it but them. And guess what? They do have influence, you're right. I don't think they should, but they do, there is no way to argue that. As you have seen with the Eaton debacle, in most cases they shouldn't be trusted to articulate topics that are out of their realm. I've already stated I don't think what Eaton said was even close to controversial. Clearly many did. And if I was working on Eaton's team, I would have strongly urged him not to post anything relating to race. I would simply ask the question: What's the upside here? What is the end result you hope to achieve by posting your own personal thoughts on race relations? Is Adam Eaton, the guy with the nickname "Spanky", supposed to spark change in the #OscarsSoWhite campaign? And this is your argument? You're coming at this from an agent or ownership perspective...you are arguing about what is smart for the athlete to do to protect his image or the image of the team. That is entirely different than what your initial comment stated, which was that athletes should shut the hell up unless they are going to use their salaries to effectuate change.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 02:36 PM) Now this is delicious irony... Oh, please do elaborate.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 02:32 PM) If you are looking at me for advice, you are doing it wrong. And therefore, you are hereby prohibited from dispensing any further advice.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 02:24 PM) If you are relying on Adam Eaton to do anything other than to provide a few hours of entertainment as an escape from life, you are doing it wrong. Are you two brothers or something? What is with the tag teaming lately? The issue I am responding to is not just Adam Eaton - it's ALL athletes. That was the statement that was made. And honestly, is the irony not lost on you that you're dispensing more advice than anyone on this forum, and yet you have the nerve to tell someone else they should not do that very same thing.

QUOTE (Tony @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 02:18 PM) And after spending solid time with hundreds of professional athletes spanning different sports, nothing gets me more upset than masses of uneducated people taking political, financial or moral advice from professional athletes. I respect the fact that your profession exposes you to professional athletes, but I don't think the fact that you are basically calling them stupid makes it so. There is no shortage of people out there offering bad advice to uneducated people. The fact that athletes are often a subset of that does not lend to the conclusion that all athletes should only speak on matters of athletics. That is simply ridiculous.

QUOTE (Tony @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 01:43 PM) That's not what I'm arguing at all, but feel free to create your own agenda. Not surprised in your next post you admitted you were supporting Trump, all starting to make sense. The point is no one should be looking to an athlete for their political view on anything. No one cares, and they have no skin in the game. Can they post anything they choose? Sure. But look at what happened to this situation. What good came from it? And I don't think Eaton said anything remotely offensive. This entire topic is ridiculous. Stick to hitting baseballs. That's why people follow you on Twitter, because you play for their favorite team and they are your fan. I don't need your views on racial equality at an awards show. I smell what you are stepping in, but I can't disagree more. The very power that professional athletes and other celebrities have is that they can convince those that admire them to believe in something positive, (or negative, unfortunately). To take that away from them is a waste of a lot of momentum that otherwise can take exponentially more effort to amass.

Oh for the love of Pete...

NY Judge Scolds US in its Fight with Apple

QUOTE (Middle Buffalo @ Mar 1, 2016 -> 05:16 AM) My main point with using the Compton man on the street bit was to illuminate that there is all this outrage about no black actors being nominated, but who do you think deserved to be nominated? Idris Elba? Ok, I've heard he was great. Who does he replace? Eddie Redmayne? Oh, you didn't see his The Danish Girl? So, how can you have that opinion? I'm not saying no black actors or directors deserved to be nominated. But, who and who do they replace? I don't presume to answer that question. I don't even watch many movies. I think the point some are trying to make though, by claiming there is an element of racism here, is that there is an inequitable measure of minority representation in the celebration of the best achievements of the motion picture industry, or however might be a better way of putting that. That may not be occurring overtly, but simply as an imitation or indirect furtherance of the disproportionately low representation minorities have in other facets of our modern civilization.

I honestly had no idea Gordon was married to Scooter's wife! As for the thread, and to touch on Rock's post, the racism comes in the form of art imitating life. Just as we live in a world of inequality, our art imitates and perpetuates that inequality. I was watching someone comment on tv about how some of the members of the academy don't even watch all the movies they are voting on, even for categories as critical as best picture. And this goes to the point someone made sort of indirectly about Chris Rock's bit outside the theater in Compton...a lot of times we're not particularly interested in movies that don't seem familiar or similar to our lives or our place in the world. Maybe I don't identify with Beasts of No Nation and so I don't give it much of a chance, but Spotlight...now that's something I am interested in! This is where the racism occurs...not so much in its old forms of "gasp, Idris Elba cannot win because he is black," but "eh, I'm not particularly interested in a movie on this subject matter."

The 21 Best Grilled Cheeses in America

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 24, 2016 -> 03:11 PM) I mean it isn't like he posted in a thread asking for relationship advice or something. Understood, but people always ask for advice. Rarely do they actually follow it. I guess the point is not to react harshly because he pushes back on advice that says something like "walk away." He's not going to say "you know what, you're right." He doesn't need someone to tell him not to do this. He knows that already. He is a smart person. What he wants is someone to justify why he SHOULD do that, so that he can go against his better judgment.

QUOTE (Tony @ Feb 24, 2016 -> 02:31 PM) You want to be a "good guy" and a "friend" to her, that's whatever. You do what you think best. But as a 25 year old man, getting romantically involved with a high school student who has father issues raises like 100 red flags. It will not end well, listen to those in this thread that have some years on you. You're going down a road that is quite bumpy, and when you get to that final destination, you aren't going to like what you found. He's going to do what he wants to do, so let's stop pretending like telling someone what to do is at all helpful. All we can do is provide him what experience and advice we do have and hope that that will guide him moving forward.

QUOTE (kevo880 @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 10:02 AM) Gordon was not leaving KC and Upton wouldn't even hear the Sox out. Why don't people understand this? Hahn has no plan. He does not want to improve the team. This isn't the argument I was making. Slow down and read a bit more carefully, cowboy.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 10:24 AM) Age is just 1 of many reasons why I would not approve. Ultimately it would be her choice, I just would hope by the time that she is 17, I have earned enough trust that she will believe me when I suggest that she not make the choice to date those people. I'm sure she would hope she has earned enough trust for you to allow her to make her own adult decisions (and by their nature, her own adult mistakes).

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 09:35 AM) If my hypothetical daughter was in HS and dating anyone not in HS then yes, I wouldn't give them a chance. Well you guys are a bunch of lame parents

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 09:30 AM) I wouldnt right then. She's not even done with HS let alone college. I feel like if someone was in college and wanted to date my daughter in HS they would have to have been grandfathered in (IE they were both in HS when they started dating). That being said, there is no way I am going to consider it when shes in HS and hes 25. Maybe when shes done with college I would revisit the issue. Seriously though...considering the types of guys that are out there, I think you guys are approaching this incredibly poorly. Look at Joe, and then consider your daughter dating the 19 year old college kid with a fascination with death metal and self mutilation. You're going to make that decision based on age?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 09:09 AM) First off, the fanbase would probably be more pissed the Sox didn't make an attempt at these guys than being an also ran. And letting teams "use" you does have it's advantages. It can drive prices up, and therefore reduce available funds for your competitors in regards to players you do go after. That said, I don't think it was BS the Sox were in on Gordon and Cespedes. I just think money available for them was not made available for lesser players. They have price for Fowler and Desmond. Rollins apparently was the alternative to Desmond, and they probably have an alternative to Fowler. I don't disagree with any of this.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 08:51 AM) Yeah...no...hell no. I am an open minded person but I'm making the claim right now, under zero circumstances would I have an open mind. None. My only reaction would be that this guy is some looser that has had to stoop to this level to try and pick up a girl. Some might disagree with me and I hope to hell I never am put in this situation by my daughter but that is the reality and I'm just telling it like I see it and that is what I'd tell my daughter and I'd obviously probably at this point already be in trouble with my daughter (because she got to this point). Note: Chili, I'm not calling you out, you asked what people's opinions were and I'm just being straight with no filter. Jason, I think in general, you're suspicions are probably accurate...but, you wouldn't give the person an opportunity to prove you wrong?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 08:36 AM) I know others will try to over simplify things, but I am used to that. It is one thing to get a specific expenditure for a top flight guy approved. It is quite another to get it for a second or third tier player. All you have to do is look a the players they are bringing in and the deals they are being brought in at to get that there are pretty obvious limitations they are looking at. If they had easily available money to spend on these guys, they would have done it long ago. I also think fans are conflagrating team statements, with rumors that don't necessarily reflect what the team is actually able to do. I have no doubt that a large chunk of the Sox being connected to players was being done on behalf of agents and players, and probably didn't reflect any real ability to have a fiscal interest in players. Not all rumors are created equal. All the White Sox themselves have said is that they are still trying to improve this team. They have never said they were interested in specific players or specific budgets had been set. Some fans are seeing what they want to see, and that is the worst case scenario. The fact that they are still looking, while useful players are sitting out there tells me everything that I need to know. The most negative will take it as the teams management is either stupid or negligent. I think that is just silly. I guess I don't necessarily agree that the deals being offered to players like Rollins and Latos are necessarily out of desperation as much as shrewd negotiation. I don't know that Latos couldn't have been signed for more, I just accept that $3 million is the most that Rick Hahn was willing to pay him. This is one of Rick Hahn's core competencies. In regards to the Sox being connected to certain players, I understand what you are saying, but if players' agents are using my organization in an attempt to drive market behavior while I know my organization is not involved in serious negotiations, I would be at the very least, making some better attempts to quash that message. As we have seen, leading on your fanbase only results in a disappointed fanbase, despite some really good progress otherwise.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 22, 2016 -> 10:32 PM) It matters what her mom and dad think. She is barely legal, as they say, and still in high school for gosh sakes. Dating a 26 year old is a big deal. SHe still lives at home. This isn't like a 42-year-old going out with a 26 year old who has been out of school 3 years. Well, that is certainly something that comes with the territory. One would hope that her parents will keep an open mind in regards to who Chili actually is, rather than simply focusing on his age.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 23, 2016 -> 05:22 AM) I think it is completely obvious that resources are a problem. There is literally no other reason to stop where they are. All I will say is see Eminor's post on this issue. If they literally were out of resources, or were nowhere near where they needed to be to sign any of these guys, they either drastically misunderstood the market, or they wanted to cocktease the entire fanbase. I'm not saying that resources aren't tight, but I do believe they were willing to sign any of the three major FA outfielders at "their price," meaning, a price Rick Hahn was comfortable with.