iamshack

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 06:34 PM) Nope but he, along with Anderson, are the guys you hope to see progress as the year goes on Yeah, I am going to try and be patient with him...definitely something to be alarmed about if this continues for the rest of the year.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 06:32 PM) Horrible outing...not sure he got a single swing and miss on his fastball Does it really even matter

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 06:19 PM) I think it's safe to say Moncada has "it". Yeah, a good dude to be the face of your franchise.

QUOTE (Sockin @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 06:16 PM) I'm not exaggerating in the least either. There was a margarita vendor that sat in the seat behind me to watch him hit. And the thing is...I'm not sure if you could tell from your seats, but he looked absolutely calm as can be up there.

QUOTE (iWin4Ron @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 06:03 PM) I want to give Tim Anderson the benefit of the doubt, since he was a touted prospect, at a SS position, could play a big role for us in the future, and has decent stats this year (I think?). But man, he has shown some major degression it seems. Degression indeed.

He has the rest of the year to fine tune things. Simmer.

QUOTE (reiks12 @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 03:40 PM) Who knows, I did read he had comps to David Justice although I don't see it myself. That is the mlb pipeline comp I believe.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 04:22 PM) You guys are all going a bit insane...I guess there was the Albert Belle Exception, but that was 50% to piss off the other owners when he didn't get his way with a hard salary cap. Our payroll will be like $40-50 million. Why do you think we wouldn't at least make a run at one of these guys?

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 03:26 PM) Exactly. You have to be pretty paranoid to hate last night's trade. They got their guy. Be happy. A little paranoid? Guilty as charged. Can you name all the other 19-20 year old hitters the Sox collective braintrust has been so easily picking out in the last 5-7 years?

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 02:59 PM) This article compares Rutherford's stock to Giolito this past offseason http://nypost.com/2017/07/19/sonny-gray-ma...kees-next-step/ Well, that is very discouraging. All we can hope is that they are wrong. I do have a hard time believing the Yankees felt that way about him...one would think they would have tried harder for Q if they knew Rutherford could have been a significant piece of that deal and they didn't even like him much.

What about instead of Machado, we sign Nolan Arenado?

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 02:39 PM) Bryce Harper would NOT want to come to the White Sox because they will not be the highest offer he receives. Why would the White Sox not offer the highest $?

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 02:02 PM) http://espncu.com/stream.html Going on ESPN right now. Anyone catch this? I missed it.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 01:42 PM) It's possible he's different, but the White Sox haven't proved to me yet that they can identify the players that defy the trends of something like common decline from aging or relief variability. They will probably have to for us to actually make most of rebuild. But for now, I'm much happier that they are accepting the broad trends likely to predict performance and risk for groups like relievers and taking the safer route. Especially when they got imo acceptable value. Well, he's 28. I don't suspect he's going to decline from aging a whole lot between this year and his age 29 season, but I suppose you just never know. As for variability, I can accept that argument. Fair enough.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 01:33 PM) Actually I have thought about that one. Oh I would move him...in fact I mentioned it in re: the Braves last week. But I wouldn't do it for less than I thought I should get back. Although I'm not his biggest fan.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 01:20 PM) Here's the main point. It's not a personal indictment of Kahnle. It may be a message board groupthinky strategy, but the crux of the issue is that relievers in baseball as a group have had similar issues to running backs in the nfl. THere are a few amazing exceptions of year over year consistency and excellence, but tons of variability year to year in performance. ANd because they are a group purchased for win-now purposes, it is riskier to bet on their future performance being the same or better than a hitter/SP with track record. That is why people are saying to trade him, not because he is kahnle, but because Kahnle is a reliever, and relievers are valuable but risky assets. I like Kahnle. He was awesome to watch. We could ahve held on and seen him become a top 5 closer. But when we are in rebuild modes like this, I'd much rather trade our successful relievers for future assets because unless their performance is immediately important to our team I don't want to hold onto them. Yeah, I get it. I watch sports too. I think there is a case to be made that this guy is here to stay now. That case is backed by actual data, unlike the case of Avi, perhaps, and therefore it is reasonable to suggest that this may be the beginning of something, rather than a flash in the pan. That's all the argument is. Then folks started throwing the injury stuff into the equation, when, it probably isn't warranted in the case of Kahnle, or at least not more than any other 28 year old pitcher in his 4th year as a professional. By this measure, should we trade Rodon for whatever we can get after he gets his feet under him a bit? Since he might need tjs?

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 01:06 PM) Great point. Guys look how DA totally showed us! He does have a point. It isn't fair to put this injury risk on him when the guy has really never had health concerns. Performance concerns, fine. But not injury concerns. Just like you say in regards to athletic, toolsy prospects - they don't all have to be Courtney Hawkins or Jared Mitchell simply because of...Courtney Hawkins and Jared Mitchell.

QUOTE (Tony @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 12:41 PM) Hahn said Abreu went to go pick up Moncada from the airport today. Any other good tidbits?

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 12:01 PM) cut back on the whiskey! Well played

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 11:27 AM) AFter the JD martinez trade I don't think we'llg et much back. I'd be happy to keep Avi and take that "risk" as it seems small. If he is actually good maybe it will be like a starlin castro situation. Now look at what the Tigers got for Cespedes a few deadlines ago. It's the damn juiced ball. Now pitching is back to being the asset in short supply.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 11:30 AM) And that's totally fair. I have my own concerns with Rutherford, but it seems like the Sox believe he can be that kind of player. And assuming that's the case, I can understand why they made this deal. But to your point Shack, there's definitely a chance they left some value on the table. It does seem like some posters are really sleeping on the value Kahnle could have a year from. Yeah, hopefully Rutherford turns into a "more athletic" David Justice or whatever. I understand why we would make the move. So onward we go to the Moncada Armada!

I just realized I will be blacked out again tonight. Lame.

QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 11:20 AM) I wonder if Hahn would rather have had Fowler instead of Rutherford. Dunno, but we've heard a lot about Rutherford over the last 12-14 months.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 19, 2017 -> 11:10 AM) I'm not sure anyone really complained about the Eaton trade, but otherwise the "one player short" comments are frequent. And quite frankly, I think they reflect exactly what Hahn is trying to accomplish with these trades and that's grabbing the best potential impact talents possible. The hardest thing to find is stars and with greater restrictions on the draft & international free agency it's got even harder for rebuilding clubs. Basically, you have to get super lucky or spend big in free agency if you don't have great draft position or valuable that can be cashed in to kick off a rebuild. We had three super valuable trade chips coming into this rebuild. For those three assets, we landed two blue chip positional prospects & five quality pitching prospects along with some filler (sorry Basabe). We were also able to use some of our payroll savings to add another potential positional star in Robert. That's a great start, especially on the pitching side, but obviously we needed more star upside on the positional side. IMO, even though I feel the trade is a player light when viewed in isolation, getting another potential blue chipper in Rutherford is HUGE for the overall process. We all have to remember this is a numbers game. As much as I wish we could, we simply can't assume all these guys work out. Let's say we have four potential positional stars in Moncada, Jimenez, Robert, & Rutherford. If two of those guys become full-fledged superstars, one becomes an above-average everyday player, and the fourth guy completely flops, that's a huge win for us. We have enough organizational depth and payroll capacity to fill in holes with good/solid players. The important thing is finding two or three superstars for the lineup and another two or three in the rotation. Getting Rutherford puts us in a much better spot to achieve that goal. And while a much lesser consideration, losing Robertson & Kahnle puts us in a better position to land a future superstar in the 2018 draft. So again, while I think this trade is a little light on its own merits, I think it was worth making when considering the whole process. I just think it's hard to pass on a potential superstar today, because you might get a better prospect with a higher ceiling down the road. I just don't think the reward is worth the risk, especially if you believe that Rutherford can be a blue chipper by next season. I don't view Rutherford as a potential superstar, but I agree with basically everything else here. Well done.

SB Nation Interesting piece about the trade, but what I even found more interesting was his reference to something he wrote about the Astros 3 years ago: Sounds like our expectations aren't entirely crazy.