harfman77

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 01:42 PM) Would you take Aiken over Rodon at this point? I would as I think the Sox have a legit chance to sign Aiken, the Rodon situation seems a little foggier. His agent situation may be an issue as I am not sure who his advisor his, but to me the Sox need the guy they can sign and I do not think that is Rodon.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 01:13 PM) OR JR is getting ready to sell the team to a Cuban owner and they become the Havana Bananas Yes, Mark Cuban.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 01:08 PM) Thoughts? Daryl Van Schouwen ‏@CST_soxvan 11m Bovada has over/under props on Jose Abreu. Home runs at 28 1/2, RBI at 85 1/2 for 2014 season. Under and over

77-85

QUOTE (oneofthemikes @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 10:09 AM) Has anyone heard anything about which way the Astros or Marlins are leaning? Last I read (a couple weeks ago) was that Houston was enamored with Rodon and that Miami had been linked to Kolek. Thats the last I had heard as well, also mentioned the Sox on Hoffman. As posted previous in this thread, the Sox were at Aikens last start.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 10:25 AM) I just want to point this out, something to think about... Adrian Nieto last year, age 23, 6th MiLB year, High A: .282/.371/.446, 11 HR, 18.3% K/PA Kevan Smith last year, age 24, 3rd MiLB year, High A: .286/.370/.484, 12 HR, 14.9% K/PA Offensively, I am not convinced Nieto is any better than Smith at this point. In fact I'm fairly sure I'd take Smith's bat over Nieto. Defensively, Smith was considered raw, but also has improved and there are positive reports about his pitcher handling. His CS% in 2012 (2013 I can't find) was 33%, and he had 14 PB in 92 games. Nieto is considered better defensively overall, and the pitchers seem to like him in camp (which is big), but.... His CS% in 2012 (I can't find 2013 data) was 32%. He had 14 PB in 85 games. Numbers aren't the full story of course, especially with catchers. But looking at the body of work, I am not sure Nieto is any better as a total package than Kevan Smith would be. Similar hit and OBP results, Smith more power, Smith better contact rate, similar CS% numbers, and defensively I think Nieto may be at best only slightly better. Why are people convinced Nieto is ready for the majors and Smith isn't? People are convinced that the only way we keep Nieto is by stashing him on the MLB bench, most people would like him to be in AA to start the year. There is no risk to letting Smith develop in his own timeline.

QUOTE (sammy esposito @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:54 AM) I would send him down to charlotte. Maybe he could gain some confidence and learn to hit again. If he starts the season on the DL, he very well may do that as part of a rehab assignment.

QUOTE (oneofthemikes @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:50 AM) How quickly do we think Aiken could move through the system? I know that they are looking for an arm they can pair with Sale, but would Aiken be in the bigs soon enough to be that guy? I really like what Aiken has to offer but I think the timeline could be slower than the Sox are looking for. Its really tough to say, he could have the upside of an Archie Bradley, Dylan Bundy type so he could move quickly or he may not be that guy. High School P's are really hard to project. Laws quote on him when he rated him the #1 prospect "He's not Clayton Kershaw, but it's a pretty good version of the Kershaw Starter Kit."

New MLB Draft Blog Insider article - http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/...-2014-mlb-draft Talks about Rodon's struggles and how it is now a concern - "The concern now is this is a fairly long pattern, not a blip on a radar screen," an NL East scout said. Mentions Hoffmans last start - "...he failed to miss bats once again, striking out just two hitters. The Pirates' ace did get 12 ground ball outs, but Hoffman's breaking ball was once again mediocre..." On Beede - "That's the worst I've seen [beede] in my three years of scouting him," and "The only thing that really concerns me are the walks, because they were such an issue the previous year. Kids are going to have off nights..."

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:48 AM) I think Rizzo was the White Sox scout who recommended Frank Thomas. So he has eyes?

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:46 AM) Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 8m Rangers have had trade talks due to injuries, looking to add depth at 2B and catcher. Too bad the guys we have to trade are both hurt.

QUOTE (pettie4sox @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:34 AM) Why would it be difficult to pull off a trade for a Single A player? Because he likes Nieto more than any of the A players we are willing to give up.

QUOTE (sammy esposito @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:35 AM) Beckham was tremendous when he came up with the sox. I watched him at his first spring training debut. I would trade him now; his tremendousness is gone. Which inherently makes it harder to trade him.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Mar 25, 2014 -> 09:15 AM) I'm far more optimistic about Beck than most and while I don't necessarily think he has the highest ceiling in the minor leagues, he was once considered a surefire top 5 pick. The kid has a nice arm. Right there with you on Beck, but I do think he is the pitcher with the highest ceiling that we have in the minors now. If he puts it altogether, he has the makings of a solid #2 behind Sale.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Mar 24, 2014 -> 04:07 PM) Good reference and it shows that these guys will likely come around and cut down on the walks. Cool weather could also be a favor as well. Are you thinking that Rodon and Kolek get picked 1/2? Just curious is all. Right now I'm hoping for one of Beede, Aiken, Kolek, Rodon ( not likely) and possiby Newcomb for the #3. That could change too. I'm just not sold on Hoffman at this point. I think that Kolek goes in the top 2, either to the hometown Astros or the Marlins who have been known to favor high school talent with upside, though they have went with college guys in the last two drafts. If Rodon is there at 3, I do not see the Sox taking him as I don't feel that he will sign for what they want as a Boras client. When Appel fell to 8th, Boras still wanted 1-1 money, so I envision the same approach with Rodon. If he falls he will likely enter in the draft again next season and rebuild his value as a bonafide 1-1. There are too many good pitchers in the draft to take a chance on punting the pick to next season when the landscape may be murkier. I trust the Sox on which guy they will take, they will have ample opportunities to have seen each guy and cross-checked them, and they have a really solid track record identifying pitchers that have underwhelming numbers and correcting their issues as pros. The problem with college pitchers that put up great numbers is sometimes they are already at their ceiling and have little development left. I think there is still quite a bit of projection left in Hoffman. Rodon is better than he has pitched, Beede may be close to topping out. Newcomb is interesting in that he has pretty good stuff, but won't be challenged by his level of competition. He has three plus pitches but command hasn't been there. I would love to get Aiken if he is there, the upside is huge and I think he has more of a frame to be a ace type than Kolek does.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 05:52 PM) Which is why limiting the prospect options to Major League ready ones made me cringe. I disagree that we have players after this group that will be options. If these guys fail, Sale has to go on the market. Off season of 2015 will they be good enough to keep Sale? They targeted ML talent in their deals, but have also made an effort to get a lot better in that amateur draft acquiring a lot of players with a lot of upside. Acquisition Backfill A. Garcia - C. Hawkins, M Adolfo A. Eaton - J. May, A. Engle M. Davidson - T. Michaeleski L Garcia - Tim Anderson, C Rondon J Abreu - K Barnum Thats not including any of the pieces that were already in the system when Hahn took over. They are building the system at the top to fill all the gaps created by the strategy of the previous regime and at the same time building from the bottom up.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Mar 24, 2014 -> 12:22 PM) One thing I see in common here is the walks are kind of high. Not what you would expect from the top college arms for June's draft BUT I think the walks show that its early in the season and guys are still trying to find their groove. As a frame of reference, there were two college pitchers taken in the top 10. Appel had 130/30 K/BB ratio as a jr and 130/23 as sr and Jonathan Gray put up 147/24. Last season Rodon had 184/45, Hoffman was 84/39 (15 starts) and Beede was 97/55 all as sophs. At this point, I think Rodon is probably out of the equation for the Sox for a variety of reasons. I think it will come down to Hoffman, Beede, Aiken, and Holmes in that order and whichever will sign for the figure that Hahn has in mind.

Week stats: Newcomb - 8 IP 4H 0R 0ER 3BB 7K Season - 5GS 0.00 ERA 32.2 IP 14H 1R 0ER 15BB 38K Rodon - 4.2 IP 6H 8R 0ER 4BB 8K Season - 6GS 2.18 ERA 41.1 IP 33H 23R 10ER 15BB 50K Hoffman - 7 IP 6H 3R 3ER 2BB 2K Season - 6GS 4.03 ERA 38 IP 29H 20R 17ER 17BB 39K Beede - 2.2 IP 6H 11R 5ER 5BB 2K Season - 6 GS 2.06 ERA 35 IP 20H 17R 8ER 11BB 42K Brady Aikens last start was the 18th - 4.2 IP 0H 0R 0ER 1BB 12K

QUOTE (fathom @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 05:01 PM) I can't see Hahn passing on a possible #1 just to have more money for later rounds I think it is gamesmanship. There are 4 pitchers that could be in play for the Sox there, and RH could be setting them up to say he will take the one that will sign on his terms. If it comes to Aiken, Rodon, Hoffman, Kolek, Beede, Newcomb, and Holmes, it is tough to say you are making the wrong call by selecting any of them.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 05:03 PM) Yeah it's curious, no real obvious candidates amongst the top prospects at the moment. lol at Hawk: "In all my 55 years in the game, this White Sox club has more young talent than any team I've ever seen" Same line every 10 years.

QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 04:36 PM) I'm wondering which of the names we've discussed might fall into this category. I'm guessing NOT Rodon. I would still guess Hoffman. Beede already turned down first round money from the Jays once. Can't see a HS SP going under slot, but Aiken, Kolek, and Holmes sure sound intriguing.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 04:59 PM) Flowers hurt on swing. Hawk speculates its an oblique. Catching situation just went from bad to worse. Thread should be changed to "Hector Gimenez is your 2014 starting catcher"

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 04:23 PM) I cringed when I heard they were targeting "major league ready" prospects, but I thought that they were going to augment that by spending in free-agency. I didn't understand limiting the prospect pool to trade for and not spending money. But they have also supplemented the major league ready talent with younger upside talent in the minors. If all these guys fail, we have other options that will be presenting themselves internally. We are going to get another pretty decent pitched in this draft along with who knows what else. In addition to that, payroll flexibility is a huge X-factor in being able to fill in the gaps when the team is competitive enough to warrant such a thing. There is no award for being mediocre in baseball. If the Sox are not a legit threat to win the division, its OK to have a bumpy season as it allows the team to improve that much quicker in the draft. Washington is a good example, they had back to back #1 picks to add to their core player of Zimmerman than went out and supplemented the roster through trades and free agency to become a really solid team. The Sox tried to spend money, they targeted McCann and Tanaka as potential difference makers and pursued them, but there is no reason to throw money around if there is not someone worth it, save that money to make a run at Headley next season.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 04:26 PM) From the game thread: Ha...We will see.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 21, 2014 -> 02:16 PM) Aside from the Davidson trade, what has Hahn done that was not expected? By most accounts, the Cubs got a better return for Garza than he did for Peavy and he got nothing for Rios. As far as rebuilds taking time, yes they do. However, by trading for near ready prospects, they've chosen a shorter timeline for this rebuild than your run-of-the-mill one and judging by that I don't think enough was done over the winter. I don't think Hahn has done a bad job, just not enough given the timeline. On the other side, Hahn has take a lot of risk out of his acquisitions by acquiring guys that are major league ready as they have at least ML level floors. He traded Peavy and received a ML ready talent in Garcia two lottery tickets in Montas a guy that projects as at least a high leverage reliever, and glove first SS and a third guy that has a chance to be a bullpen guy. He dumped almost $20M of Rios' deal for a super UT player. Not a great return, but it freed up money for Abreu. He turned a back end of the rotation starter and a guy that was going to be moved off the 40 man roster into a cost controlled lead off hitter that was a top 100 prospect before his injury last season. He turned a soon to be expensive closer into another top 100 prospect. He ran one of the best drafts in baseball last season as the Sox pulled in several guys (Engel, May, Mitchell, and Goldberg) who already showing good potential and the ability to move fast through the system. He signed the best power prospect in the international July 2 class. It would have been nice to grab Tanaka, but you can't financially hamstring the franchise to take a chance on a guy that has never played in the majors. I can not think of any really poor moves Hahn has made. He is setting up this team to produce its own talent, and when they are close to competing he has left the team the financial flexibility to fill in any gaps at that time.