Texsox

It is a requirement as a Sox fan to have a media persecution complex. We must always believe we get no respect and the media is always out to get us.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Jan 29, 2007 -> 10:15 AM) Wowza. When did Oscar Wilde become a "reformed homosexual," I must have missed that. . . Thank goodness Tori Amos is still okay. And Sinead O'Connor and most importantly: I can keep my Wham! songs. Whew. . . Wake me up before you go go . . .

QUOTE(Steff @ Jan 29, 2007 -> 10:27 AM) Correct. So if Kenny just keeps his mouth shut the media has nothing to stir, right? It's their job. How can you fault them for doing their job? Exactly. Both sides need to keep quiet and everybody wins.

If it wasn't so sad, it would be funny.

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Jan 29, 2007 -> 12:34 AM) AP will offer several versions of the same story on the wire. One for SD papers and stations, another for national papers and stations. I'd be surprised if the SD version of the story wasn't organized differently. Unless things have changed, AP customers can rewrite the story to fit their market. They do not have to run it exactly as written. (But most do)

I should have phrased the last question a little differently. At what point in the creative process does something cross over and become art? I remember eating a Pat's Pizza in Grayslake and a lady far smarter than I put forth the idea that this lump of clay is just a lump of clay until the artist shows it to someone. If the audience comes forward, looks, digests, and says, hey, that's just a lump of clay on a wheel! We might not have art. But walking into your context argument, and here's where I will agree with you. If the audience approaches, looks, and says "hey that speaks to the terror of an artist without inspiration" then you have art. She went on with other really good examples. That was 25 years ago, and I remember thinking she is a genius. Maybe I can get her drunk and she'll go out with me. (she did, and didn't) I believe the Church does speak out on about everything, but the publicity is always different. If the Church is standing with everyone else, they aren't mentioned. As soon as they are standing apart, it is news and gets reported. That leaves a mistaken impression that the Church is always by themselves.

He will be an idiot (again) as soon as he picks against us. The further he gets away from NY-Bos the worse he gets, but still does a very good job.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Jan 28, 2007 -> 01:10 PM) Ask any Sox fan why Robin Ventura left. Also ask them about the White Flag trade. Also if you stop and think about your question for a second... If the Sox are letting a player leave, there is probably a reason behind it. Why would they keep players who are aft-injured, clubhouse cancers, greedy, etc? That doesn't make any sense. It seems that as soon as a guy leaves, especially for money reasons, the next thing we hear are comments trashing the guy. I can't believe that every player that leaves is a terrible guy. I think the team smears some guys unfairly.

Just a little thought on the whole IDing thing. Would any of this make sense Bob Wills (Sears Roebuck) was arrested today in suspicion of molesting a child . . . Rob Hall (Democratic Voter) was arrested today in suspicion of molesting a child . . . Why do we want to know the party, (and we do)? Because we want to know if it's one of "our guys". Who cares about the kid, but was it one of "our guys" or one of "theirs"? How sad is that? Why don't we start holding these guys to the same standard regardless of which side of the aisle they sit? If convicted, the guy is a scum and should be tossed out on his ass. We all agree on that.

Of course the Church is preaching. So is the NRA, the Sierra Club, and every artist that displays their works. The works crossed their line, and that's exactly when they should speak out. Like an audience viewing a work of art, it is up to them to agree or disagree. Many will disagree, many will agree. But the process should be allowed. For some the Church speaking out will guarantee they want to see the movie, others will stay away. This is all part of free speech. If you want free speech for your works, than how can you argue against free speech? And to partially back up to Mary Shelly and Frankenstein, I also enjoy knowing her background and the stories surrounding that work. But I consider them in two different piles. I guess I want to give the artist the opportunity to shed their skin and create something. For example, if to better grasp the Conservative agenda I decided to write a pro conservative book, and it has merits as a pro conservative book, shouldn't that be enough? Historical fiction, something I have just started reading, seems to be about the hardest. To take something like the Civil War and weave a fictional work into it, while remaining historically accurate, boggles my mind. Not to get this off to a tree falling in the woods discussion, but does art exist without an audience? Or does something become art as soon as an audience is involved? I'd rather be having this conversation over a beer . . .

Safe Bands: How the hell does Cyndi Lauper get on any list?? OK, I do enjoy Jars of Clay and Flood is one of my top 25 Rock tunes. But, I'm taking my chances and hoping the Gay Cooties don't infect me through my speakers.

I'm a big fan of the Boy Scout Personal Management Merit Badge, which is required for Eagle Scout rank. Covers all that and more. We have a Senior VP at one of the banks that teaches the class for my Troop. The adults volunteer to monitor,

Not in order, but to answer a couple points, I do not consider my writing art, I do consider most fiction and even some stuff in my area as art. I'm trying to convey information in the most direct way possible and doing my best to write interpretation out of it. I need a wide audience to come away with the exact same information and understanding. This kind of writing is so much easier. Almost anyone with expertise in a field can have a book published. Non fiction is almost easy in that regard. Fiction? I would hate to try and figure out how many wind up gathering mold and how many get published. I am surprised by your first line. Shut up if you're the minority opinion? I can't accept that. In this case, with a billion Catholics world wide, I guess the Church doesn't have to worry too much about that. But I'd defend almost anyone in expressing their views. I have not objected to others expressing their views, I've objected to those who wish to silence the Church. You are correct, you have to listen to other opinions and have your ideas and beliefs tested from time to time. Of course I would not share your last paragraph. I don't need to know anything about the author to enjoy or not enjoy his work. So his belief structure isn't important to how I few the work. Frankenstein is a great work regardless if it was written by a 23 year old female on her first novel, or a 60 year old man with 23 books to his credit. I can think of a time when an idea is presented but not shown and I would still object to it. If for example the film was to glorify the mass murders at Columbine, to hold them up as heroes, I'd have a problem with that. I'm certain that most everyone could provide an example. Ideas are powerful, if you didn't believe that you wouldn't, or shouldn't, be an author. Ideas are all you have. Well maybe not all, but that's a big part of the job.

QUOTE(G&T @ Jan 28, 2007 -> 08:55 AM) I think we all know that a lot of things happen during contract negotiations, and if fans heard all of them there would be an up roar. All he's saying is that he doesn't want those things to come out. Also, remember what happen when Frank Thomas left? He doesn't want that to happen again. In my lifetime we can go back to Fisk. When was the last time a player left and it was the club's fault? The player is always greedy, injured, club house cancer, etc.

Shipwrecked Southsider2k5 was on a cruise ship in the Caribbean for the first time. It was wonderful, the experience of his life. He was being waited on hand an foot. But, it did not last. A Hurricane came up unexpectedly. The ship went down almost instantly. He found himself, he knew not how, swept up on the shore of an island. There was nothing else anywhere to be seen. No person, no supplies, nothing. He looked around. There were some bananas and coconuts, but that was it. He was desperate, and forlorn, but decided to make the best of it. So for the next four months he ate bananas, drank coconut juice and mostly looked to the sea mightily for a ship to come to his rescue. One day, as he was lying on the beech stroking his beard and looking for a ship, he spotted movement out of the corner of his eye. Could it be true, was it a ship? No, from around the corner of the island came this rowboat. In it was the most gorgeous woman he had ever seen, or at least seen in 4 months. She was tall, tanned, and her blond hair flowing in the sea breeze gave her an almost ethereal quality. She spotted him also as he was waving and yelling and screaming to get her attention. She rowed her boat towards him. In disbelief, he asked, "Where did you come from? How did you get here"? She said, "I rowed from the other side of the island. I landed on this island when my cruise ship sank" "Amazing," he said, "I didn't know anyone else had survived. How many of you are there? Where, did you get the rowboat? You must have been really lucky to have a rowboat wash-up with you?" "It is only me,"she said, "and the rowboat didn't wash up, nothing else did." "Well then," said the man, "how did you get the rowboat?" "I made the rowboat out of raw material that I found on the island," replied the woman. "The oars were whittled from Gum tree branches, I wove the bottom from Palm branches, and the sides and stern came from a Eucalyptus tree". "But, but," he asked, "what about tools and hardware, how did you do that?" "Oh, no problem," replied the woman, "on the south side of the island there is a very unusual strata of alluvial rock exposed. I found that If I fired it to a certain temperature in my kiln, it melted into forgeable ductile iron. I used that for tools, and used the tools to make the hardware. But, enough of that," she said. "Where do you live?" At last he was forced to confess that he had been sleeping on the beach. "Well, let's row over to my place," she said. So they both got into the rowboat and left for her side of island. The woman easily rowed them around to a wharf that led to the approach to her place. She tied up the rowboat with a beautifully woven hemp rope. They walked up a stone walk and around a Palm tree, there stood an exquisite bungalow painted in blue and white. "It's not much," she said, "but I call it home. Sit down please, would you like to have a drink?" "No," said SS2k5, "one more coconut juice and I will puke." "It won't be coconut juice," the woman replied, "I have a still, how about a Pina Colada?" Trying to hide his continued amazement, he accepted, and they sat down on her couch to talk. After a while, and they had exchanged their stories, the woman asked, "Tell me, have you always had a beard?" "No," he replied, "I was clean shaven all of my life, and even on the cruise ship". "Well if you would like to shave, there is a man's razor upstairs in the cabinet in the bathroom." So, SS2k5, no longer questioning anything, went upstairs to the bath room. There in the cabinet was a razor made from a bone handle, two shells honed to a hollow ground edge were fastened on to its end inside of a swivel mechanism. The man shaved, showered and went back down stairs.. "You look great," said the woman, "I think I will go up and slip into something more comfortable." So she did. And, the man continued to sip his Pina Colada. After a short time, the woman returned wearing fig leafs strategically positioned and smelling faintly of gardenia. "Tell me," she asked, "we have both been out here for a very long time with no companionship. You know what I mean. Have you been lonely, is there anything that you really miss? Something that all men and woman need. Something that it would be really nice to have right now." "Yes there is," SS2k5 replied, as he moved closer to the woman while fixing a winsome gaze upon her. "Tell me ... Do you happen to have an Internet connection?"

Wooden Heart - Joe Dowell 18th birthday - My Sharona - The Knack (I like Dahl's version better) Wedding Day - Every Breath You Take - Police

The Dems will find this amusing. Link or chilling I'd suggest the GOPerheads around here not click on the link.

Quote from Kenny regarding a meeting with a player's parents. (The player really doesn't matter) Hmmmm. Could it be read into it that in some cases they do turn a player into something to protect the organization? His next line leads me to believe he understands he can distort the fans opinion of a player for the team's good. It seems that almost every top player that leaves the team does so while taking shots back and forth with current club management.

QUOTE(Alpha Dog @ Jan 28, 2007 -> 07:57 AM) As far as government programs go, this one seems pretty low key. A nice clearinghouse for that kind of information. Not sure how many people are aware it exists, though. I have never heard of the U.S. Financial Literacy and Education Commission. Also, not to open up a side discussion here, but I am not sure I like the idea of a spanish link on it. English only would have been just fine. I view the Spanish version the same way I view the braille. There are literally thousands of these programs.

Linked here

QUOTE(Rooftop Shots @ Jan 27, 2007 -> 07:31 PM) Tex! I thought my one-liner was good with the oriental doctor, but man........you did me in with yours. Still laughing as I type this. One of the best one-liners I've heard in quite a while. Had an extremely tough physical and emotional day at work today. NEEDED a good laugh. Got it ten-fold with your post. Thanks!!! Recycled joke. But thanks.

Almost every group has a social commentary. It is the NRA telling us what gun laws we should have. The Sierra Club telling us how to protect the environment. Artists commenting on every human experience. And the Church commenting on social and moral issues. They all are tossed into the mix. You wouldn't expect the NRA to stop because a NRA member used a firearm illegally, or if the Sierra Club had a member who worked for a company that polluted. Why some people are threatened by the Church speaking out on moral grounds, but can tolerate other groups and their dissenting views, doesn't make sense to me. And it is ironic that the Catholic Church owns arguably one of the greatest collections of art anywhere. So the Church supporting the arts is a long and deep tradition. As you can probably tell I have sat and listened to debates on the meaning behind art and the artists inspiration. My writing is more utilitarian. Writing outdoors articles for various small publications, newspaper stuff, and now writing a newsletter for Scouters. I don't consider it art. Just communications. What shapes my view and over all theory on creativity could be rooted in the phrase "giving birth" to a work of art. Like giving birth to a kid, the artist has lost control once it is exhibited, no matter what the audience. So if society does draw an absolute line, it has to be enforced in the beginning, not in the end. Once Pandora's box is open, it can't be closed. The tension in all this is the relationship between the artist and the audience. As you are siding with the artists and I the audience. I wrote a feature for a newspaper once on what was said and what it means. One of the lines that struck a nerve and actually drew a response was The artist said "the audience can't understand my work" it means the work sucked. I had seen too many artists complain about the audience when, in fact, their work sucks. I have amended that belief and now would say the work appeals to a very narrow audience, perhaps just himself. How many artists have you met that loath the audience? The hate the unwashed masses that can't grasp their art, but crave the accolades, the feedback. A good audience brings themselves to the art. I believe an artist that believes that theirs is the one true interpretation has taken the audience out of the equation, and that doesn't reflect reality. There is a singular point in time and place when someone is experiencing the work. No two object can occupy the same space at the same time. Meaning changes with time. It also dismisses what the audience brings to the experience. They are not blank tablets. They have had their experiences. Their vocabulary, their vision (actually how well they see color and shapes). I agree that cutting out the original visionary in any work is fraught with danger and almost always results in a degradation of the project. There may be some value in someone schooled in the new medium to help with the process. But for the most past give me the original. You didn't mention this example but it hits hard to this point, I much prefer a well crafted song being sung poorly by the writer, then well by someone who paid for the song with money and not their blood, sweat, toil, and tears. Context is important, actually critical, from a quality of work standpoint but not from a legal point of view. Taking the stuff that society tells us we can not produce, I'll continue to use child porn because it is one of the few absolutes we have. No matter what the context, you can't show penetration with a minor. We have censored that up front, everyone knows it, it's a line that can not be crossed. We do not allow the artist to produce that work and then judge. We know in advance, it's wrong and you are going to jail. If society found other absolutes, they would have to be similarly enforced. Not after the fact, but clearly spelled out before. Every person self-censors, some better than others. Every person has a belief about a higher power. Some believe that their is a high power and that guides their behavior. Some believe their is no higher power and that guides their behavior. Why should society be told to only listen to those who believe that there is no higher power? What makes their beliefs on moral issues superior to all others?

When my resources were different I suppported several artists through grants and gifts, so I've seen plenty of non commercial art. All would produce some emotional or physical reaction. You speak of understanding. Each person walks away with their understanding. It doesn't have to match what the artist believes it to be. When you are experiencing a work of art, it is a singular moment in time and space. You and the artist can not occupy that same space, so each reality has to be different. Once an artist steps away from the work, it becomes the worlds. I think the audience has a responsibility to experience the work as the artist intends, I refuse to judge a painting, for example, by looking at a photograph. Same with any sculpture. The interplay of light means so much in those venues and to see a flat lit, two dimensional "mis"-representation is unfair. This links back to your last paragraph. If you (not necessarily you, but in general) don't know the inspiration, how can the artist really know the true meaning? You could have a past life that is coming through. An experience that is being reveiled. We may think we know why we have done something, but it isn't always a match. Help me with your context point. Show me something that is clearly forbidden in our society, that could be OK in the proper context? And this really all comes down to boundaries and limits. I believe in them, that they can be absolute, and can be set ahead of time. You believe boundaries exist to tell us if an artist has crossed the boundary, but they should be free to cross whatever boundary, and we'll worry about the effects and affects, later. What am I doing? First I'm defending my right, through my Church, to speak out. When I see myself being told I can not speak out because some idiot broke the law and another person covered it up, it seems wrong. When one billion people are told to STFU because of a handful of people who should burn in hell, I'm going to stick up for my free speech rights. But honestly, getting a glimpse into your thinking on art and it's interpretation is far more interesting than this movie.

QUOTE(Alpha Dog @ Jan 27, 2007 -> 06:40 PM) No, it isn't the most important part of the story. But to deny that it IS important is simply putting your head in the sand. Cerainly important enough to be mentioned before the last paragraph of the story. I also hope he gets the full punishment allowed. Who is it important to? Scum like this are scum no matter which party they belong to. I guess if someone wants to extract political gain in all this it's important. I'm certain the victim will be happy the GOP could maybe put the hurt on Dems for this. Then it will all be worthwhile. Just shoot me if I ever put some kids life behind political revenge.

If someone needs to know what they are doing to appreciate someone's art, then the artist hasn't done their job, not the other way around. I thought art was about conveying meaning, moving people either emotionally or physically. 99.99% of the Church worldwide, both lay people and clergy, are outraged at what the Church allowed to happen and covered up. If the good people of the Church are taking over and condemning that practice, isn't that a good thing? Why should 99.99% of the people remain silent and .001% in effect be the ones that are talking? Isn't that admitting defeat and allowing the guilty to take over? You can censor without meaning. The most obvious example is child pornography. No meaning in the world will allow that. If you always allow the artist to create and display, there are no boundaries. So you would have to reject the whole testing boundaries argument. We also open an unenforceable situation where you can't stop me, that's not what I meant. That child in bondage represents the new Iraqi government and that missile shaped object next to his butt is Iran. Of course that segues into the "community values" argument that we will both agree is crap. Editing yes, but rarely would a filmmaker start with a movie about a honeymoon in Vegas and wind up with a summer camp horror movie. But we're splitting hairs here and non productive. Back to the true meaning. With the mystery of the creative process, do you always know where your inspiration is coming from? If you don't know what is truly inspiring a work, how do you even know the meaning? Further to the point, it is a rare an artist doesn't view a work differently years after creating it. So meaning becomes fluid in the synopsis of our brains.