Eminor3rd

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 12:53 PM) I can understand folks wanting to make what some may think is an impact trade, but I really see the need for two trades. Lowe is a starter and we have six now. We are in a pennant race and only 3 1/2 games out and we want to trade away a solid hitter and a guy with a lot of upside and then turn around and trade a starter for "young talent." I don't see what we are really benefiting. Maybe a relief pitcher. Ok then now we have a surplus of releif pitchers. People are quick to low ball our own talent and raise the stakes on someone elses. It wasn't too long ago we heard calmoring for the trades of Paul Konerko, AJP, Beckham and others. I agree 100% that it hurts our chances this year. I think it's one of those things where you get presented with an opportunity at a time that isn't quite ideal. I highly doubt KW was shopping CQ to Atlanta, it seems more likely that Atlanta, who has a very public need for a good OF bat, inquired about CQ/Rios instead. Now KW has to decide if it's worth it to rely on Viciedo for the rest of the season in order to make a trade now that he would really love to make in the offseason, but won't likely be available then.

QUOTE (Real @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 12:32 PM) omfg... Pierre stays but Quentin goes? this is exactly the type of stupid bulls*** I'd expect of the Sox tbh If anyone, at all, wanted Pierre, I have no doubt that he'd be gone.

QUOTE (kapzk @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 11:35 AM) ya prolly not since that would take out 2 regular starters out of the Braves rotation, maybe we add in Jackson/Floyd and they add in a prospect Also leaves us with a ton of extra starters and an OF of Pierre/Lilli/Viciedo

QUOTE (kapzk @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 11:30 AM) If thats the case then I hope our pitching staff would be like this: Peavy, Buerhle, Danks, Beachy, Lowe Someway we get rid of Jackson and Floyd for prospects or offensive help I highly doubt the both Lowe and Beachy go, as much as I highly doubt that both Rios and CQ go. I think it's either a Rios/Lowe or CQ/Beachy situation, with some add-ins here or there.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 11:17 AM) Trade way a 30 homer 100 RBI man who just got named to the All-Star team. Makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I think the point is that KW has seen this before. CQ can be a monster, but he's proven that he's streaky and prone to long stretches of bad. That being said, his value is currently at a premium and he's setting himself up for a big arbitration raise or contract extension. Given that Viciedo is essentially the same type of player, it makes a ton of sense to consider dumping the more expensive and still risky CQ while we can maximize the return. Now, it absolutely makes us worse right now, but it's an opportunity to be in much better shape going forward, and it's an opportunity that won't last for very long. I don't know if it's the right move, but I think it's something you have to consider.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 09:47 AM) I went ahead and put all of the posts together in one thread. Sorry, just noticed the catch-all convo. Posted too quickly. QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 5, 2011 -> 09:35 AM) Lowe for Rios? This would be horrible. Who is going to play CF? Lillibridge? Rios is having a horrible year, but why sell him low, when we have no reasonable replacement, for an older player to add to an already crowded pitching rotation, and get no salary relief in return? Rios is better than he has been playing, no use for a bad contract swap here.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/arti...week/?page=full Speculation, indeed. But interesting to think about.

It's boring, but it's true: The way this team gets better is by underperforming stars playing like they should be playing. If we had the 2010 versions of Dunn and Rios, we'd be 6 games up in the division. Add a good version of Beckham to the mix, and Pierre could go 0 for his next 300 and we'd still have this thing in the bag. Which leads to a related thought: We can still be "all-in" next year without adding anybody at all in free agency, save maybe a reliever or two. If we let both EJax and MB walk, this our starting rotation: Danks Peavy Floyd Humber Sale That assumes that Peavy stops finding new ways to get injured, Humber doesn't turn bad, and Sale can successfully make the transition to SP. It isn't unrealistic to bet on two of those three things occurring. If Pierre walks and CQ stays, our lineup looks like this: SS Ramirez 2B Beckham DH Dunn 1B Konerko LF Quentin RF Viciedo CF Rios C Pierzynski 3B Morel When you look at that, imagine the Dunn is actually Dunn, Rios performs like last season, and Beckham gets closer to his peak. That's rather solid for AL Central. Yeah, almost everything has to go right, but if you really think about it, only three guys in our lineup (PK, CQ, AR) are having decent seasons. The remaining 6 are severely underperforming. You can't assume that over half your guys are going to have down years - if that happens, you can;t do much about it. If even 6 of those 9 have average years, and that pitching staff stays healthy, this team could be much better next year even without replacing the $30m coming off the books in EJ, MB, and JP.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/m...ey-and-figgins/

Ozzie loses games with regularity with bad, over-aggressive "small ball" moves. KW cannot be faulted for Dunn, that should have been a slam dunk, and may be over the rest of the contract. The Peavy move was risky but not a horrible decision, so far it has worked out close to worst case scenario. The Jackson trade was stupid, and the Rios waiver claim was perhaps too risky, although who would be in CF now otherwise? KW has a good team on the field, they're just not playing well. Ozzie hurts the team every day, he goes.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 21, 2011 -> 03:35 PM) I hesitated to respond to this post, but what the heck. My response is you don't trade Paul Konerko. If we think of trading people think of what other teams might need to help themselves compete the rest of this season: A thirdbaseman maybe = Mark Teahan who is fielding well but not playing eough to get back on track with the glove An outfielder maybe = Juan Pierre, who seems to be slumping and taking the wrath of Sox fans and is holding up Dayan Viciedo. A DH/IB/OF with a big contract like Adam Dunn, who just hasn't peformed at all. But Dunn has so much upside and later this season adn for sure in 2012 could be the big boper again. All we could hope for is some team takig hius salary and thinking he will benefit from a change of scenery Pitching: A starter maybe? Edwin Jackson possibly A relief pitcher? Maybe Tony Pena or Matt Thornton? Not advocating any trade here, but you don't trade away your best player and give up when you are just 5 1/2 back This is straight out of the "video game trade strategy" book.

Hoping Zambrano gets shelled tonight so he might flip out.

QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jun 20, 2011 -> 03:14 PM) Omar is definitely in. Really? I'm not a hater, and could see him going both ways, but I don't think he has the counting stats to make the voters care about him. The almost 3,000 hits thing is way diluted by him playing like 35 seasons or whatever. At the very least, I'm not buying that he's "definitely in." I agree though, that he is statistically superior to Ozzie Smith. Never really saw Ozzie play, so there might be some intangible attachment there that I don't understand, but Omar has a better case than Ozzie.

Hall of Very Good, probably right next to Paulie. EDIT: And Omar

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 03:28 PM) This isn't at all true of this season's alexei ramirez. I was careful to say "tends." It's certainly possible that he has developed more plate discipline and better contact skills, and I hope that he has. However, this season so far isn't a reliable sample when compared to the rest of his career, so I wouldn't be comfortable considering it a long-term option quite yet.

QUOTE (kapzk @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 02:27 PM) Anybody think this lead-off hitter thing is over rated. Well I mean yea we would like some one who is speedy and could get on base, some one in the mold of Juan Pierre (when he was good years ago). But I think its over blown we should just put a good bat up at the top, which seems to be like Alexei, Lillibridge as the ideal candidates. Speed is overblown in the leadoff spot, but OBP isn't. Problem with Alexei is that he tends to have an OBP of .330ish. Most of Alexei's value is in extra base hits, which is best put in fornt of OBP guys.

QUOTE (kapzk @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 02:20 PM) Quite sure Blue Jays OBP is heavily impacted by Bautista's .500 OBP. There is nothing to really worry about cuz we are only removing Pierre and it's not like we are getting any significant production from his bat. Any bat replacing him is great. Yeah, definitely. Pierre is an everything-sink right now. Not saying we'd be worse off putting any of our hitters at leadoff instead of him, just that we don't really have any good leadoff candidates, including him.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 02:10 PM) Currently, the White Sox have the 6th best OBP in the AL (conveniently the Blue Jays are 5th). If Rios and Dunn were hitting their weights, then the Sox would probably have the 3rd best OBP in the AL. Interesting.

This team is going to be like the 2010 Blue Jays. All power, no on-base. It sucks that our only reliable on-base guy happens to be one of the slowest guys in the majors, lol.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 02:00 PM) You're going to call me crazy and I would too. Viciedo. It's not crazy at all, if you buy into Tango's lineup optimization research. According to linear weights , the 2-hole should be possibly your best or second best overall run producer. I don't know if that will be Viciedo, but it certainly could be.

QUOTE (forrestg @ Jun 14, 2011 -> 01:51 PM) you can't gdip if you lead off an inning. The only time you can rely on the leadoff hitter leading an inning off is the first inning.

Yeah, no good option for leadoff on this team, including Pierre. Rios and Alexei are both uncharacteristically high power, low on-base guys for their typical positions.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 10, 2011 -> 12:24 AM) So we've beaten Pineda, Felix and Cahill in 3 of our last 4 games. That's pretty impressive. I have no idea who this guy is they're running out there Friday night. But let's just pummel him for the hell of it and take names later. GIO!

Well, the article also compared him to Carlos Beltran... so there's THAT... lol

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 7, 2011 -> 11:12 PM) Yeah it is, Morel was fast tracked to the bigs because of his defense. They understand that half of the game is catching the ball, and finding and developing someone who can do it really well would be a great thing. Also, perhaps I am thinking in correctly, but I didn't think you got a draft pick the following year if it was a supplemental pick. If that is the case, then they better sign him. Morel was fast-tracked because there was literally no one around that could play anything close to an acceptable third base except Omar Vizquel and Gordon Beckham. If Gordon moved, they'd have th same problem with second.