BlackSox13

Well this thread just got interesting really fast!

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 08:25 PM) That page is a cesspool of meatball fandom. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 08:27 PM) It is the equivalent of yelling at a cashier at Wal_mart because you are pissed at the Walton family. Thanks for the laugh!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 08:19 PM) God if that team gets some pitching out of Darvish that would be one helluva scary opponent. I kinda want to see them do it, set up a lineup that if they stay healthy compares to Torotno. You aren't kidding they would be scary. Makes alot of sense for Upton because he should put up some really good numbers in that park with that lineup and set himslef up for a wicked contract next year. QUOTE (Saufley @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 08:19 PM) More "good" news for my White Sox. This is getting more depressing everyday. Sorry my man. Just posting what I come across. For some crazy reason I still have faith in the FO to get an outfield upgrade despite the Cespedes/Upton rumors. Just not sure what the heck that upgrade will be.

http://sportsday.dallasnews.com/texas-rang...er-justin-upton ESPN senior writer Buster Olney wrote that, "If Justin Upton gets to the point when he seriously thinks about a one-year deal the Rangers may well be the best option." "Texas has an excellent lineup already, they inhabit a really good hitters' park, and Upton wouldn't go there expected to carry the offensive load himself," Olney observed. "He could slot in among Prince Fielder, Adrian Beltre, Shin-Soo Choo, Rougned Odor and others and do some major damage there, which would give him an excellent chance to play in the postseason before hitting the market again next fall."

http://risingapple.com/2016/01/18/mets-col...rn-to-new-york/ “I talked to Sandy (Alderson) today, and hopefully we’ll continue to move forward [in those negotiations],” Collins told Barry Bloom of MLB.com. “I don’t know where Cespedes is at contract-wise with anybody else, but I know he wants to come back to New York if he can. He’s a great player and we’d love to have him back.”

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 06:18 PM) More Merkin rainbows and sunshine articles. What, no unicorns? Damn!

Fwiw, I started a thread on Hernandez so it wouldnt turn this thread into a cluster-a-la-f***.

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/eye-on-baseba...case-for-feb-23 "Another intriguing outfielder option is about to hit the free-agent market. Yadiel Hernandez, who defected from Cuba in June 2015 when his team was visiting North Carolina, announced he will make himself available in a personal showcase for all interested Major League Baseball teams Feb. 23. It will happen in Mexico City." BA: http://www.baseballamerica.com/internation...north-carolina/ "Hernandez, 27, will be exempt from the international bonus pools, though he is still several months away from being cleared to sign. Hernandez, who can play left or right field, doesn’t have one loud tool, but he has been one of the top performers in Cuba’s Serie Nacional in recent years. He has good bat control from the left side, a keen eye at the plate and occasional pop, though his offensive game is about on-base skills over power. At 5-foot-10, 185 pounds, Hernandez had started to play a larger role recently on the Cuban national team with so many outfielders leaving the country, including an appearance at the Caribbean Series in February in Puerto Rico. Playing for Matanzas in Serie Nacional this past season, which ended in April, Hernandez batted .369/.509/.535 with seven home runs, 77 walks (13 intentional) and 47 strikeouts in 369 plate appearances. He ranked second in batting average, OBP and walks, ranked fifth in slugging and tied for third in doubles (20)."

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 07:41 PM) A showcase workout for Cuban left-handed hitting outfielder Yadiel Hernandez will be held Feb. 23 in Mexico City. Hernandez, 28, batted .369 for Mazanzas in 2014, has a .324 lifetime batting average in Cuba, a team can sign him without being subject to the international signing bonus pool rules, according to his representatives. www.chicagotribune.com Here's another opportunity. Anyone want to do some research? Found this from a BA article written last June. http://www.baseballamerica.com/internation...north-carolina/ "At 5-foot-10, 185 pounds, Hernandez had started to play a larger role recently on the Cuban national team with so many outfielders leaving the country, including an appearance at the Caribbean Series in February in Puerto Rico. Playing for Matanzas in Serie Nacional this past season, which ended in April, Hernandez batted .369/.509/.535 with seven home runs, 77 walks (13 intentional) and 47 strikeouts in 369 plate appearances. He ranked second in batting average, OBP and walks, ranked fifth in slugging and tied for third in doubles (20)."

QUOTE (Baron @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 07:06 PM) Better than 4th. But apparently he spoke to Adam Dunn and Magglio Ordonez about Garcia. Let's just say that he doesnt expect Garcia to get any better than he is now. They were talking about Fowler for a bit on his contract. They think his contract demands drop pretty significantly(apparently it was at 60 million) Thanks for passing that along, much appreciate it. Sounds as though Dunn and Maggs possibly see the flaws that we had seen on a daily basis from Avi. I can only imagine the Sox see it as well and is why the Sox are in the market for an outfielder. Fowler. Man, am I on the fence with him. I like his speed, his pop and OBP but his defense leaves something to be desired and I'm not a fan of giving up a comp pick for him. He would be an outfield upgrade but not sure he would be worth the money or the comp pick. QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 07:24 PM) Austin Jackson for less $$ and no comp pick attached is a better option than Fowler for more $$ and the loss of a top 30 draft pick. I'd prefer Cespedes. If I'm giving up a draft pick though it's for Upton. I'm not really advocating one way or another really although if I had to choose it would be Jackson due to better defense, lower cost and no comp pick. I was just explaining the Sox interest in Fowler is partly due to him being a switch hitter and the Sox could use a lefty bat although preferably one with more power for the middle of the order but Fowler could be a nice #1 or #2 hitter. All that said, I still hope for an alternative to both.

QUOTE (Baron @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 06:49 PM) I just spoke with Bowden. He said he doesnt want to see Fowler on the White Sox. Plus if we dont sign Cespedes or Upton your probably finishing last in the division. Ouch. I wonder where Bowden see's the Sox with Cespedes. 4th?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 05:59 PM) Misread your comment on Jackson, thought you were saying he'd outproduce Cespedes offensively in a smaller park. As for this left-handed OF talk, we know the Sox had/have interest in Cepsedes, Upton, & Fowler. Those are all right-handed OFs. The Sox are simply looking for an improvement over Avi. Worst case scenario they probably want a left-handed bat to platoon with Avi. Either way, you're overstating their interest in a left-handed OF. In all fairness Fowler is a switch hitter so he would provide some pop from the left side ( 13 HR as a LH in '15). Also, its been speculated all off season that the outfielder the Sox wanted most was Alex Gordon due to his LHB, OBP, great defense and would have been a good middle of the order bat or even #2 in the lineup. This, despite Gordon being the oldest FA OF at 32. There's no overstating the Sox desire for a LHB. If anything, the Sox spending big money on Cespedes/Upton is what's being overstated by the media. Even after last week when the Sox reportedly turned their attention away from Cespedes/Upton and began looking at Fowler/CarGo, some fans could not let go of the Cespedes idea.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 05:34 PM) You think Jackson will put better offensive numbers than Cespedes if both played in the Cell? Nope and nowhere did I say that either. QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 05:37 PM) I'm sorry, but didn't Dan Hayes simply say that's what he thought we might do? He's not cued into s***, so I would stop taking what he says as gospel. The Sox aren't going to limit themselves to left-handed OFs. No one is taking what he says as gospel and I've been one to criticize Hayes on more than a few occasions. However, I think what Hayes said could have some truth considering the Sox have checked in on all three of Colorado's left handed outfielders, specifically CarGo for his left handed power. Anyone can look at the lineup and see the Sox power comes from the right side so looking for a LH outfielder with pop makes sense, not gospel.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 05:28 PM) Oh he's going to meltdown. Nah, Mike will be fine and I believe him when he says he'll be disappointed but won't blow a gasket. There are others that stand a much better chance of melting down, and they likely will.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 05:24 PM) Why wouldn't we just sign Jackson if we're going to settle for a question mark? Because Jackson is right handed and the Sox are looking for a left handed outfielder. Also, the equivalent OF of the Lawrie trade would be cheaper than a FA veteran.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 04:54 PM) I'm not going to meltdown if the Sox lose out on him. I'll be disappointed, but I won't blow a gasket. Atta boy!

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 04:39 PM) In this vein, it is interesting to note that Jackson's career numbers are not that far from Cespedes', in some respects: A. Jackson .273 .333 .399 .732 Y. Cespedes .271 .319 .483 .805 If you look at his 5 year career in Detroit and compare it to Cespedes career, without that strong finish last year in N.Y., his numbers are actually better. The question is; could Jackson's performance, after the trade to Seattle be an outlier? And, could Cespedes performance in N.Y. be one, as well? My guess is yes to both. I believe Jackson will have better offensive and defensive numbers in a smaller park than Comerica/SafeCo. Cespedes, to me, looks like a classic example of a player having a career year just before FA and then regresses under the new contract that pays him based on that career year.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 04:29 PM) he's basically right, but what's the alternative? Give the few remaining prospects for Cargo, whose game is full of holes itself? And while Cespedes had a career year, at least the trend is upward. Given that they traded 3 solid (if not better) prospects for 2 years of Frazier, they've got to follow this up some way. (Now if it's Cargo, I'd hope they don't follow it up and just take the losses with Frazier). And note that the Sox would be better in the pen and in the OF had they not made the Frazier trade, so they've go to firm some stuff up. But they have to do something. Perhaps they could make a small trade for an upgrade; maybe Austin Jackson. But to do what they did for Frazier and not follow it up is the same practice that has repeatedly failed. I'm guessing Hahn is searching for the outfield equivalent of the Lawrie trade. A solid outfielder with maybe a few question marks but won't be too costly in terms of prospects.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 04:28 PM) This is exactly what I've been saying since september Yes sir you have! Once Cespedes came out and said he wanted 6/150 I thought, FU dude! 6 years is too long and 25M per year is too much. If a team is going to pay that or close to it, I hope that team is not the White Sox.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 04:26 PM) I agree. And apparently Rick does too. Don't overpay for Cespedes. I'd like to see them go above the reported 3 years $55M, up to maybe $75M. But going 5 or 6 and nearing $150M would be a mistake. I continue to think Rick has played this out the right way. Rick really has played this well, imo. I agree that 3/55 is a bit low for a short term deal but the most I would be willing to do would be either 3/60 or 4/75-80. I'm just not sold on Cespedes long term success as he ages. He's looking to get paid based on his 2015 numbers whereas I'm thinking about what he will be able to give the signing team over the length of the contract. I do not expect him to continue his 2015 numbers and therefore am not willing to pay as though he will. Cespedes could end up being the classic case of a player having a career year before FA, capitalizing on with a new long term contract then regresses. That story has been written and re-written too many times.

Funny read from an Astros writer POV. He makes some good points that won't be popular with folks that want the Sox to sign Cespedes. http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2016/1/18/107...igning-cespedes "Second, Cespedes isn't a great hitter. I'll pause while the over-reactors pontificate. Done yet? He's not a great hitter. He's a good hitter coming off of a magnificent walk year. And the most important thing to know is: never get involved in a land war in Asia. Only slightly less important is this: never overpay for a free agent after an awesome walk year that could be classified as an outlier."

With the Sox in need and searching for a LHB I think they go the trade route. Something along the lines of an OF version of Lawrie and that trade package. I think Cespedes, Upton and to a lesser extent Fowler will be more costly than what the Sox can or are willing to spend.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 09:38 AM) This is funny . Was it wise to give Davis what he got ? Ian Kennedy ? It isn't wise to give many free agents long term contracts however that is what teams have been doing for years. Now all of a sudden everyone realizes its not fiscally responsible ? Definitely no to both Davis and Kennedy. As for Cespedes, I'm probably the wrong person to ask because I'm not a fan of the idea of big money long term contracts. I'd like to have Cespedes bat bat in the lineup, but only if the annual salary and contract length is within reason.

If I had to choose between Jackson and Desmond, I'd take Jackson since he is an outfielder and still rates above average defensively which would help the defense quite a bit.

Interesting how this keeps coming up... https://www.sny.tv/mets/news/latest-news-an...pedes/162175438 "It's also worth noting that anyone I have talked with in Detroit, Boston and Oakland, as well as the Mets (all teams that he's played for), I can't find anyone who thinks it would be wise to give him a long-term contract. They all love him as a hitter, but worry about what an aging, comfortable, complacent Cespedes might look like, especially in the National League without the designated hitter."