Big Frank Getting Some Love

[hammerhead johnson]

The main argument against Frank for the HoF is that he has been a DH for most of his career, meaning he has not played in the field, meaning he is essentially a 1-dimensional player.

 

So, if that argument holds true, someone needs to take Ozzie Smith's plaque out of the HoF...he may have been one of the best defensive SS's of all time, if not the best, but he put up .262 28 793 .666(a career OPS of f'in .666...Ben Davis puts that up in a bad year).  He did steal a lot of bases, but this was also in a time period where stealing bases was at one of the all-time highs...during this same time period, Vince Coleman stole 100 bases in 3 consecutive years, one of which his average was .232 and his OBP was .301.

 

To me, the same argument applies to both Ozzie Smith and Frank Thomas, though just on completely opposite spectrums...Ozzie Smith gets in with no-bat, great glove, Frank gets in with great bat, no glove.

 

Frank Thomas is a HoFer, and if/when he gets to 500 homers, it should remove all doubt of him being a first ballot HoFer.

 

 

I couldn't agree more. Ozzie was a starter on the all star team 15 times from 1981-1996 (he didn't make it in 1993 for some reason, although he played 140+ games that year), and he also won 13 straight gold gloves from 1980 to 1992.

 

However, he finished in the Top 10 in MVP voting just once in his entire career. Frank has finished in the Top 10 in MVP voting 8 times, with 3 MVP awards as far as I'm concerned.

[whitesox91403]

IMHO, I think DH's and RP's are just as much a part of the game as an INF, OF, SP or whatever. With that being said, because they are a part of the game, then they deserve just as much Hall Consideration. It just amazes me that guys like Gossage, Sutter, and Lee Smith are still not in.

[witesoxfan]

IMHO, I think DH's and RP's are just as much a part of the game as an INF, OF, SP or whatever. With that being said, because they are a part of the game, then they deserve  just as much Hall Consideration.  It just amazes me that guys like Gossage, Sutter, and Lee Smith are still not in.

 

The thought with closers is that they look a lot better because of saves, when quite frankly, saves are quite a worthless stat. Similar to wins and losses by a pitcher.

 

When you look at the very best closers of all time, you really have to consider if they would be some of the best relievers of all time...if they are not, they are not HoF worthy.

 

What you need to have to make the HoF is longevity or a stretch of quite a few years where you just absolutely dominate, while putting up good career numbers in the process. If you can play and just absolutely dominate your entire career, you are a first ballot hall of famer.

 

Frank Thomas, from 91-97, and then in 2000, was a monster at the plate. And he was not bad in 03 either. That is 9 years of very good baseball from Frank...and solid career numbers to boot.

 

Frank Thomas will make the hall of fame...and if he gets to 500 homers and doesn't get in on the first ballot, it will be a shame.

[lvjeremylv]

with 3 MVP awards as far as I'm concerned.

Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup. Frank was the MVP that year, not that juiced up loser Giambi.

 

Frank

[greasywheels121]

http://whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/new...s_cws&fext=.jsp

 

What do you think of Frank Thomas' chances of getting into the Hall of Fame? And do you think that there are any other Sox players (or ex-Sox players from the past few years) that are sure bets to make it into the Hall? -- Eli, Lincoln, Neb.

 

There is no question in my mind that Thomas will be a Hall of Famer. If he retired tomorrow, which wouldn't sit well with White Sox fans and administrators alike because his presence certainly is needed, I really believe Thomas still would be a first-ballot selection. If I had a vote, it would be cast immediately for one of the more talented and consistent hitters of our generation.

 

Thomas currently ranks 31st in career home runs, and his 436 long balls are seventh on the active list, behind Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro, Fred McGriff, Ken Griffey Jr. and Jeff Bagwell.

 

But in the storied existence of this great game, there are only five other players who have a higher career average (.308) and more home runs than Thomas. Check out this list: Babe Ruth (.342, 714), Jimmie Foxx (.325, 534), Ted Williams (.344, 521), Lou Gehrig (.340, 493) and Stan Musial (.331, 475). That's a mind-boggling quintet of players, all of whom are in the Hall.

 

Thomas has often talked about reaching the 500-homer plateau, and you can bet that he will come back at full force and knock out at least those final 64. I also don't think there's any significant media problem with the Big Hurt that will hamper his chances.

 

Thomas has been one of my favorite players to cover in baseball or any other sport. His knowledge of the athletic world, in general, from boxing to college basketball, makes regular conversations just as interesting with him as talks about baseball. And he's pretty darn knowledgeable where baseball is concerned.

 

As for other White Sox players, past or present, manager Ozzie Guillen will be on the 2006 ballot and bench coach Harold Baines will be on in 2007. Guillen doesn't have a chance, even with the 1985 Rookie of the Year award, a Gold Glove in 1990 and three All-Star appearances. Of course, if charisma, issuing a quote that could leave reporters perpetually in hysterics or a true passion for the game factored into the equation, Guillen would be a first-ballot selection. I asked Guillen about his impending addition to the ballot next year, and he was willing to trade in any personal support for Dave Concepcion, his idol, to get elected.

 

Baines is another story. He retired after the 2001 season as the leader in almost every offensive category among designated hitters, finishing with 2,866 career hits, six All-Star appearances and ranking 23rd all-time with an amazing 1,628 RBIs. He also hit .324 over 102 at-bats in 31 postseason contests, with five home runs and 16 RBIs.

 

The problem for Baines was that he never won any major award, finishing no higher than ninth in Most Valuable Player voting. He was a steady, and often spectacular, player for most of his 22-year career, but will that be enough to get him selected?

 

Here's another long-term, long shot name for you to ponder: Mark Buehrle. The left-handed ace has averaged 16 wins in each of his four full seasons. If Buehrle pitches another 12 seasons at that pace, he would check in around the 260-victory plateau. Buehrle doesn't have the overwhelming strikeout numbers to go with the victories and could find himself in the same borderline situation as someone such as Tom Glavine.

 

Let me know what you think. Make your case for any White Sox player, current or past, and we will print the best ones in a couple of weeks. Make your defense no more than a couple of paragraphs, so we can get as many responses in as possible.

[JUGGERNAUT]

Babe Ruth (.342, 714), Jimmie Foxx (.325, 534), Ted Williams (.344, 521), Lou Gehrig (.340, 493), Stan Musial (.331, 475), & Frank Thomas (308,436).

 

Bonds is very close: (300, 703). Bonds will most certainly make this list & pass Thomas. I still think Thomas needs to have at least one more MVP or a couple of near MVP seasons to overcome the fact that he was primarily a DH for the 2nd 1/2 of his career.

 

As for Buerhle, he doesn't have overpowering stuff so to make the HOF he'd have to win 300 games. He's have to pitch 15 more years & avg 2 wins more a year to reach that mark.

[YASNY]

Considering that they (the media) are saying that we are seeing the last of the 300 game winners, 260 might be quite impressive by the time Buehrle is eligible.