South Side Hit Men

I want to see Super Joe set up a dining table for him and serve him a porterhouse steak and the broadcast divert from the game until Lynn finishes.

Not currently. Abreu over Naylor and I guess catcher are the two infield advantages. Cleveland is better at all three OF positions (Robert has the potential better than Straw if he is every healthy, but certainly isn't now). Sox have a slight rotation advantage but Cleveland definitely has a better bullpen.

Can't speak for the two Comedy Central TV announcers, but DJ has been critical when warranted the past three weeks, after I began listening / watching games once Tony was out of the dugout.

"Fans are getting on Yoan for not running out on that play. That's the key difference they see, with Cleveland running every play out." - Darren Jackson

They have a dozen tumors on this ballclub, though Yoan could be "King of the Mountain".

Yes, agreed. I realize the media reported Tony's role in certain transactions (Joe Kelly, Leury, Lynn, others). That said, they both discussed these moves and likely agreed on most if not all of the trades and signings. Tony didn't bark orders at a subservient Hahn the past two years, and Hahn didn't keep Tony in the dark and make key moves without consulting with his manager. It's likely they don't like each other, and both have made sniping CYA comments to the media (Tony about Kimbrel's role, Hahn on a few lineup questions). However, both have been around enough to know discussions and collaboration were required, regardless of personal feelings and animus. Internal dysfunction is a Jerry trademark, be it Krause vs. Jackson, Kenny vs. Ozzie, Gar/Pax vs. Thibodaux, etc.. It's likely a key reason beyond cronyism why Jerry wanted Tony here. He wanted a new dynamic after eight years of Hahn Ken. I believe both thought it best to let Madrigal and Rodon go, acquire Lynn, Graveman, Liam, Eaton and others. Likely both thought it was OK to activate injured players and hope for the best with the lack of quality depth options beyond Colas who they refused to aggressively promote this season. Both need to be gone completely from the franchise after October 6th. Their history over the past decade, be it the past two years together, Hahn's previous eight years here, and Tony's time in Arizona indicate they have zero capability of constructing a quality roster. They shouldn't be lingering as advisors or EVP (Hahn), but that is the likely end result. Hell, John Paxton and Doug Collins are still with the Bulls, Daryl Boston is still here and it's likely Don Cooper would still be if they didn't fire Ricky in 2020, knowing the new manager (Jerry knew it was Tony, Hahn still unaware) would demand a change.

I've been preaching this for years. Bulls Gar Pax > White Sox Gar Pax Bulls Gar Pax overall tenure sucked ass and needed to go several years earlier, but at least they finished with a winning record and had some playoff success, albeit the beneficiaries of a possibly fixed NBA lottery. Hahn Ken have a losing record after ten years, zero playoff success, their farm system is ranked 26th, and their roster after next season is down to several higher quality players (Cease, Colas, Vaughn, Montgomery), including at least one who needs to get their act together (Moncada), and a few who need to return to health and somehow someway remain healthy (Robert, Kopech, Jimenez, Crochet).

9/21/22 White Sox Math 8-6 Cleveland = White Sox 14-0 7-7 Cleveland = White Sox 13-1 6-8 Cleveland = White Sox 12-2 5-9 Cleveland = White Sox 11-3 4-10 Cleveland = White Sox 10-4 3-11 Cleveland = White Sox 9-5 2-12 Cleveland = White Sox 8-6 1-13 Cleveland = White Sox 7-7 0-14 Cleveland = White Sox 6-8 Just a Fantasy, expect it to occur on the Twelfth of Never Do you remember The 21st night of September?...

Can argue Francona either #1 or #1A to Antonetti and Chernoff. I'd trade the Sox organization (FO, staff, major and minor league players) for the Cleveland's entire organization without hesitation.

Not saying the Sox should go after Moore, but can you explain why you rather take Hahn over Moore? Moore finished with two American League Pennants and one World Series Championship and fell one game short of a second, in a very small market and small payrolls, stuck at 15th post WS and 23rd today.

This assumes he is/was AA quality. He wasn't. Sox slow rolled him because Jerry be broke in 2029.

I agree, they didn’t just forget about him in the 7th-8th. Only used in the 10th because Diekman, Ruiz and Banks were the options remaining, so you go with the 80%-90% guy over the other weaker options. Sad thing is Cleveland played five games over the four day weekend (Sox three), down two starters and also played a 15 inning game and yet still managed to piece it all together and win five of the past six games. The Sox had a rested bullpen beyond Vince Velasquez but couldn’t take advantage.

The good news is the Sox will play 24 less games next season against the AL Central. The bad news is the opponents will mostly consist of mostly better teams from the other five divisions.

They also have the fewest usable players in their organization. Depth, or lack thereof, played a big role this season. While I agree injuries played a role this season, I also see their horrid team defense, specifically their porous outfield, contributing to their downfall. Anderson and Robert continued their defensive regression, dropping from defensive assets to league and below league average defenders, respectively. Pollock can’t throw, but looks acceptable when compared to Hahn’s other two options. Vaughn and Sheets aren’t major league quality outfielders. Period. The jury is still out on whether either are major league quality first baseman. The infield corners, catchers and part timers Elvis Andrus and Dallas Keuchel were the few defensive bright spots on this team. This needs to change if the Sox plan on attempting to compete in 2023.

We also need an Earth and Wind rating option. And a Hahn one.

Not a single media person will challenge him or ask follow-up questions at the press conference beyond a meek "Rick, I know you and the club faced a challenging season, but what do you wish would you have done differently?" Rick will respond with "Nobody is more disappointed at how this season finished than I am. You always think and wished you could have done more; for Jerry, for the team, and most importantly for the fans who support us at the ballpark. I am certainly motivated to work hard this offseason to improve the ballclub." I don't think he'll have the gall to mention "multi-championships" unless Jerry already extended him beyond 2023 (It's possible Jerry he extended Hahn and or Tony after this 2021 season) I still think Hahn will either return as GM, or be promoted and have an internal candidate promoted to GM. Tony will be named "special advisor" if he doesn't want to (or physically can't) return. They will sacrifice a few coaches and staff, trade / release a few players, hope they skirt the Brian Ball lawsuit, and also hope they don't lose significant season ticket holders.

I retired early (2019) and went to many games that Summer and Fall, excited for what was ahead in the next decade. I went to my first Spring Training ever (Winter was always my busy season), and had fun in early March, though it turned out to be more meaningless than any Spring Training before or since. Would have went to many games in 2020 if the government didn't shut down ballparks for fans. Liked Ricky Renteria, thought he got screwed by the Sox Media and Rick Hahn, but was OK with Hahn's announced plan to conduct the White Sox first serious managerial job interview since the Gaston vs. Guillen 2004 decision (still think Kenny was right, Gaston could have also won 1 or more WS as well and was a more stable manager and human being). One, they could have learned how serious modern organizations worked, and two they could have hired a great candidate. I was hoping for Joe Espada, but was also excited if they brought in AJ Hinch or Bruce Bochy. I was in Vegas when I first learned the rumor Tony La Russa was being considered. La Russa is the only White Sox manager I ever booed. I knew the Sox were doomed and Jerry was going ahead with this disaster of a decision. As a result, I completely boycotted the team in 2021 and 2022. Zero games, when with my free time I would have hit 20-30 + games like I did when I had full season tickets in the mid 2000s. 30 to zero, I was not going to give a dollar to Jerry and Tony, and I haven't for two seasons and counting. I may go to the last game of the season via a stubhub ticket (zero concession purchases, sox will likely get $1-$2 dollars from Stubhub commissions). I will go to Marz and/or Skylark post game. After that, I'm giving up the Sox after that until Jerry, Hahn and Tony are all gone. I assume this will take years, possibly into the 2030s, but so be it. No more Charlie Brown to White Sox Lucy.

1. Hahn claimed the Sox were in a "Multi-Championship Window", and haven't even sniffed being one of the top 4-6 teams in October. 2. Assuming the Sox are finished, I want a 79 or less win season, so Hahn finishes with one 80 + win season in his career. Tony has four in ten seasons with the White Sox (1982, 1983, 1985, 2021), shouldn't be credited with a fifth even if they win four more games, since they were 63-65 under his tired old ass, and he's just mooching wins off of Miguel at this point because he doesn't have the decency to retire permanently.

How did this thread fall to page 2? 2019 2020 2021 2022 "Obviously, AJ has the ability to help us in right field." - Rick Hahn

But he is the most stubborn hands down, and he has and will continue to sabotage multiple potential Sox World Series teams, be it the 1994 cancelation to punish the union, or the Tony La Russa era this decade after finally having a solid core, just to prove a point, support his cronies or spite his enemies. McCaskey family is simply incompetent, Rickets let's his baseball people make baseball decisions, Michael Reinsdorf is far better than his father with the Bulls. Rocky Wirtz and his organization allegedly aided and abetted at least one known serial child rapist for years. So yes, Jerry is better than this owner. Also better than Dan Snyder and the racist Charlotte NFL and two NBA owners (Clippers guy gone, Phoenix guy only got a wrist slap like Snyder).

Yes, Moncada has to return to 2021 or even better 2019 Moncada for the Sox to have any chance to succeed in future Octobers. Qualified solid people would be OK coming here with the current roster. Qualified solid people are not OK coming here with the current owner. Most external people won't want to work under Jerry unless they can't get a job elsewhere, Jerry isn't going to live forever, so a new owner will likely want a new FO. Jerry could be around for another month or decade, or any length in between. It's just not a stable position to walk into, assuming Jerry even wants to go beyond his personal clique.

Moncada $42.6M Hendriks $29.3M Grandal $18.3M Graveman $16.0M Pollock $13.0M (possibly $14M) Leury $11.0M Kelly $9.0M Diekman $4.5M Keuchel $1.5M

I rather finish the year personally with monkeypox than with Rick Hahn as GM of the White Sox. The former will eventually go away.