Chisoxfn

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 10:59 AM) I find our fan bases (not Soxtalk) inability to grasp that GM’s talk all manner of trades all the time, rather unbearable. Hell, Jim from Soxmachine (a guys whose opinions I really do respect.) basically writes off the rumor without even offering analysis. The problem here is that no one is doing their jobs. Offer some form of counter opinion, tell me why you don't find the rumor plausible, becasue if you don't your thought is just as invalid as you claim Soxnets to be. Don't write something off just because it's easier to do it that way. Exactly. The whole point of the article from our perspective was to inform the fans of what we have heard. We were not reporting a trade, rather that discussions have been had and those were the names. We never went any further to even indicate it was a done deal, in fact, we went out of the way to report that it wasn't. We than offer our own speculation as to the trade and than Mark Gonzalez of the tribune did a great pro/con type of piece on the SoxNet report. Cowley could have done something similar or went to his sources, collected quotes, and written to that fact. That would be writing, but anything else is really really baseless, unprofessional and completely disrespectful.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 10:53 AM) So I assume your silence with regard to the "trekkie" comment is an admission? Haha, I will admit, I've seen a couple of the movies....and never seen any single TV episode of star trek in full.

SoxNet Responds to Cowley's Attacks

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 10:37 AM) This isnt idle speculation, but rather a confirmed talk. You obviously have decided you dont believe it, so leave it at that. Longshot....did the Angels try to sign Konerko years ago, yes. Have the Angels been long-tied to Konerko in rumors pretty much every year since he ultimately signed with the White Sox...yes. So how you go as far as saying the Angels would have no interest in Konerko is pretty ridiculous.

My Email to Cowley:

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 09:47 AM) MG's artcile is well written Mark Gonzales - "a team source acknowledged last month that the club has had interest in Gonzalez in previous years." Is this the first he's mentioned what his source told him? If so, it only backs up the SoxNet info. He might have just been keeping the info under wraps, but now that it's out he can say it. Add in the fact that there was the radio report last week indicating that someones San Diego sources had indicated the two teams have had talks.

QUOTE (danman31 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 11:28 PM) Jason is about to be really excited or really crushed. Excited is the winner. That was a battle of 2 mid-majors though. UCLA has no talent. How did that happen? By awesomeness!!!!

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 09:27 PM) The UCLA-Fullerton game is very entertaining for all the wrong reasons. CAL...STATE....FULLERTON!!!!!

Joe Cowley has received an email.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 09:12 AM) But was this just a case where KW called and asked about the availability of a player or threw out an offer that was immediately rejected? Seems like there would be 100s of these types of calls going on throughout the season with several teams. Not sure why this one needed to be singled out and artificially elevated to its current status. I mean look at this 400 post thread. What is it all based on? It is the off-season. Do you see the other 400 post thread on Adrian Gonzalez which was based upon pure speculation. This thread is based upon a report that the teams had talks, nothing more, nothing less. Peter Gammons reports this type of stuff all the time. Bruce Levine does too. They get s*** for it quite often and most of the time it is unwarranted. The fact that some people jump to the conclusions and think that preliminary talks mean done deal is preposterious. It just shows that the club has interest in Adrian Gonzalez and they have tried to get him.

Very few of all trade talks amount to anything more than that, talks. We as fans want to know those talks so when we at Soxtalk/SoxNet become privy to something we try to pass it on to you guys/gals. I don't know where the heck, people jump to conclusions and ultimately decide that we are saying this deal is done or even close to being done or even on Ken Williams' priority list. We don't know enough to decide that is the case, we know we are confident in our source who provided us with the info and we also know that what our source indicated is consistent with other members of the media: - A Chicago Radio Report this past week cited San Diego sources, which indicated the two teams have had talks regarding Adrian Gonzalez - Joe Cowley, whose level I refuse to stoop to, twittered today that he reported the Sox tried to have talks with the Pads back on Oct 6th - Mark Gonzalez indicated yesterday that a month ago his sources within the Sox confirmed the clubs interest in Adrian Gonzalez Clearly the teams are interested, clearly the need is there (from the Sox perspective and the Padres perspective), the question is will a deal ultimately get done? We can only assume the Angels were called in and became part of an expanded package and I wouldn't be surprised to eventually learn that Kenny has talked to a number of other teams (to get in as a 3rd player) to try to and make an Adrian Gonzalez to the Sox move a reality.

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Nov 17, 2009 -> 09:02 AM) To get the scoop. It's basic reporting. if you have a source.. and preferably two or three sources that tell you the same thing... you run with it. I dont know if SoxNet was using a single source, or multiple, but if they believe they can trust the person, you run with it. We ran with it as is, based our info and reported it to ensure that no one thought this was a done deal. The fact that the teams have had discussions is relevant, where they go and what ultimately happens, I don't know, but the fact that they had them is newsworthy, imo. At least for fans that want to know what the club is trying to do.

Great piece from Gonzalez. Clearly these are the interesting aspects of the trade and it is important that we indicate we only are verifying the prelim discussions. Gonzalez breaks out the reasons the deal wouldn't happen, but he also points out the Padres interest in a SP, CF, C, and 2B. The Sox have 3 prospects that fill 3 of those needs and they happen to be our top 3 prospects. Bottom line, there is a lot of stuff in our system that would interest the Padres. The question is can the Sox take the risk and will they completely take a shot on Gonzalez putting them over the top for the next two years, because after that, it is highly unlikely the Sox brass would spend the necessary money to keep Gonzalez on the south-side.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 01:13 PM) I don't think it's a good idea to go to the media outlets for things like this. If you're wrong, guess who guesses gets ridiculed? The same people who probably won't want to come out with any rumors in future dates. Also, I've always had the thought, that if national media gets ahold of it, that the other teams who really want said player, will try even harder to get things done faster. Hopefully it goes through, but I don't see it happening. It doesn't make enough sense from the Angels' perspective. The key to me is that I have a theory that the Angels part is an expanded piece of the deal and that in general the majority of the deal could be done without the Angels getting involved. Although I think Kenny would like some improved flexibility and is trying to get creative so that he can clear payroll to fill some other holes while holding onto an extra prospect or two.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 12:53 PM) Can Jared Mitchell be traded? Nope.

The story has been updated a bit with our idol speculation and analysis: http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/soxnet/200...-prospects.html

QUOTE (ozzfest @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 11:39 AM) has this specific source made any predictions on trades or signings b4 that have turned out to be right? SoxNet.net/Soxtalk have been a part of breaking the news on many ocassions, so yes, we have a track-record of being accurate. But remember, we aren't saying a trade is imminent, just that the teams have had preliminary discussions. Whether it moves past that stage or not, we shall see.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 11:14 AM) 2 years and $23M left on that deal. If you pick up Adrian and Matthews and only shed Konerko from the 25 man roster and get no cash in return you're effectively paying Gonzalez $16.625M per year for the next 2 years since Matthews is just about useless (he's at or below a replacement level player and such players are by definition everywhere). So even though Adrian is an incredible value you're not saving any money in the long run, you're just adding to the payroll ($3.75 in '10 and $17.5M in '11) which actually makes him a less attractive target via trade. The Angels and Matthews aren't on good terms and he's going to ultimately get out-right released. They will trade him if they can, but if they can't he will be gone. In short, having to absorb all of Matthews salary would not make the deal worth it. In fact, if the Angels were willing to shed that entire, contract, they'd be giving up all of the noteable prospects to get Gonzalez so in that instance, why wouldn't they just go after Adrian. Anyway, in short, I'm with ya Kal, forget about the name GMJ.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 10:42 AM) I guess I kind of differ from some people here, but I see our awesome 5-man rotation as being of less use if it's going to stand with the current lineup alongside it. I would move one of Danks/Floyd to get this deal done. Obviously only if I had to, but I would not let it be a stopping point. Reason being--the freaky part about this deal is how it would actually save us money in year 1. We could get back into the FA hunt. Well actually there are several freaky things about this deal. Remember that he'll be getting about 20M a year once he enters FA, so you can't go hand out a ton of long-term contracts and than expect to keep Gonzalez around.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 10:32 AM) You are assuming that LAA is in this deal primarily for Konerko. On the contrary, I'd be they are in it to get the right spect or two, and Konerko is a nice 1B/DH fill, as a secondary desired piece. You are also assuming that LAA has what SD wants - the only reason you even have 3-way trades is that a 1-to-1 deal doesn't fulfill their needs. SD may be able to justify losing A-Gon because of the COMBINATION of what they'd get from the two other trading parties. The big thing is, I'd have to think the Sox have what the Pads want, however, the Sox need the Angels to take on Konerko's salary or at least a chunk of it to enable them to make this deal. Or at least that has to be what Kenny has in mind.

QUOTE (KevinM @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 10:29 AM) Yeah, not buying it. I'm guessing the Angels aren't jumping at the bit to get a mediocre, overpaid first baseman while also ensuring that one of their fellow AL contenders gets a far better player at the same position. Why wouldn't they just go after Gonzalez? Any package we put together could easily be trumped (save me the 7-8 player package KHP, it's not realistic). I think some people are underestimate just how poor the economy is. I realize Adrian Gonzalez doesn't make a ton of money, but he'll be a FA soon enough and will be demanding mega-bucks. Ultimately very few teams are going to find themselves in a position to make a run at Gonzalez because they probably wouldn't be willing to unload the type of quality high level young, cheap minor league talent it would take to get him. The Sox might be one of those teams. Most of the other teams that could be possibilities would be unable to beat a Sox offer, imo. The BoSox are one of the few teams that could potentially blow the Sox out of the water, but who knows if they would have the interest to do so (ie an Ellsbury/Bucholtz package). We also underestimate the fact that the Angels like Paulie.

QUOTE (striker62704 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 10:27 AM) Think Konerko would waive his no-trade clause? He's always said he'd waive his no trade clause if the Sox felt they could make the team better by moving him. The Angels are on the west coast and he was very very close to going there after the world series year. They are also a perennial contender. Without a doubt, Paulie would accept a move there, imo.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 09:50 AM) I don't see how this makes sense without the Sox taking on GMJ or Ervin Santana in the deal. Why would they give up prospects that the Padres would want in a AGon deal for 1 year of Konerko at $12M? It would make sense for them to give up good prospects to shed bad deals, but the Angels could just go out and re-sign Vladdy to DH for a couple million without giving up anything. Or even better yet, they could put Abreu at DH since that's where he belongs anyway. Every year since about 2005 we've had Paulie to the Angels rumors. This year it makes less sense than in any other. I think someone's source is misinformed here. The Angels really like Paulie and I think the bigger question would be how much if anything would the Angels be putting in on this deal. It could be more or less the Sox moving Konerko and not getting much in return and the main portion of the deal being the prospects the club sends. I want no one to think that we are reporting this as a done deal or anything of the sort. Just that discussions were made regarding that deal...my guess is 1-5% of all deals that get discussed ever turn into a finalized deal (if not less than that).

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 09:41 AM) The Sox could put in an extra piece or two certainly. but the whole idea here would be...a fair deal for AGon without picking up another high ceiling player might be a 4-5 for 1 deal, involving basically everyone we have. Deal Konerko, suddenly find yourself having salary flexibility if you don't send over too much money, pick up another guy that you can stick in that deal such that you don't need to send over all those guys. I'd bet you could pull it off. Konerko being a part of the deal makes it much more probable because it gives the Sox some financial flexibility to fill other holes while getting a huge bat.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 16, 2009 -> 09:36 AM) What sources did you guys get this from? There's no way we get Gonzalez for Pauly and spects. We have our sources, but we are only stating the teams have had preliminary discussions and that those were the main parameters. Nothing is imminent that we know of.