Marty34

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 16, 2013 -> 11:43 AM) I love how you refer to it as "Impending" as though it's completely guaranteed. Judging by past statements from Hahn the Sox are going to take it very cautiously with Danks rehab. They'd be silly not to, he's owed over $60M.

Even though there's been a lot of optimism surrounding Danks rehab, there's nothing that is abnormal about this impending trip to the DL.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 09:22 PM) 84-78. For every guy that can break out and have a big year, we have just as many that are due for regression due to age, injuries, or whatever. In the end, I see a big jumble of mediocrity and another .500 team. Wish I'd written this because I think it sums up the frustration with the spot the Sox are currently in well.

QUOTE (MAX @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 09:39 PM) I think i am going to utilize the ignore function for the fist time ever. You have no idea who is even on this team or what happened in an entire year of baseball throughout the entire organization. You can ignore me, but do you have to announce it? It hurts my ego.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 08:02 PM) Let's just say this, if Alexei gets back to where he was from 2009 to 2011 a lot of teams will wish they made a play for him, although I doubt the Sox have any interest in moving him given how valuable his defense is to our pitching staff. Fair enough. I hope he does return to the 715+ OPS player he has been.

Workload on Sale and Peavy from last year I think makes it difficult not to project a step back in production from those two. I think Danks will be in and out of the rotation and won't be fully healed until 2014. Given that and and an aging offensive core I say they'll win 78.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 07:45 PM) That's fine, but you're arguing he has no value across the league. That is what everyone is getting worked up about. It's an argument you kind of agreed with by saying Boston would have taken on his contract, but probably not give much in return.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 07:15 PM) Ramirez is still a top-notch defensive player, yet you continue to act like he's not. I get the concern about having too many low OBP batters in our lineup, but that doesn't mean that Ramirez doesn't have value as a plus defensive player. We view where the Sox are at differently. I don't think they're a contender so I'd rather not be locked in to a 30+ y.o. shortstop for $27M who may be in decline.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 06:58 PM) If he doesn't would you rather be looking for another SS with a market shortage have one signed at a discount? It's a chance I would take given I don't think the Sox will be contenders in 2014. Or at the very best, I don't think the difference between Ramirez and his replacement will keep the Sox from contending.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 06:02 PM) You can't be serious, Marty. You can't keep referring to $27m like it's over one year. They have to pay a SS for the next two years too, whether or not it's Drew. If Drew and Ramirez both continue to decline would you rather be obligated to pay Ramirez $20M over 2014 and 2015 or Drew $0 over the same time frame?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 05:31 PM) That makes no sense, at all. A team would rather pay Drew $9.5M than trade for Ramirez and pay him $27M.

Steven Drew at 9.5M probably shows there wasn't a market for Ramirez.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 04:44 PM) If he gets his OPS in the low .700 range, he's tradable without any problems. If he repeats his 2012 offensive performance, then he'll be more difficult to move, but I think there would still be one team that would take him off your hands for free. I'm pretty confident he'll rebound, so I'm not really worried. Also I mentioned this week ago, but Stephen Drew just got $9.5 million coming off a zero WAR season. There are always teams that need SSs and are will to overpay in terms of money or talent to get one. Unless Alexei's defense suddenly disappears, he'll always have some value. Just for fun, do you think there was a team this offseason who would have taken that contract? I don't think there was.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 03:41 PM) A $350 million total payroll is an entirely reasonable estimate. That basically assumes the Sox spend waht they spend this year...and of course, every team in MLB gets another $25 million starting next year from the new national TV deal, so it's much more likely to be an underestimate than an overestimate. They also spent $355 million in 2011-2013. Which means, the starting SS is getting about 7.7% of the payroll or less. And I'm supposed to be scared because you repeat big numbers. A declining Ramirez at 7.7% of the payroll for a team that I believe is facing a rebuild is not worth keeping.

QUOTE (bmags @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 03:00 PM) This is a stupid point though. How so?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 12:28 PM) Because Marty is deliberately refusing to acknowledge that it's over 3 years to try to make it sound worse than it is. $27 million sounds like a big number, but over the next 3 years, the White Sox are likely to spend something like $350 million on salary. He's just repeating $27 million and expecting us to be shocked, and I'm seeing if he was honest enough to even acknowledge that it's spread over multiple years. I got my answer. We know Ramirez is owed $27M. We don't know what the Sox total payroll will be from '13-15, yet you pulled a number out of thin air and you're accusing me of being deliberately misleading.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 11:37 AM) Remarkable. I can't believe KW made him the highest paid player in baseball and still kept his job. He's not owed $27M?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2013 -> 11:20 AM) Wow, he's owed $27 million over 1 year? We made him the highest paid player in baseball? You're right that is insane. That's almost impossible to believe. So impossible to believe that one might read it and think you're leaving out an important detail somewhere. He's owed $27M.

QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Mar 14, 2013 -> 11:40 PM) The analogy is that you can't use the same metric to determine the worth of every player. Not that SS and punters are of equal value. A good defensive SS with a decent bat should command a fairly high salary. Whether his bat is still decent has yet to be determined, but the "punter getting the 5th most on the team" thing doesn't fly, because punter and SS are non-equivalent. Tackles for punters doesn't equate to good fielding shortstops who aren't good offensively.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 14, 2013 -> 10:44 PM) Dunn $15.0 million Peavy $14.5 million Danks $14.25 million Konerko $13.5 Rios $12.5 Floyd $9.5 Ramirez $7.0 million Thornton $5.5 million Crain $4.5 million And yet Ramirez's contract is the biggest issue on the team. Sure. Keep thinking that. Ramirez is owed $27M or roughly thereabout.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Mar 14, 2013 -> 02:25 PM) I find it funny how people are b****ing about a player who plays a position where offense production was never an issue by traditional baseball standards. We seem to follow this same cycle since production could be far better at 3rd, 2nd and DH. It's like blaming a punter for his lack of tackles. If the punter were owed the 5th most money on the team . . .

QUOTE (southside_hitman @ Mar 13, 2013 -> 12:09 PM) "Phallate" Ramirez? I am seeing a pattern among a few posters, a juvenile argumentative style like kids quarreling among themselves in the back seat of a car or a couple of pimply teenage Cub fans who just learned how to swear and are coupling that with their North side dude-speak. The White Sox do not have many players who are rated in the top ten at their respective positions. If my memory serves me well, the "Shredder" at MLBTV only had Konerko, AJ and Alexei rated among the top 10 players at their respective positions based on their performance up to this season. In any case, this was their respective ratings at short stop: The Shredder 1. T. Tulowitzki (COL) 2. J. Reyes (MIA) 3. Y. Escobar (TOR) 4. A. Cabrera (CLE) 5. A. Ramirez (CHW) 6. S. Drew (ARI) 7. J. Peralta (DET) 8. J. Hardy (BAL) 9. E. Aybar (LAA) 10. Jeter (NYY) Shean's List 1. Tulowitzki 2. Reyes 3. Andrus 4. Escobar 5. Cabrera 6. Castro 7. Ramirez 8. Hardy 9. Aybar 10. Rollins Larry Bowa's List 1. Tulowitzki 2. AYBAR 3. Reyes 4. Ramirez 5. Cabrera 6. Rollins 7. Hardy 8. Jeter 9. Gonzalez 10. Andrus It is bad enough that the Sox will not have AJ, a top ten rated catcher, this season. Why would we want to trade another top player from a team that we hope can at least compete against the Tigers after they have overwhelmed everyone else in the Division with the level of talent they have? Is this list heading into the 2012 season or 2013? Reyes is listed with Miami.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Mar 12, 2013 -> 07:30 PM) Right now our best alignment is Keppinger at 3B, Ramirez at SS, & Beckham at 2B with Carlos Sanchez as insurance at AAA. We need see how all these guys do this year before we worry about next year. All four guys are question marks to some extent and their performances this year will guide Hahn's decisions next off-season. If I had to guess right now, I think Sanchez replaces Beckham next year, Alexei rebounds at the plate this season and remains at SS, we go out and trade for a legit 3B, and Keppinger is moved to a super-utility role. IMO, you underestimate Ramirez's defense, especially the value it provides us given the amount of resources we've committed to our pitching staff in the near future. As long as he can get his OPS back into the low .700's, I think he's worth his contract. I think it's a question whether he can get his OPS back to 700+, he's 31. Moreover, the 2014 position player situation for the Sox could be a big problem. They could be looking at needing a new catcher, 1B, 2B, SS, not to mention being saddled with Dunn for another year.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 12, 2013 -> 06:37 PM) You have to tell me what Beckham does this year. That's making it too easy. As of today, what would it be.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 12, 2013 -> 06:13 PM) That's not the question. The question really is, is the difference between Sanchez and Beckham worth $15 million over the next 3 years. If Beckham performs this year, and answers that question "Yes", then we can talk about Alexei. Let's say they have 5 guys (Beckham, Ramirez, Keppinger, Morel, and Sanchez) for second, short, and third in 2014. What would be your optimal alignment? I'd go with Becham at second, Sanchez at short, and Keppinger at third provided that the reports of Sanchez being able to play short are true.