fathom

Again, we're not getting 3 above average MLB players for Contreras, Shingo, and a prospect. Stop living in the video game world.

Here's just a quick summary of how I feel with things (just to let some people know that I am indeed a Sox fan). If you would have told me before the year that we'd be 10 games up with 68 games left in the season, I would have been absolutely thrilled. I would have been so happy with that lead, even if the Sox had lost 20 games in a row. Lets face it, if we can't hold onto a 13 game lead with 71 games left for not only the AL Central, but the Wild Card as well, then we don't deserve to make the playoffs. For some reason, last night's game didn't even piss me off that much, as not once did it feel like the Sox were going to win it. You drop a routine foul pop up against one of the 10 best hitters in baseball history, and you deserve to lose. Now, by no means do I think it's a lock that the Sox will make the playoffs. I don't think it's too negative for me to say that you'd have to be kidding yourselves if you really thought that this team was as good as it's record shows. We've been so incredibly lucky in at least a dozen of games this season that we could have easily lost. As long as we take advantage of breaks in the 2nd half, we should be ok. We're not the type of team that can get away with bad defense in one game, and still coast to victory. Some advice I'd give to Ozzie: It's ok to trust your bullpen to get key outs earlier in the game than the 7th inning. Cotts, Marte, Cliff, and Dustin have been great this year. It's not a crime if you let them start the 7th inning of a game, and take the starting pitcher out BEFORE he gets in trouble. Ozzie always tends to leave his starter in too long (rather than take him out too early), and it's been catching up to the Sox lately. Also, it makes no sense to be playing smallball at the Cell when it's hot outside. We're not going to win 2-1 games at the Cell like we did when it was cooler out. The ball flies out of the Cell, and there's no reason to be playing smallball prior to the 7th inning. Now, lets go out and start winning some home games. BTW, if you're feeling down, check out the Twins schedule the rest of the way. It's just as difficult as the Sox schedule.

If the Sox were to acquire these 3 guys, say good-bye to about 3 of your favorite Sox prospects. The Blue Jays would have no use for someone like Crede. I could see them wanting Contreras for next season, where they're going to be spending more money. In order to get the 3 Blue Jays who are most likely to be traded, we're talking about having to give up 2/3 of McCarthy, Anderson, and/or Sweeney.

QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 07:17 AM) I don't even wanna imagine the s***ty threads if (relax, we're not) we lose this one... No kidding. Of course, it would be great if the Tigers could beat the Twins a few times this weekend.

QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 07:02 AM) This lineup = the 2000 lineup. When they get to the playoffs they are gonna get shut down big time and then complain about the sun being in their eyes just as a certain someone infamously did back in 2000. They need to stop swinging for the damn fences every at bat. I just can't believe how many outs AJP and Uribe give up by having just an awful approach at the plate. I thought a huge play in tonight's game was the first pitch weak grounder by Uribe (as well as his awful K vs Timlin earlier). Uribe's grounder took away some of the momentum. I think if Frank was healthy, he would have been used instead of Uribe. From now on, I will call him Juan Urine.

Am I the only one who prays that we don't get Burnett? We'd give up a ton for someone who I don't think would make a huge difference.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:53 AM) Like I said I'm done discussing all of this. You guys win, happy? In no way am I trying to be a dick to you, as I respect your Sox fandom. Sometimes, we all have to take a step back and realize that this is a f***ing message board. Any Sox fan is good enough for me.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:45 AM) Thought so.... And trust me, I'm one of the most realistic people on this board when it comes to making trades. By having the inside knowledge that I do about baseball, I know that speculated trades rarely ever occur. However, with the way our GM is in terms of being active, I really think acquiring another offensive weapon will occur. Instead of trading the farm for someone that will only pitch once every 5 games, we need someone who can help every game.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:45 AM) WHAT DID THE OFFENSE DO WRONG TODAY?? WHAT WHAT WHAT, PLEASE TELL ME You take any negative comment way too seriously. If you really think this offense is good, then I don't know what to say. This week, besides for the Spurling Sensation, the offense has been piss poor. We can't score without a homer it seems like or a reliever coming in and just pitching awful. Sometimes, the offense has to go out there and just outslug the opposition. Our pitchers have pitched under so much stress this season without a lot of room for error. If anyone actually thinks our pitching will match it's first half of the year, then I recommend you watch games at the Cell when it gets hot out.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:43 AM) And what did the offense do wrong tonight? Was it score 4 runs off Clement in 6 innings or tie the game off Schilling in the 8th? Last time I checked at this point Clement's their ace and we hit him fine. The offense was better tonight, but it still didn't exactly light up the scoreboard. Why in the world was AJP batting so high in the order tonight? He's done nothing to deserve batting higher than 7th lately.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:43 AM) Hw would you have it??? Acquisition

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:38 AM) Ok, so getting the runner to 3rd is no good. So you call on Willie to get the run home? I have absolutely no clue what this is supposed to mean. All I'm saying, and have been for a while, is that I would like to see Iguchi try more to get a hit in these situations, and not worry as much about getting Pods over to third. With Pods speed, he's going to be able to get to third on most balls put into play. With Iguchi just trying to serve the ball to the right side, we're giving the opposition a relatively easy out. Now, if this is a situation in the last 3 innings of a close game, I'm all for the "sacrifice". But in the first inning? If you think you're going to beat the Red Sox 1-0, you're insane.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:40 AM) Pods LF Gooch 2B Carl DH Dye RF Konerko 1B Rowand CF Pierzynski C Crede 3B Uribe SS How's that???? The bottom 7-8-9 is still awful. Still only one person (Pods) who can work a count. That's not a lineup that will go far in the postseason, if you ask me.

Great stats Frank the tank. It's just a matter of time before some people realize our offense isn't playoff caliber. And the thing is, it's not how it performs in the postseason that worries me. Right now, my only concern is getting to the postseason. We've still looked like s*** against nearly every top pitcher we've faced this season.

The reason we're pissed off is we just lost 3 games in the standings in a little over 50 hours. Also, our current line-up just doesn't match-up well with the above average teams we have to face during the 2nd half of the season.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:33 AM) You do that while he still consistantly gets Pods to 3rd. Until we have a number 3 hitter in the order that can consistenly get Pods home with less than 2 outs, it will be a wasted opportunity for what could have been a potentially big inning. I've seen nothing in the last month that would make me believe we can play smallball at home and win.

I made some statements in this thread, but by no means do I think Willie should be starting over Iguchi. Hell, I'd rather have Ozuna play 2nd base during games in which we bench Iguchi. However, I disagree with all those who are overrating Iguchi so much. To say he's been absolutely awesome is quite a stretch. I think one of the reason so many think he's been spectacular is because they're comparing him to Willie Harris.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 06:02 AM) No, no I'll say it again it's a stupid thread. I can't even explain to you how much worse the offense would be without Iguchi this year. He f***ed up today on defense, the double error no doubt but overall he's been solid defensively, not to mention he turns the dp as good as anyone in baseball. This thread's dumb. Might as well put the pitcher in the 2 spot, and just have him bunt Pods over to 3rd base with the approach Iguchi has had recently

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:59 AM) Oh my god he is in a f***in slump. God damn people here overreact after a game so much. IT IS NOT THE END OF THE WORLD!!! Holy s***, he made 1 bad play, as did Crede, and now everyone wants to jump of their respective bandwagons. Gimme a break. We hit a bump in the road, s***! Anyone who even JOKINGLY thinks Willie shoud replace Gooch is a dumbass IMO. Honestly, gimme a break. Every team loses a game once in a while. I'm with fathom on this one. People overreact too damn much! Sorry buddy, but Iguchi isn't just in a slump...it's been almost 3 months now, as his batting average has been plummeting pretty consistently. Like I said earlier, he was finding a lot of holes on the field. The league has adjusted to him, and can position their defense better.

QUOTE(rangercal @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:55 AM) are you kidding me? Did you read my first post? I said sucking it up since April. Iguchi had a great May. He also was having amazing luck at the plate, as he was hitting all sorts of grounders that just seemed to be finding the perfect spot on the field.

QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:54 AM) If PK is a verb now, I'd figure it to equate to pulling the ball. I really don't remember Gooch pulling the ball, ever. Seems like every other AB results in a weak grounder to the left side.

QUOTE(He_Gawn @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:52 AM) One bad play and you all hate Gooch? Give me a f***ing break people. We can afford to lose some games you pansies. A lot of us having been saying how Iguchi has hit the wall for a while. However, some people will continue to say how great he is just cause he's able to get the runner over to 3rd with less than 2 outs.

We have to use Iguchi against the right players. Iguchi shouldn't be facing tough righties, like Clement, when lefties have a much better chance to be successful.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:23 AM) Where would you rank Uribe among defensive SS in baseball? How many guys make that play to get Nixon at home that easy? No one makes the play he made in Detroit to save the game. There's a lot of good defensive SS. That Polanco play in Detroit was good, but it was a play that probably half the SS in baseball make. To be honest, I didn't see the Nixon play though tonight. I'd say Uribe is one of the top 6 defensive SS in baseball. However, he's not a sure-fire Gold Glove winner like Sox fans on here think.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:21 AM) I'm saying he shouldn't be giving up hits like fat people are in line for getting free cake samples. It was happening all night and a big inning was inevitable. I would be fine if he was just rocked in the 4th or some other inning, but the whole night when Buehrle was pitching, you knew the big inning was coming and you just hoped Ozzie would take him out in time. In my car on the way home, I was begging Ozzie to take Buehrle out before the 7th inning. You knew that those guys, seeing him for the 4th time, would likely not go down quietly. Ozzie ALWAYS leaves his starting pitchers in until it's definite that they shouldn't be out there. Ozzie is hands-down the Manager of the Year so far, but he just doesn't have a good feel for when a pitcher is done with, and needs to get taken out BEFORE the runs come.