hitlesswonder

QUOTE(Y2HH @ Mar 18, 2007 -> 08:22 PM) Still, like I said, Crede never appeared afraid at the plate IMO, Anderson does...not sure why that is. I don't think that's true. When Crede first made the big leagues, he seemed to be pretty overwhelmed at the plate and not very aggressive to me (and that's not criticism -- I can't even imagine what it's like to try to hit at the big league level). I think that's probably how a lot of players are early in their careers. Lots of players have recovered from terrible starts in the bigs, and lots of players haven't. At this point, I think its too early to write Anderson off. Given the health problems of Pods and Erstad, I'd hope the Sox don't ship BA off just yet.

QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 11:44 PM) I definitely don't think Weber should be fired right now. However, the program is in serious trouble when it comes to public relations. Nothing that has happened recently will make recruiting easier for him, and he was having enough difficulty before that. That pretty much sums it up. Chris Head's accusations and the CPL coaches walking out of a Weber clinic because of how he treated them are now a matter of public record. While you can bet that those facts were already used by coaches recruiting against IL, it will only be worse now. People can dismiss Q Watkins reopening his recruitment as "internet speculation", but when it's reported in dozens of places it seems like it's gaining legitimacy. Who would you rather play for, IL or AZ? There's a reason why the IL staff made some recent trips out to California. Add in the transfers that are rumored to happen this offseason, and IL will be looking at essentially walk-ons playing major minutes next season. It's not a good situation.

QUOTE(thedoctor @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 09:22 AM) that's not a very strong rationale. Well, they lose Warren Carter who was probably their best player this season. And they also lose McBride, who was their best guard. And I'll go ahead and assume Jamar Smith won't be around either. Semrau might be able to offset Carter's loss to some extent. But an team that is is already offensively challenged will lose 2 of it's top 3 offensive players. That's a heavy burden to place on a couple of freshmen backcourt players (McCamey and Watkins, assuming Watkins doesn't drop IL for AZ). And it's not like Weber likes to play young guys as it is. There's a lot good teams in the Big Ten. I think it will reaslitically be difficult for Illinois to finish above 7th next season. If Weber gets next year's team to the tournament, I don't think ayone could criticize his coaching.

QUOTE(Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 08:49 AM) What? Wright is a sophmore, no? Dee Brown graduated last year, no? You're right -- I was thinking of Collins

QUOTE(thedoctor @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 08:23 AM) yep. no excuses for what transpired last night. none. the team and weber choked badly, and i don't throw that term around loosely. there are so many things i'd love to b**** about, but i don't even know where to start. either way, it's been a brutal year and in a strange way i'm not unhappy it is over. if illinois doesn't show marked improvement next year then it is time for some kinds of changes. Well, odds are that IL won't make the NCAA tournament next season (#7 recruiting class in the conference after a #6 finish this year). I don't know what to think. Wins and losses actually bother me less than the offcourt incidents and the appearance of a program that is out of control and ethically bankrupt. If they can somehow improve on that, I won't care if they finish 8th in the Big Ten next season.

QUOTE(Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 08:34 AM) So you're telling me that Dee Brown told Julian Wright to go play at Kansas instead of with Dee at Illinois? Nice try. Wright would have joined Illinois the year after Brown left, so he wouldn't have been playing with him. Deny it if you want, but it's a story that's been repeated by several people. I think if you were to see Brown and ask him, he'd probably tell you it's true. Kansas is where Brown wants to be an assistant coach, not Illinois.

A A Peoria Journal Star article alys out why Illinois has such trouble recruiting: the article goes on to add the Weber disrespected Bryant by not talking to him on a recruiting visit, and Weber's great people-skills lead to 2 CPL coaches to walk out of a Weber clinic. I'll refrain from making a comment because I think the article speaks for itself....

QUOTE(WhiteSoxfan1986 @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 01:22 AM) I'm pretty sure everyones pissed because they had the game and choked. I can't believe Va Tech scored the last 12 points. Yeah I agree. I just think it's ironic that a couple days ago, a bunch of radio time and column space were devoted to how IL was the last team in and they really didn't deserve to make the tournament (and I agreed at the time). And now you get column's like Morrisey's in the Trib where he says IL wasn't really a 12 seed nor VTU a 5. Whatever. I don't see how people can claim IL shouldn't have made the dance and then turn around and act like IL was the 5 seed. It's annoying.

QUOTE(IlliniKrush @ Mar 17, 2007 -> 01:05 AM) I think my view on that game and the entire season can be summed up by: "................................................" I actually was surprised by how competitive ILL was. I really thought they'd get blown off the court, and they almost won it. It's hard to believe a team can win 23 games and take a strong ACC team (5 seed to their 12) down to the wire and yet look so bad the entire season. It's too bad -- if they had lost by the same score but in a different way, it wouldn't have generated nearly the media and fan derision this will. You'd think this was like Duke losing to VCU given the fan/media reaction. I have to wonder if the program and athletic department were run in a classier way, maybe the media would not be as negative as they are....

QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 11:52 PM) Considering we all know what player I'm referring to, and that some of us are from the south suburbs, maybe I might just know this person's coach and best friend? http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10064832 Some more positive vibes for the program. I know there's a lot of good people who are Illini fans on here, but there needs to be some changes made with this athletic dept. Well, I have to agree with the article you linked to -- from what was written there a change really should be made. FWIW, Doyel really is just about as obnoxious as the person he's writing about. I like how he pats himself on the back for realizing Weber couldn't recruit back in 2005 (wow Gregg, that's way before anyone else -- you sure are smart). I also like how he's actually smarter than both the coaches involved in this game. I'm not even sure why he watches basketball, it must be boring for him. Finally, I think you can lay ILL's lack of improvement over the season at Weber's feet, but I don't buy Greenberg's technical counting as "outcoaching" Weber. If the refs were cowed by that, they just suck at being refs. Anyway, I feel a little bad for Weber, who clearly should have stayed at SIU where he was happy (maybe he can go back if Lowey leaves). And most of all, I feel bad for players coming in like McCamey, who has talent and would be much better off going to someplace with a functional basketball program and a coach that could help him to a professional career. It's too bad Dee and Deron didn't get their message to him that ILL is a place to avoid.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 10:07 PM) Bottom line, 5 out of 6 in the first round for 1 conference strongly suggests that the conference was underrated to my eyes. I have to agree. I thought the Illini would get blown off the court by Va Tech (a team that beat both Duke and UNC). Obviously, it turned out to be a pretty even matchup. Even with the loss, the uproar over ILL getting in instead of Syracuse seems pretty silly now. It's probable only 2 Big Ten teams will make the Sweet Sixteen, but I think the conference was clearly underrated. Maybe it's a combination of Big Ten officiating and a bunch of defensive minded half-court coaches that give it the unlovely style, but the teams are decent. I do have to say, the "motion offense" is one of the most boring offensive sets I've ever seen. It's a modern four corners run against a shot clock where the corners switch positions. No wonder no decent recruits want to go to ILL -- who'd want to play in that scheme...

QUOTE(thedoctor @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 11:47 AM) i don't think it had anything to do with loyalty. it had to do with the fact that dee was not projected to be taken in the draft after his junior season. scouts said he could improve his position by coming back and playing a more true point, which would be his position in the nba. weber relayed that just like he relayed to deron that he should go. this is what just about every coach does. Well, if that's the case, then I stand corrected. The stories I remember reading at the time seemed to empahsize Brown feeling Weber wasn't supprting him and mentioned that Weber had no PG to replace him if he left. Certainly, if Weber really was just trying to advise Brown with regard to what would be best for his career, there's nothing disloyal in that.

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 11:39 AM) I heard Bruce caused global warming in Champaign too. he also contributed to the decline of modern civilization by having a high pitched voice. Actually, I heard that Global Warming refused to come to Champaign because Weber is there. Rumors are that it is currently headed to either Kansas or Indiana

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 11:15 AM) If anything it shows a complete lack of loyalty by Dee and Deron, and if that ever was to happen with a Wisconsin player I gaurantee a blackball would be a coming. I don't see how Williams and Brown were "disloyal", they were asked their honest opinion on which situation would be better and told Collins what they felt. I think it's commendable that they actually told Collins the truth, instead of suggesting he go to Illinois just because they played there. And as you say, both were Self's recruits and strongly considered transferring when he left for Kansas. It's not like they chose to play for Weber. As for loyalty, it's not a secret that Weber was less than supportive of Brown's attempt to go pro after the 05-06 season. Weber put his own career at UI ahead the wishes and best interests of his player, and I'm sure that Brown hasn't forgotten that. Loyalty should be two-way street.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 10:28 AM) If Bocot can get himself eligible, then I'll take our class but going by star rating just isn't accurate. Fay would be a 4 star right now if he didn't committ to SIU so early, I guarantee that and I certainly wouldn't trade him for Tisdale or Cole. Overall, I actually believe that Illinois has a pretty underrated class but I like what we have coming in. I agree that the star rating isn't very accurate, but it gives some estimation of a player's ability. And I thought it was accurate enough to point out that the UI class isn't particularly better than SIU's.

QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 10:08 AM) He's not the only Kansas player who Dee told to go there over Illinois. I heard Wright was the other one. What makes the story even more damning is that Dee Brown was still playing basketball for UI when he told Collins to go to Kansas. Both Self and Brown have suggested that Dee will be an assistant at Kansas after his playing career is over. It's pretty clear Weber is not a coach that inspires either loyalty or respect from his players. I'm really starting to think that Illinois should just drop it's basketball program to save itself the embarassment. QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 10:09 AM) Pretty sure SIU would kill for our 07 class Oh, I don't think so. Avg "star" ranking for a 2007 UI recruit is 3, for SIU it's 2.5. Not much difference. And word is that Quinton Watkins is going to drop his verbal commmit to UI and reopen his recruitment. AZ supposedly is interested in him since they are expecting to lose players to the draft. Weber is having a hard time getting any players, let alone highly regarded ones, to play for him.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 07:01 PM) I'm not not saying the Floyd trade is a good one, but everybody is saying it is not a good trade when the dude hasn't even pitched for our team yet. It's ridiculous. I don't think it is ridiculous to be disappointed at this point. Just because Floyd hasn't pitched in the bigs for the Sox yet doesn't mean that people can't form an opinion of whether or not the Sox got fair value in the trade. It's perfectly acceptable to look at Floyd's minor league numbers, and major league numbers with PHI and think he may not be able to give you the 5.25 or better ERA that you'd want from a 5th starter. Williams said that Floyd turned a corner in the AFL. Given that statement, it's reasonable to expect him to pitch moderately well in spring training. I really hope Floyd succeeds. And I admit that he could very possibly turn things around still. And on that quasi-optimistic note, I'm out of here...

QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 05:45 PM) The Rockies package for Jennings blows our package out of the water. I know Jennings is better than Garcia, but at least the Rockies got likely 3 MLB players out of it. At this point, we might be lucky to get 1 from our deal. Agreed. Seriously, Hirsh alone (just one of the players the Rox got for Jennings) would have been a better deal than Floyd/Gonzalez. Usually, I don't think it's faor for a fan to say that a better deal must have been out there, but in this case it's a reasonable based on the HOU-COL trade. It really looks like Floyd is an underperforming pitcher that the Sox fell in love with for some reason -- they projected him to break out and overvalued him accordingly. It's sort of like the Ritchie trade, where the Sox gave up overvalued Ritchie because they thought he would have a breakout season.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 03:56 PM) (sigh) I'm ready for Williams to tell me how tremendous his breaking ball was, or how the line didn't indicate how "impressive" he was. I still believe he'll ultimately make the team. Williams needs to show tangible proof that trading Garcia provided our ballclub with a player available to help this season. Hey those runs up on the board are just numbers -- they are just another statistic. The Sox scout the player, not the stats.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 03:13 PM) I think Erstad is a Socialist. I guess you haven't heard...he played football at Nebraska. They may wear red, but they're true blue patriots.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 03:11 PM) Is Darin Erstad even capable of playing CF? So Ozzie takes the two CFs (Erstad and Terrero), puts them in the corners and Mack in CF. I know it's a spring game but why...why would anyone do that? Was he drunk when he filled out the lineup card? Punishing Mack for something? Punishing the pitchers for something? Why?

QUOTE(Felix @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 10:35 AM) Even Aardsma? I'm assuming Aardsma is headed to AAA. I think the major league pen would be MacDougal, Jenks, Thornton, Masset, Sisco, Logan/Haegar. Considering the Phillies wanted Linebrink for Rowand, I be surprised if they could be talked in taking Aardsma off the Sox hands.

QUOTE(pcullotta @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 10:12 AM) It seems to me, Rowand's offensive abilities have been knocked quite a bit around here lateley. It doesn't look like Pods is going to be ready to start the season. So that leaves left field open for right now. If we don't pick up Rowand, we end up with Erstad and BA as regular starters. I would feel more comfortable with Rowand as an everyday starter then BA just because you pretty much know what you are getting with him. Look at his numbers: HR RBI BB SO SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS G AB R H 2B 3B 2001 4 20 15 28 5 1 .293 .385 .431 .816 63 123 21 36 5 0 2002 7 29 12 54 0 1 .258 .298 .394 .692 126 302 41 78 16 2 2003 6 24 7 21 0 0 .287 .327 .452 .779 93 157 22 45 8 0 2004 24 69 30 91 17 5 .310 .361 .544 .905 140 487 94 151 38 2 2005 13 69 32 116 16 5 .270 .329 .407 .736 157 578 77 156 30 5 2006 12 47 18 76 10 4 .262 .321 .425 .746 109 405 59 106 24 3 So, an average year for Aaron would be a .279 Avg, 16 HR, 61 RBI with a .780 OPS. That's not great but it's not terrible either. In the Second half of last year, BA hit .257 Avg with 3 HR, 13 RBI, and a .694 OPS. Couple with that the fact that you really don't know about BA yet. What if we go into the season with BA as an everyday starter and he hits like the first half of last year ( .192 Avg, .604 Ops)? Then our backup plan (without Rowand) would be Mack who everyone hated in the outfield last year. Bottom line, I would be for bringing A-Row back as long as we didn't have to give up a major bullpen guy (like a Jenks, Thornton, or MacDougal). Just for reference, Rowand hit .257 with a .730 OPS after the ASB last season. And wasn't as good defensively as Anderson was, by most metrics (I know, defensive metrics suck, etc.). Looking at Rowands stats, 2004 is a clearly a career year that biases your projection. I would think it's much more likely Rowand would have a year like his last two years: .265 avg .325 OBP .740 OPS with 12HRs. That's probably on the low side of the average performance for a starting AL CF. If Rowand were cheap, then fine -- go ahead and bring him back. But I really don't think he's much more than a marginal improvement over Anderson. And if takes a picther off the major league roster to get him, it's a bad trade.

QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 09:47 AM) I disagree. With the tough LHP in our division, you need every last bit of offense you can get against them. Rowand's a pretty solid hitter against LHP, and I would actually state I'd rather see him batting against the likes of C.C. and Santana than I would Brian Anderson. Of course, the two guys I'd most want to see face the tough lefties are Ozuna and Eduardo Perez. I agree Rowand is a decent platoon bat (although he sucked against LHP last season, he's hit it well historically). I'd be worried that Ozzie would make him an everyday player. And even in a platoon role, I'm not real happy with the other half of that platoon. I'm not sure at all that Erstad is going to produce in the regular season, despite an OK batting average in spring training. The bottom line for me is that Rowand offers some improvement in CF as a platoon player. But is he worth trading for? People who are thinking he can be had for Sean Tracey are delusional. Boone Logan alone won't get it done either (or Logan and Aardsma). PHI needs an actual major league reliever which is why the rumors involve names like MacDougal or Thornton. KW has a history of paying pemium talent for mediocre players he really likes. I'd be worried about that happening here as well.

QUOTE(max power @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 09:08 AM) That makes sense but who plays RF to make moving him over worth it? Jayson Werth? Rowand is having a miserable spring and had a bad second half last season (offensively and defensively).