lvjeremylv

Oh he might become a good pitcher someday..but it won't be while wearing a White Sox uniform. Going to Dodger Stadium could be the best thing he could do. See: Jeff Weaver.

Yes.

After someone compares a mental midget to 3 stud HOF pitchers who were huge parts of winning a World Series, it's kind of hard to have an intelligent conversation with them. Sorry.

:rolly :sleep

Pitching in the major leagues these days is horrible overall. There are too many teams, so pitchers that shouldn't be allowed to even buy replica jerseys are actually being paid to wear real ones. So, comparing Jon to your average #3 starter might not be a bad argument. However, since I expect the Sox to be better than just "average", I'd rather compare him to the #3s of teams that actually win. Much different story. I've seen Jon pitch many games, but his numbers really tell me all I need to know. He was a #4 last year (and I think every year before that), and had his first winning record ever (1 game over .500). He was facing other teams' #4 starters most of the time..and he still was just a .500 pitcher. That's sad. And unlike most 24 year old pitchers, he's got 5 years experience under his belt. So comparing 1st or 2nd year pitchers to a 5 year veteran isn't a fair comparison.

Newbie or not, I can recognize a hilarious comparison when I see one. Any halfway objective baseball fan can see that Jon Garland is a loser.

Someone who just compared Garland to Schilling, Johnson, and Brown is calling someone out on their intelligence? Too funny. :rolly

Please, never mention the name Jon Garland in the same thread as Randy Johnson, Curt Schilling, or Kevin Brown. :rolly

Um..how many more years are Sox fans supposed to robotically say the phrase "Jon Garland is going to be a stud"? It's been long enough. I think it's quite clear that this menal midget is never going to have a record better than .500 and his ERA will always be in the high 4's. What a stud. His ERA last season should have been over 5, but a meaningless gem vs. the lowly Royals brought it into the 4's. Woohoo! Great season Jon! :rolly As a #5, I can live with this deer-in-the-headlights on our team. He's definitely a better option than Dan Wright, Jason Grilli, and whatever other losers we had in the #5 spot last season. But anything higher (ha ha..no pun intended) than #5 for this loser is unacceptable.

I'll take David Eckstein. He's a gritty player who knows how to play the game right. Either him or Alex Cora would be an upgrade from Willie Harris, IMO. But of the 3 (including that Japanese guy), I'd take Eckstein.

If he stays healthy, Orlando Hernandez is better than our current 3 & 4 guys (Garland & Contreras), so I suppose that's a good thing. But, who knows how old this guy really is, and is he healthy now? These are question marks that scare me. But like I said, if he's healthy, getting him for $4M a year sounds good to me. Just wish we'd get someone like Wade Miller or Odalis Perez. Miller's been hurt, but at least he's young, and Odalis Perez is young and has good stuff. *sigh*

I agree with that completely. Offense hasn't worked for the Sox in recent years, and every year it's been our ineffective pitching that has cost us a shot at the division. Obviously, in 2004, our 5th starters were incredibly horrible, Garland was very mediocre at best, and Contreras was very up and down after we acquired him. If the Sox want to compete in 2005, we need both Garland and Contreras to have an ERA in the low-mid 4's. Ultimately, it may turn out to be a case like 2000 where everyone had to have a good year, while at the same time staying healthy.

Anybody who calls themselves a White Sox fan should be very happy with the trade. And if they're not, they will be in time.

Great point. Willie's just as fast as Podsednik, and hopefully he and Raines can help him learn the art of base stealing. If he could learn how to do it, he'll always have a major league job.

No, $5-$6M alone won't reel in a guy like Clement, but I think that there's a much better chance of JR ponying up the extra $3-$4M now that he's saved money by dumping Carlos. Plus I think we could get a guy like Odalis Perez for right around $5M a year. Maybe a 3-year, $15M deal or so. And this team is going to have holes somewhere - all teams do. But the one place a team CANNOT afford to have holes is in starting pitching.

Last off-season the Sox signed him to a minor league contract, but he got injured (I think he tore his achilles' tendon) and missed the whole season. Does anyone know what his status is? Did he retire? I'm not saying he could solve our #5 problem necessarily, but I seem to remember he was a pretty good pitcher at one time, and he'd be worth taking a look at in ST if he's recovered from the injury.

100? Wow. That would be incredible, but I don't really see it happening. I'd love to be wrong, though. I think he'll probably be running nearly everytime he gets on base, though, so if your .280 avg comes through, it's possible. However, he was 70-for-83 last season - I don't think he needs tips from Rock.

By doing that, you're ignoring possibly the most important result of the trade. The Sox now have about $5-$6M to use on a starting pitcher. How can you just toss that aside and say Milwaukee got the better deal?

Most of these "analysts" aren't very familiar with specific players and such. They watch games, but nobody watches the White Sox as much as the people on this board, and I think we would all agree that Carlos Lee is NOT a team player. Anytime you can get a guy with the speed of Podsednik and an arm like Vizcaino AND save about $6M while dumping a selfish player, you're best served to do it. The analysts basically go off of stats - and we all know that stats don't mean jack.

Regardless of what kind of attitude Carlos has/had, this was a very good trade by the White Sox. We got a very solid CF & lead-off hitter, as well as a hard throwing reliever. We were in desperate need of a lead-off hitter, and every team can use a little extra bullpen help. If Podsednik can just hit .260 or .270 and have an OBP of .330 or so (which he should be able to do, I believe), he'll have a great chance at stealing 70 like he did in 2004, and that should translate into well over 100 runs scored on this team. Plus he can probably *gasp* bunt a runner over if need-be. Imagine that! Lee was a pretty good hitter, but like the article points out, he is a very selfish player, and that's not what winning teams have. Winning teams have guys who are willing to sacrifice their own stats for the good of the team. Plus it frees up a few million for us to go after a starting pitcher. Love the trade.

I strongly dislike AJ, but he would greatly improve our lineup, so I've gotta say we should do everything we can to sign him. Ben Davis is a mediocre backup at best, and he certainly can't be our everyday catcher if we expect to compete in 2005. Another move the Sox have to do to be viable contenders is sign either Matt Clement or Odalis Perez (or trade for someone like Javier Vazquez if no FAs are available). Our #4 and #5 needs to be at worst Jon Garland and Jose Contreras. If either one of them is our #3, the Sox aren't going anywhere.