WHITESOXRANDY

Are you serious? A utility man and a backup catcher for a very solid middle of the rotation starting pitcher? Ask your daddy which GM is gonna pick his pocket next?

Now, the Sox are backing off rebuilding according to JR. I knew they would never do it. Say hello to 3rd or 4th place thru 2020 +.

I'm just curious what everyone is gonna say about this trade if this guy can't hack it as a starter and ends up in about 3 years merely a solid set-up guy ? This is a very risky trade for the Sox getting only 1 prospect that wasn't even on the map until last season and has barely pitched above A ball. The reviews on him are mixed. Kenny gave up a sure thing in a young cheap successful big league closer for that. This team is not in a position to take gambles like that and not shop around to all teams for the best package of prospects. They are in a huge whole with the weakest minor league talent in baseball. He went about this in a very unprofessional way - which appears to be his habit. Molina might end up being a solid starting pitcher for a long time but if he doesn't than KW f***ed up again.

What's the point of this thread? The Sox have made 1 small deal that's for the long term. It may end up being good or not. That's the summation of where the Sox off-season is now. There are many personnel moves yet to be made so we have no idea what this roster will look like come April. The only thing that I can say at this point is that I am glad that KW has shown, thus far, some patience. I hope that continues and he does more dealing in January than December.

Now, most of the big name pitching has been moved. Let's talk about what teams might be after Danks, Floyd and Thornton. It looks to me like Boston, Yankees, Baltimore, Texas and Nationals are pretty much the teams to deal with. Red Sox need the most pitching help in the rotation and the pen. Yanks could also use both but not as much. Baltimore has always wanted Floyd. Texas, we know, wants Danks back. The Nationals need a starter. There are other teams out there that will likely be interested in an elite LH set-up man for only a $ 12 mil. investment. If the Sox are truly rebuilding now then I don't see why they would keep Thornton and Danks past the winter. Danks is in demand and the return only drops once the season starts. He clearly isn't going to re-sign with the Sox so logic says...trade now. Thornton is not needed on a team that is going nowhere and the salary relief is much needed. They should be able to get a good prospect for him. How good remains debatable. Still, no reason to keep. Gavin is under control for 2 more years so the Sox might want to keep him for this year so the team isn't guaranteed last place without him and Danks. Also, it would give the young guys another year to develop. I would hold onto him 1 more year. Of course, all depends on the offers the Sox get. Any mystery teams not listed here? Does anybody think that the Sox keep all 3 of these guys? Or, even 2?

My sources tell me that the Sox want to sign him and then package him with Jeff Marquez, Johnny Nunez, Wilson Betemit, Nick Swisher, Jon Gilmore and Tyler Flowers for Gio Gonzalez.

You're right. i forgot about Axford. But, there are definitely a handful of teams that would have been interested in Santos and once again KW acts impetuously and that's why so many of his deals have failed.

Not only that but tomorrow the Phillies and Brewers will find out if Madsen and KRod will accept arb. They are not expected to - meaning 2 more teams needing closers. I don't know maybe KW could have waited 2 more days? I doubt Toronto said this guy is only available today. Who knows, maybe KW could have gotten Toronto to throw in another prospect if he would have worked it for another week or two. I don't understand him. But, I never understood a guy that would give away a 1st round draft pick to sign Adam Dunn. Forget the contract. I wouldn't have considered signing Dunn at the time solely because he cost a 1st round pick. Look at David Ortiz, who is a far better hitter than Dunn and no team made him an offer because they refused to give up a pic. Now, he accepts arb. and Boston gets him on a 1 year deal - for probably less than the Sox will pay Dunn this year. Up until this year KW had no need for prospects, draft picks, farm systems and such. Now, they've hired more scouts and he's gonna rebuild and get young prospects. It's nice that the Sox are only the 30th team in baseball to figure this out.

Another thing about the Sox that makes no sense is the plan to have Rios in CF, De Aza in LF and Viciedo in RF ! De Aza is the best CFer, Rios is the best RFer and Viciedo is clearly the most immobile of the bunch and should be in LF.

They are all younger than Rowand.

That's the only thing that pisses me off about Mark. Supposedly, he was seriously pondering retirement but now he's pushing for a 4-year deal? Same with Oswalt. He was supposed to be done.....maybe 1 more year. Now, they say he's looking for a 3-year deal. I guess money almost always wins.

Firstly, there's no room for him. Rios, De Aza, Viciedo and Lillibridge. Secondly, he's worse than all of them. WHen was the last time that he was good? What year? Third, why would you take away playing time from the young guys to play Rowand? Makes no f***ing sense at all. The only reason that I can imagine the Sox would even think about it would be the need to sell a few tickets.

So, I guess if you found a $ 100 bill on the ground you would be okay to trade it for a hamburger? The Sox gave away an excellent closer that was young and very cheap. Now, a good starting pitcher is def. worth more than a closer. So, if this kid becomes, within a few years, an excellent starting pitcher for many years then the Sox did good. But, that seems to be very debatable right now on this kid since he's only thrown 22 innings above A ball. If he ends up in the bullpen then the Sox got fleeced. And, if he ends up just a so-so starting pitcher at the big league level then the Sox blew a chance to get a better return for a valuable piece like Santos. Molina might be great but right now the return looks light for Santos because the Sox only got 1 prospect and the reports on him vary quite a bit.

So, I guess if you found a $ 100 bill on the ground you would be okay to trade it for a hamburger? The Sox gave away an excellent closer that was young and very cheap. Now, a good starting pitcher is def. worth more than a closer. So, if this kid becomes, within a few years, an excellent starting pitcher for many years then the Sox did good. But, that seems to be very debatable right now on this kid since he's only thrown 22 innings above A ball. If he ends up in the bullpen then the Sox got fleeced. And, if he ends up just a so-so starting pitcher at the big league level then the Sox blew a chance to get a better return for a valuable piece like Santos. Molina might be great but right now the return looks light for Santos because the Sox only got 1 prospect and the reports on him vary quite a bit.

Exactly. Another dumbass move for KW.

+ 1

Well, I don't believe that the White Sox will see the playoffs again in this decade so.....why not?

If Kenny does really gut this team (which I very much doubt) than I'm at peace with letting Mark walk as part of that plan. I will miss him very much as a fan and it will result in lower attendance. It is not just a sentimental thing to bring him back. The reason half of baseball is after him is because he would better any rotation in baseball. And, what the Sox would have to pay him would probably worth it for 2 reasons. Firstly, the team will be that much better and perhaps keep the team from being eliminated by June and the rest of the team giving up. Also, reasons for fans to come and see a half way decent product. Lastly, in 2014 Buehrle should be close to 200 wins in a Sox uniform - another reason for interest, excitement, ticket sales etc. If KW half asses the rebuild and tries the "we are planning to contend in 2013" without Mark it would be a stupid plan. Of course, it is already anyway for the Sox.

Right. And, these are the 2 biggest winners the Sox have had in a long time. With these being 2 of the very few professional ball players the Sox have right now, they are likely last place finishers in the dvision without them. With them, they might be middle of the pack.....might have a shot at .500. How will attendance be when the Sox are in the cellar of the AL Central ? And, besides these 2 stars who else on the Sox would you go out and pay money to watch?

Exactly. Buehrle is worth the money that he wants just due to the ticket sales. If Konerko was traded and Buehrle signed elsewhere it would be hard to imagine what KW could even do to draw flies to the park next year.

Here's hoping Kenny doesn't rush into any trades next week. Maybe, he won't act like a 17 y.o. kid with his first shot at a woman this year and he'll exhibit some restraint. Last year, on this date he HAD to have Adam Dunn. In 09 he HAD to unload Swisher in November. This is his biggest flaw as a GM once he decides that he wants a player or wants to trade a player - that's it! He's a like a kid with money burning a hole in his pocket. Grow up Kenny and take your time making the deals and squeeze these other GM's like they do you. Wait them out and wait for their desperation like they do you.

I doubt very much the Sox would deal him now. It would be a dumb move almost certainly. It would make much more sense to deal Thornton and Crain first. Just like KC with Soria, the Sox could deal Santos anytime in the next 3 years and get a nice return. Of course it makes sense to trade any player if you are offered enough. If Reed proves to be closer material and the Sox are bombing by July it might be a nice idea.

1. Thornton could absolutely bring a nice return - if Kenny is patient. That is the whole key and the whole question. He's never been patient in the past. The best trade returns come as the FA signings near then end and the left out teams become desperate. As far as Thornton goes the Sox are in a great position because the Yanks are in dire need of someone just like him and the Red Sox need any kind of good pitching. Also, prices for relievers has been going up so much so that Thornton's contract is not prohibitive at all. 2. A blind man can see that the Sox need to rebuild. Would they do a complete rebuild job ? I don't believe it for a second. I don't think that there is any way that KW or JR has the patience for it or the balls to say to the fan base that we plan to compete again in 2 or 3 years. Expect a half-ass gutting and a few additions meant for 2012 so management can say come out to the ballpark because we can win in 2012. KW said " we are looking for ML ready talent". He didn't say "the best prospects".

Hilarious. Too bad that he didn't make any trades from Kenny's house. We might have something to celebrate.

I believe the Yanks would love to have Thornton. I don't believe the Sox would trade him for Romine who is nothing special at all and probably not even as good as Tyler Flowers. It makes no sense. Firstly, the Sox can do much better. Secondly, they would wait to move Matt until the FA's are signed and the market for him intensifies like in January. This wouldn't be an offer that blows them away to pull the trigger on in mid-Nov. It's ridiculous.