TaylorStSox

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 9, 2012 -> 06:34 PM) Yea, I'm personally responsible for 45 pages of posts and numerous threads about this situation. Nobody else is concerned or speculating, lol. In fact, I keep saying "the Sox are f***ing Chris Sale" over and over again. Wait. Where in any thread ever written at SoxTalk have I used those words? You're entertaining me on an otherwise boring day. Outside if this board, there is no drama. I caight the game at a Sox bar in the loop last night. I had about 4 conversations regarding Sale that all went like this,"what's going on with Sale?" "I don't know but it would be a shame if he never started again." "Yup." There's concern, but no drama, no essay long diatribes, no anger. Why? Nobody really knows anything at this point.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 9, 2012 -> 03:53 PM) Why didn't they just do this a week ago and avoid all the needless drama? They simply could have skipped one of his starts (arguing it was part of their plan all along to skip a start here or there, especially around offdays and in order to keep his final innings pitched total for the season down to 120-140ish) and it would have been a "small" story and there would have been SOME speculation, but not nearly to this extent. The only place any "drama" exists is on the board and in your head. It's not like people on the street are like, "the Sox are f***ing Chris Sale." Most people don't get angry over conjecture and speculation.

QUOTE (flavum @ May 9, 2012 -> 11:09 AM) Sale should be in charge of his own career. As long as he's informed, given options and possible consequences, then it's on him if he gets hurt. If he says today that he wants to start, he should do it. But if he does start, then the Sox have to monitor it and manage him in the way they see fit...as a starter. A 23 year old, under team control, should never be in charge of his own career. He's employed by the Sox. How they choose to use him is their prerogative.

QUOTE (iamshack @ May 9, 2012 -> 11:01 AM) I think they are genuinely concerned about him first, as they should be, as they have an obligation to be. This. Not everything's a conspiracy. I do agree that he should have been starting in AAA last year. Bringing him out of the pen was a mistake. I understand the reason, but it was shortsighted.

I really don't understand the problem. The Sox have a fantastic track record of keeping pitchers healthy, absolutely outstanding. We don't know the whole story. I understand that we live in a world where everybody demands to know everybody's business, but I'll give the Sox the benefit of the doubt here. They have a better idea of what's best for Chris Sale than any expert on any message board.

QUOTE (greg775 @ May 7, 2012 -> 09:49 PM) I wish Hafner was on the White Sox. You want a contract worse than Rios'?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 7, 2012 -> 11:40 AM) How deep is the Rays' starting rotation, vis a vis the White Sox? How deep is their minor league system, vis a vis the White Sox? Where are they in the standings? Whatever they're doing, it's seeming to work, since they've been in the playoffs year after year after year in the toughest division in MLB. Their major league rotation isn't going to suffer as a result because they have the depth to cover it up or make a trade. What team's going to give us another Chris Sale for $12 million worth in commitment to Matt Thornton? Not likely. Whereas the Rays still have the ability to trade Wade Davis and get a nice return because everyone knows he doesn't have the same structural/mechanical flaws. And they're doing all this while missing Longoria from the line-up. Take Paul Konerko or Dunn out of the current White Sox line-up and we're fighting with the Twins and Royals to get to last place and a Top 5-7 pick in 2013. Many would argue that's exactly what we SHOULD be doing.

Oh, God, Hawk's talking about "attitude." He's already given up.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 01:06 PM) are you 12? Who starts arguments? Can't we just be buddy's with different philosophies? You're my favorite poster, we're just different. We'll be like the odd couple. You're dirty, the every man's man. You're outgoing and people like you. I'm clean and right all the time, but rub people the wrong way. Love ya, bro.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 01:03 PM) pretty sure you caused an entire thread to be shut down so it could get "cleaned up" Are you mad you read my Game of Thrones spoiler and it ruined the books for you?

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 01:00 PM) you obviously have not read any of my posts over the last 8 years i've posted here. i was getting flamed for being too optimistic a week ago. you showed up two days ago and have been flaming people and inciting arguments left and right Italics denote lack of caring. Bold denotes, Have I?

It would be interesting if the Sox and Tigers could switch home parks for the year. We're built for theirs, they're built for ours.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 12:42 PM) sorry man, i didn't realize part of sox fandom was being a homer who supports every move the sox make. my bad sorry man, i didn't realize part of sox fandom was being a baby and being a pessimist who says every move the sox make sucks. my bad

At least Axelrod can occasionally miss a bat.

QUOTE (Jake @ May 6, 2012 -> 12:39 PM) Has Molina lost fastball velocity or something? He was supposed to be a 92-95 guy with movement With the mood the way it is, 92 becomes 89. If we start going good and everyone's happy 92 becomes 95. It's the way of the internet.

Did Steve Stone just call Peralta a "fantastic SS?" He's been hanging out with Hawk too long. That's insane.

The team also might not be ready to throw Reed into the fire. Maybe they don't want to rush him and possibly ruin him.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 11:46 AM) he WONT because we already told the world "HEY THIS KID HAS A MECHANICAL FLAW AND HIS ELBOW HURTS" how are we gonna get a kings ransom for THAT? What should they have done, DL him with an "oblique strain?" This team doesn't operate like that. Sale still has value because he still has upside. There's a team out there that thinks they can fix him. There's a team out there that will give value to have a potentially dominant closer. We'll know in a couple months how valuable he is.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 11:42 AM) but you're not getting Jesus Montero like you could have a couple days ago. The Pineda situation mirrors this PERFECTLY. A team that saw a flaw, unloaded the guy, and walked away looking like a genius. That's part of what I'm saying, it's fluid. A week ago this board would have been in full meltdown if we traded Sale for Montero straight up. If Kenny decides to move Sale at the deadline, he might get a king's ransom. I wouldn't be shocked. Let's wait and see.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 11:39 AM) also. caulfield knows more about baseball than 90% of this board, me included. if he's freaking out - i think it's legit. just sayin. One of the great things about baseball is that it's the one sport that makes 95% of the experts look stupid. It's so fluid. I'm still waiting for the Jays and Royals to compete. I think I'm going to be waiting a few more years for that.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 11:38 AM) he's obviously a closer. what the f*** is the point in having two ace closers? Having depth is a good thing. Why can't they trade Sale or Reed? I still think Sale has a ton of value. Teams overspend for relievers all the time. There's a team out there who would go crazy for a 23 year old lefty reliever that throws 100 and might possibly become a starter. We're 1 month into a rebuild. Give it some time.

QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 11:34 AM) can you paint the scenario where it works out for 2013? jeez guys i love the white sox as much as anyone here - people were literally b****ing that i was being TOO POSITIVE a week ago. but i just don't see how some of you can see this as anything but a negative in the short and long term - we now have two vacant starter spots going into next year. - we're wasting Addison Reed - we can't trade Sale now - relievers blow out their arms too (see Brian Wilson) - we don't have a deep enough minor league system to trade for good starters or develop them in time for next year i guess i just felt given the positive results this team was getting this year, that we could viably compete both this and next year. maybe not for the WS, but easily the division. now we've at the very least given up on next year. this year we've still got a decent rotation, but if both Floyd and Peavy depart, we're left with an ugly set of circumstances come 2013. did the nats turn strasburg into a closer because he was an injury risk? How are they wasting Reed? He was drafted 2 freaking years ago. He's way ahead of schedule. So far, we've gotten more production from that draft than any team in baseball that didn't draft Bryce Harper.

This Sale fiasco is a big blow for the future, but I'm not going to panic until I see what we can get for Floyd, AJ, Thornton, Crain and possibly Peavy. I'm gonna wait to see how Molina and Castro develop. If, after this year, we can't build a rotation around Danks, Humber, Molina, Stewart, Castro, Axelrod and whoever we acquire via trade, then I might get pissed. I said all along that I was fine with a rebuild. Freaking out this early in the process is extremely premature. I'm also not ready to close the door on Sale. Maybe they work on stretching him out again and re-evaluate after the season. I sure as hell trust Don Cooper. He's one guy that knows what he's doing.

QUOTE (chw42 @ May 5, 2012 -> 05:58 PM) It's the mechanics. I must have misunderstood Stone then.

QUOTE (chw42 @ May 5, 2012 -> 05:56 PM) They are almost the same pitcher in terms of pitches and velocity. Both are fastball/slider guys. Reed's got more of a hard slider, Sale's is more curve-ball like. I wonder if it's the slider or the change that's hurting his arm.