Balta1701

Presidential candidates (Obama included) as Dungeons and Dragons characters.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:27 PM) BS. This has been going on for 4 days now. If you honestly believe PSU forced the DA and the local police to drop a clear confession of molestation, and then allow a predator to continue to rape children, in order to protect their football program, Paterno better not be the center of discussion unless there is evidence that he had something to do with it. We have just as much evidence that the DA dropped his charges because it was Penn State Football as we have evidence that Joe Paterno personally called him and asked him to not investigate further. That part is informed speculation at best. But there clearly needs to be investigation to figure out why that happened.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:22 PM) In the immediate reaction to a scandal, the most well-known names will get the most attention. This isn't surprising or unique or even wrong. One other important note...Joe Paterno and the Receiver's coach are the only 2 who would be still acting as representatives of the university this Saturday if it were not for the public outcry. Forcing that to not happen is an important element of the public reaction.

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:16 PM) What about a bad year? 9.5 mil isn't exactly cheap labor. A single bad year would not be enough, based on his track record. You'd still spend $9.5 million on him if he put up an ERA over 5 next year, unless you knew that he physically couldn't pitch.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:16 PM) Not a whole lot of people are disputing that, himself included. Meanwhile, you're accusing the University of forcing the DA not to prosecute a child rape and an 80 year old football coach is your biggest concern. Meanwhile, a 70 year old football coach failed to act repeatedly in response to credible allegations of child rape happening in his facilities, and the fact that the media is being hard on him 10 years later is your biggest concern.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:12 PM) Because it's pretty clear he shouldn't be representing 95% of the media coverage here. Then he should have acted stronger in 2002 and saved 50% of this guy's victims from being raped.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:09 PM) And yet Joe Paterno is receiving 95% of the media coverage here. And he's also receiving 100% of the defenses.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 02:05 PM) So now there is a cover up which goes as far as the local police and the DA, correct? It at least encompasses the university administration who have in fact been just recently charged for the cover up, and it sure as hell is hard to explain how the police/DA made the choices they made a decade ago if the answer isn't "Penn State Football". On that last part, I'd await further investigation, and if I were a voter in that district, I'd be giving my representatives Hell to demand that investigation happen.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:56 PM) Than why is he getting fired now, Balta? When the media has picked up the story and made it almost all about Joe Paterno instead of Jerry Sandusky? Why did not they not fire before for all these gross incompetencies? Because they had covered up those gross failures until the Grand Jury report was released? And because having him coach another game with those failures known would have been another slap in the face of the university. Based on those reports, if firing him over this issue was possible in 2003, then it should have been done. But that's the cover up for you.

Link

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:43 PM) I've gone over this several times now, so I am not going to waste the time to reiterate it again for your benefit. Go back and read. You know what really frustrates me about this reply? There are probably what, 10 people in this thread who think PSU did the exact right thing by dumping him immediately like they did last night. How many of those 10 are convinced solely by the harsh media coverage? Because if you can't say that the people here who think that paterno and the admins got exactly what they deserved are getting their outrage from the media, then that means there's plenty of outrage to go around.

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:23 PM) 2013 is a club option, so it could be. The only way that option is not picked up is if he blows out his arm.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:37 PM) With regards to Paterno? I respectfully disagree. And I respectfully disagree with you. The media coverage is not provoking the outrage. The outrage is a direct effect of the fact that a major university covered up a child rapist in their midst, because he happened to be a sports coach. That would get top billing any day of the week.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:28 PM) PSU is firing him here because it simply must be done. And I agree. This story has gotten so big and the public backlash is so strong (in part because of the media coverage in regards to Paterno), that they have no other choice but to sacrifice him, even if it means settling with him afterwards for their illegal termination. Seriously, it's not the "Media coverage" that has made the public backlash strong here.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:28 PM) Yeah, I'm saying I'm absolutely convinced that PSU was the only thing on the minds of the many around campus who knew what had happened, and a forced retirement and banishment from bringing kids on campus are direct results of a cover-up in action. And it's probably going to come out that this is why the police and DA backed off on investigating the coach in 1998 as well. Because it was Penn State Football.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:11 PM) Penn State let this happen, why are we not trying to destroy the school? I'd say that everyone involved needs removed immediately, and everyone except McQueary has already been removed. The next step for the Trustees is you have to figure out not just who was involved, but how the culture of the program allowed for this coverup to take place. Those type of reforms take a lot longer, and they're a lot harder to do because those level of programs are given god-like status (which is probably why the police backed off in the first place.) I believe the Trustees also have started an investigation into the university's role in the matter. That is the exact step which needed to be taken.

Rock, yeah, I know, i read that part. I'm just trying to illustrate a point to anyone trying to say that Paterno is being treated too harshly. Even if you assume that account is wrong and Paterno's account is right, then Paterno still should have done more. If you go entirely based off of Joe Paterno's 2 pre-firing statements, then the right move for the university was his removal. And if anything more comes out, then that's a matter for the DA, police, and history to judge. He should not be coaching this weekend. The Trustees had to do that. The other guy involved should not be coaching. The AD and President involved should be gone. Clean the house.

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 12:26 PM) You have Peavy, Danks, and Floyd in their contract years, Humber and Sale, and a pretty decent bullpen. Along with unmovable contracts in Dunn and Rios. Gavin Floyd is not in a contract year.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:04 PM) Balta, How do you know that? What if the real truth is McQuery told Paterno, "I saw Sandusky wrestling with a little boy, but it didnt seem to be a big deal at all, thats why I didnt call the police." Should Paterno have called the police? Im just saying without knowing what happened its hard to determine what his actions should have been. Everyone is acting like he absolutely knew Sandusky was raping kids. That just isnt supported by the facts (as of today). His own words. If all you got was "Something inappropriate involving an 8 year old boy"...and you are in the same position as Joe Paterno, it is incumbent upon you to act more. Whether that is asking more questions or taking a harsher stance with administration to make sure that it is dealt with, you have to do something more. Failure to do that alone is cause for him being fired. No one is suggesting he is legally culpable for anythign here. He reported it upwards, and the people above him decided to cover it up. He may at some point be named as a conspirator in a coverup by the people above him, that remains to be seen, but at present, he's not a criminal, but he received from the university exactly what needed to happen. Quite simply...failure to do enough in response to what he has already admitted to hearing is more than grounds for termination.

That also means AJ Pierzynski will not be traded to Pittsburgh.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 01:01 PM) Ive never said that. Ive merely said that you are taking 1 witness (who in my opinion is the main culprit) word, over 3 other witnesses. Thats not a really good place to start, especially because McQuery is the one who saw a crime and failed to report. And he also should no longer be a coach at that institution.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 12:51 PM) SS2k, I know I am, I really should stop posting. But there is a part of me that believes if just 1 person can see that Paterno deserves the chance to defend himself before we proclaim him guilty, than it was worth it. I truly believe that we as a society must fight for "innocent until proven guilty", because it is so easy to just call people guilty. You dont think its easier for me to sit here and say "Screw Paterno he should rot in hell" Of course it is, but the easy road isnt always the right road. Here is Joe Paterno's full statement from Sunday. Here's Joe Paterno's "I'll retire at the end of the season" statement.

And that's the way it should be.

QUOTE (DBAHO @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 03:35 AM) Don't think I've seen a candidate who has crashed and burned in a period of 2 months. more in my life. Howard Dean. 1 week instead of 2 months.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Nov 10, 2011 -> 12:49 PM) Iamshack, Im not arguing Paterno shouldnt be fired. Im arguing that Paterno at least deserves a chance to respond to this, before hes made out to be a monster by everyone. Maybe he is a monster, maybe its worse than what we even imagine. But its god damn America, and he deserves the chance to tell his story, before everyone proclaims him guilty. Its not about pimping legal knowledge, its about how screwed the media makes our system. This has been out for several days now. Joe Paterno has issued statements including apologies, and has admitted in those statements that he did not do as much as he should. If Joe Paterno had more to say, had something else to say that could have defended his actions, he has already had a chance to say that and chose not to do so.