Milkman delivers

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 03:10 PM) Are you really putting Jon Garland and Jake Peavy into the same league? Cy Young was also a better pitcher than Jon Garland at one point. Was. Stop living in the past. Jake Peavy is a has-been that can't pitch a month without getting hurt. Garland at least gives you consistent, average innings.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 03:07 PM) So, either you're blaming Jake Peavy for not sitting down and having a good talking to his body (my knees, for example, might just be learning their lesson now!) or you're just angry at a guy for things he can't control QUOTE (MAX @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 03:09 PM) You appear to think he has a choice in the matter. He does not. All he can do is try to pitch and keep himself in good pitching condition. He does that, but still gets hurt. So what can he do that he is actually capable of? Retire then. Return the money he's stealing. Oh Jake, you're so cute with the way you try. You're like our own little Rudy. You know what, just keep the money. Take some more actually. Oh my, you're so cute trying so hard and being such a great teammate. I wish we had more guys like you, because we'd have a team full of winners and then there'd be no way we could ever lose again. It's just that can-do attitude that brings us all together and helps us play at nearly a .500 winning percentage. Golly, this guy is amazing.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 03:07 PM) I think Milky is telling us he is easily upset. Haha, what would it take you guys to get upset? I think fathom was right on about the Garland thing. If Jon Garland were on this team and continued to get hurt, everyone would hate him. But since it's Peavy and he makes scary faces when he pitches and frowns when things go badly, it's OK because he's trying!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 03:03 PM) Really? What should he do at this point? Pitch through injuries? Not pitch through injuries? Retire? Not get injured? Not get injured constantly? Either of those work. So unless you want to blame God, all of this rests on Peavy and his body.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:58 PM) I'm not cutting him slack. He has done almost nothing for us in his time here. He also has made a valiant effort to correct that situation. He could easily just say oh screw up I got paid and sulk or pout but he's making an effort to be a good teammate, he's making an effort to contribute and he's saying all the right things as far as the team goes. I'm rooting for him not only because it would help our team if he could ever get healthy but also because he is clearly a guy who is easy to root for. This all started because he said he was willing to go to the bullpen. Instead of soley discussing the merits of that, which I don't think would work, the thread largely turned into a Peavy bash session. If the guy had come out and demanded he be back in the rotation that would be done thing, but he responded to a question and said he'd be fine going to the bullpen. Some of the responses were just ridiculous. That's gonna happen when you make $17 million a season to do nothing. People are going to rip on you no matter what if you aren't producing. It's all squarely on Peavy. He's the only one that can fix it.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:58 PM) Problem with that comparison is that the Tigers have the two best starting pitchers in the division. And the best hitter.

I'm sure Carl Yastrzemski would be pretty terrible right now.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:46 PM) I'm just shocked at how much slack White Sox fans have shown Peavy. I don't hate Jake, I just don't really care for him that much as I view him as a colossal waste of money so far in a Sox jersey due to injuries and inconsistency. I wonder what people would be saying if he didn't come to Chicago with a "gamer" reputation, and instead had a reputation like Judy Garland. Give me 5 Jon Garland's over 5 Jake Peavy's any day. Hell, 5 Jake Peavy's might combine to throw as many innings as one Garland.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:46 PM) So it's his fault he answers questions now too? Would you rather he said no comment from here on out? Because I'm pretty sure people would then complain about him having a poor attitude etc... I would prefer that to his constant "I'm going to do this and that when I return after working harder than I ever have to make my comeback" talk. In a perfect world, I would just like him to remain healthy. That, or just completely hurt himself so much that he'll just retire. Like fathom just said, I'm sick of all of the slack the guy gets for doing nothing just because he's such a "gamer".

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:35 PM) That people here are regularly arguing otherwise? Well, I've seen plenty of people say something along the lines of "This guy is a Cy Young winner" or the like. I even saw it in this thread, I believe.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:31 PM) And to play devil's advocate, it drives some people crazy that there are posters that still view him as the NL Cy Young caliber pitcher before injuries and pitching in the Grand Canyon in a different era. Like.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:27 PM) The complaining is bad enough, but the jumps to conclusions that don't even make sense are what is driving me crazy. About him basically throwing in the towel? While I can see the logic in that, I never made that argument myself. I'm just sick and tired of the whole Peavy saga.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:22 PM) And neither is Jake Peavy. Then I won't have to look far for things to complain about, although that's never been a problem

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:19 PM) Because we're pretty darn tired of them. Same as Peavy's injury concerns, we aren't going anywhere.

QUOTE (mmmmmbeeer @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:05 PM) What makes you rule out the fact that, ya know, he's a good teammate and feels responsible for the 6 man rotation and therefore should be the one to go to the pen? Have you ever offered to do something knowing damn well that you really don't want to do it? You make the offer knowing that you will likely be turned down? That's what I see here...JFP being the team player that he was in SD and that he's proven to be here in CHI. Man, it must be the easiest thing in the world for Peavy to be a good teammate. He's never with the team, and all he has to do is say how much he really, really, really, really, really, really, really wants to help the team. I'll do anything to help this team win, except stay healthy and, you know, physically help this team win games.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 02:15 PM) There's been a Helluva lot more talk from the people complaining about him than there has been from him. LOL, I love this. Once people have legitimate things to complain about and there's no defending it, it's suddenly the complaining posters that are targeted.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 01:22 PM) And like I said, it's fine to complain about all that. But all the guy said was that he would be willing to come back in any capacity the club thought would be best. And he got jumped on and told to just go away. At what point does it become b****ing just to b****? I'm tired of hearing from him, period. Shut the f*** up and pitch, or go away. It's been all talk and no results with this guy since we traded for him two years ago.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 01:21 PM) Juan Pierre would clear waivers because any team that claimed him would be on the hook for his full remaining contract for this season (something about $5 million for the next 3 months). The White Sox at least have the Dodgers helping pay for a portion of his salary this year. Haha, well there you go.

QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 01:16 PM) I don't think Juan would clear waivers. There are a handful of teams that could use him...especially as a 4th OFer. How much money does Pierre still have for the rest of this year? If a team claimed him, wouldn't they have to pay him that amount? Whatever it is, I doubt a team would be willing to pay a 4th OF the amount he'll be receiving.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 12:51 PM) Depends on your definition of "Necessary". Let's just say that we wouldn't be having this discussion at all if it weren't for Peavy getting hurt all of the time. So if it's unfair how we treat him on Soxtalk, I'm sure Peavy will find solace in the millions of dollars he's basically stealing from the organization.

I refuse to vote, as the correct answer is that they probably deserve equal blame. In fact, I'd choose Jerry Reinsdorf if I could pick just one person. This whole situation is due to KW's lack of power over Ozzie, and that is directly on JR. QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 12:33 PM) Cause people didn't know that he was bad defensively. He also was supposed to be a lefty masher, which is something we've lacked lately from our outfielders. Yes, the guy had experience playing all three outfield positions and does indeed have speed. Lillibridge has obviously worked out incredibly well, though.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 10:27 AM) This is thing that drives me crazy about Soxtalk. One day Peavy is an asshole for pushing himself too hard. The very next week when he offers to do something to try to help the team, and put himself in a situation to save himself a little more, he gets taken apart. This is the thing that drives me crazy about Jake Peavy. He is never healthy and, thus, causes all of this discussion to become necessary.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 10:07 AM) I think he probably is just as frustrated as anyone. He probably feels like he is letting down the Club and the fans. I know most athletes wouldn't care, but I think some of them feel like real douchebags if they're making a ton of money and not backing it up on the field. It's just not good for anyone when that happens. Because he is. There's no two ways about it.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 07:49 AM) I don't get what is so wrong about this and why people are so upset with Jake. He is clearly dying to help the team in any capacity that he can. He wants to win and he wants to be a part of it, that much is evident. Is putting him in the bullpen the wisest decision? I'd say probably not. But it's hard for me to fault the guy for willing to perform in whatever capacity the club deems fit. Most pitchers would never offer to go to the bullpen no matter what. Complain all you want about his propensity to get injured (and it's a legitimate complaint), but at least to me there is nothing to say badly about his character. I really have no problem with him saying this at all. As Balta said, people get so upset because of his complete inability to stay healthy. It's great that he has a "bulldog" mentality and that he'd trade all of the sunshine and lollipops in the world to help the team, but he doesn't. He's just a massive waste of money, years, and a roster spot. Sure, he didn't ask to be born as frail as a leprous hemophiliac, but he is and it's tiring.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 15, 2011 -> 07:24 AM) I just hope this isn't an admission from Jake that he himself isn't sure he can stay healthy as a starter... The problem with moving someone else to the bullpen in favor of Jake is that when he hurts himself again, you're going to have to move that bullpen pitcher back into the rotation again. Not a good idea to be bouncing someone back and forth like that. Which means you basically have to put Jake there or stick with a 6 man rotation when Jake gets back. For this reason, Fathom makes a really good point about whether or not JP actually helps us by being healthy at all. Exactly. As much as I want to like Peavy, I just want him to go away. Retire or something, I don't know. Just stop wasting our time and maybe give us back some of that money? Thanks.