WCSox

QUOTE(bad at best @ Jul 30, 2007 -> 01:20 PM) If Tony came would Hawk leave? I don't know, but I'll bet that Coop would. Hasn't Dave Duncan been Tony's right-hand man for some time now?

QUOTE(winninguglyin83 @ Jul 29, 2007 -> 03:51 AM) most people think this is the end of LaRussa in St. Louis. JR knows the biggest mistake he made was listening to hawk and firing Tony in 1986. doubt it will happen, but I can understand why it is a rumor. I doubt it will happen as well, given that Tony is just a season removed from capturing a WS title with what was arguably the least-talented team to ever win a WS.

QUOTE(kwolf68 @ Jul 30, 2007 -> 08:05 AM) Unless we have some deal worked out for a RF (Quentin, Ethier) then that wouldn't be the worst move one could make. It would if KW gives Dye a multi-year deal. He's going to command at least 3/24 and possibly more and turns 34 in January. I'd love to have JD for one more year, but I doubt that he accepts arbitration.

QUOTE(Yossarian @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 03:59 PM) At least you didn't call him crap. If he's crap what is Uribe? Cintron? Toby Hall? Mack in CF? BA at the plate this year and last? You're right, he's a mediocre 2B with rapidly-declining defensive skills, a .722 OPS, few stolen bases, no more power, and is owed $1.2 million over the remaining two months of his contract. Players with such a skill set and contractual situation have a market value of "crap."

QUOTE(Yossarian @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 01:35 PM) That's the way I see it too, but we're apparently deeply in the minority here. It amazes me how Sox fans eat their own, as soon as they're no longer one of their own. It amazes me how some Sox fans expected the Sox to get anything other than crap in return for crap. QUOTE(iamshack @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 01:42 PM) You cannot ignore the turn the market has taken. You cannot judge Kenny's trades at this moment on what he or other GM's could have gotten in past years. That's comparing apples to oranges. Especially considering that the Rangers just got the same low-level crap for Lofton, who is having a much better year than Gooch.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 11:52 AM) He's been much better since the ASB. How many teams can pull up a second baseman with a .381 OBP? That's a .340 OBP. Agree that he's been better since the ASB, though. Still, he's not worth much. His OBP and SB numbers aren't high enough to play him in the two-hole anymore. And his .382 SLG and regressing defense don't add much to his value, either. Since they couldn't have gotten draft picks for him, I'm more than happy to see Richar get some playing time and $1.2 million saved.

QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 10:08 AM) Give him a break, Bro. I find his fanboy devotion to the team he grew up on refreshing. Always have. +1 Congrats to the Buehrle family!

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 09:53 AM) I think that basically the trade was made to dump someone and make it look like we are really making some moves here. Iguchi was a good player for the Sox and should have brought more than a class A level player in return. Iguchi has $1.2 million remaining on his contract and has a .722 OPS this year. Most teams could pull up somebody from their farm system and see little difference in production.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 02:50 PM) im not disagreeing or doubting you, im just wondering why he couldnt have been offered arb....i quite frankly am far from an expert on the entire matter and have always been cloudy on offering arbitration to upcoming FA and how that all works Given that Iguchi made $3.25 million this year, arbitration would mean at least $3.5 million next year. Why pay a declining player that much when you have Richar ready to go?

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 02:36 PM) You mean we didn't get back Howard in the deal? LAME..... I don't know what most expected. Would have been nice to get something a little more exciting, but the price for an mediocre hitting, declining defense and 32 year old 2b is not great. Wrong. The correct answer is: Kenny's a big dummy poopy-head. Come on, man, get with the program!

QUOTE(frankie5angels @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 02:27 PM) I don't see a problem at all with this trade. Iguchi was looking bad this year both offensively and defensivly. KW got what he could for him. So now let's see what Richar can do for the next 2 months at 2nd, and hopefully this Dubee can develop and help us in the future. I just wish they could have talked the Phillies into taking Jose off our hands. Wow, another intelligent voice! Welcome to Soxtalk.

QUOTE(WhiteSoxfan1986 @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 04:25 PM) http://uncutvideo.aol.com/videos/a1dc3e542...cad346ce73652ae Here it is.

Thanks for '05 and '06, Gooch. Now let's see what Richar can do...

Well, I'm glad that they're getting SOMETHING for him.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 01:11 PM) So considering that Jerry Reinsdorf and the current ownership group is simply not going anywhere, what would you suggest is the next best option? Let me guess: Fire Kenny Williams?

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 12:47 PM) Oh yeah. That's what I was talking about. Also: KW > Beane and KW = Theo and KW = Schuerholz. PV = nRT E = E(0) - RT/nF(ln K)

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 12:41 PM) No results? Apparently winning seasons, division titles, and even championships don't count.

QUOTE(SoxFan77 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 12:21 PM) Wow, you just throw anything out there to make it seem like KW is a God.. Uh, I was talking about Gil Meche, not Kenny Williams. Try paying closer attention next time.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 11:52 AM) I don't think I'd have given him such a deal but it's turned out well so far, and I kindly defer to Moore as he rebuilds that entire organization. Meche's ERA (3.76) seems awfully low for a guy with a 1.30 WHIP. And I'd say that the latter is more telling of how good a pitcher he really is. Geez, even Jose and Freddy let fewer guys on base last year. I'm wondering how much KC's relatively good bullpen has been keeping that ERA down. It seems like a lot of inherited base runners aren't crossing the plate.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 11:38 AM) Meche's career has always been plagued by injuries, which has been his problem and resulted in inconsistencies moreso than his talent. All the more reason to not give him $55 million, especially when he isn't the "missing piece" to a World Series-caliber rotation.

QUOTE(hitlesswonder @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 11:27 AM) I don't think you're necessarily referring to me, but I tried to be clear that I'm not raking KW over the coals. You're correct that I was not referring to you.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 11:27 AM) There are big differences. Buehrle wanted to stay and is known as a very good pitcher. Meche has always had potential but the Royal (ex-Brave) scouts said, "Meche is good. No one else knows it. Let's get him!" Meche was shrewd. Buehrle was fortunate. KW gets credit from me for Buehrle, but not much. I doubt Meche goes back to being bad next year. He's a good pitcher who's finally found it in KC with Moore. As all the scouts said while the pundits laughed. Meche is a 29-year-old, seven-year vet with a career 4.52 ERA. For the sake of Royals fans, I hope that you're right. But I don't think that you are.

QUOTE(hitlesswonder @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 11:09 AM) I thought signing Meche was silly. Right now, Moore looks quite a bit smarter than me.... It might not look so much smart when Meche reverts to his career-average numbers next year. Not that I think that KW is necessarily a better GM than Moore, but I find it odd that the guy who paid Gil Meche $55 million is being touted as the next big thing, while the guy who got Mark Buehrle for $56 million is getting raked over the coals.

QUOTE(SoxFan77 @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 10:55 AM) Don't tell me you think a farm system is a quick fix? I'm not sure what you're talking about, but my point was that Moore wouldn't have given Meche $55 million if he had anything decent coming up through his farm system in the immediate future.

QUOTE(Cerbaho-WG @ Jul 27, 2007 -> 10:29 AM) For anyone thinking that the Royals will not be occupying the cellar for the next several years at least, please mention to me one pitching prospect in their farm system outside of Hochevar who could make an impact in the next two years. Moore is going to have to either overpay once again for a free agent pitcher and hope to get lucky (Meche) or pull off some low level moves for back of the rotation starters (Bannister). They'll finish the season probably around 25 games under .500 and that's considered improvement by them. The fact that Moore paid Gil Freaking Meche $55 million speaks volumes about the level of pitching talent in their farm system.