Dick Allen

I think its catching them at the right time, although the Yankees had their top 3 pitchers going and were very lucky the Sox didn't sweep them. Of course they swept the Sox in NY. Boston is really hurting without Varitek and Mirabelli, and Papplebon has imploded recently. They should be stablizing soon. If the Sox can get through the next road trip in good shape, they should be in outstanding position. Minnesota is a scary team. Hopefully they choose to be extra cautious with Liriano, and sit him for a long while.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 03:44 PM) Nope. His first name is Joe. No offense, but you don't know what a bad rep is until you get my guy.

QUOTE(Beltin @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 03:36 PM) The White Sox had Konerko, Thomas, Ordonez, and Lee all in a row from 2000-2004 and could not win a title. I am not disputing the impact Thome has had on the lineup from Iguchi to Crede/Pierzynski. I also agree that Anderson is/will be a better center fielder than Rowand. I am talking about balance. I will take a little less defense out of Rowand coupled with his bat in the 7 or 8 hole versus Anderson's defense coupled with his big looping swing and .205 average. Konerko can not DH once in a while because the choices for a backup at 1st base are Gload, Mackowiak and Thome. Gload is a pariah on this board 99% of the time, Mackowiak has played only a handful of games at first, and Thome is too fragile and valuable to risk injury in the field. The Sox have no legitimate backup defense in the outfield no matter how good Mack and Pablo are when they are on a hot streak. The 2005 White Sox won the title not because of monster production in the middle of the lineup. The did it through pitching, defense, and teamwork. Thome can hit 60 home runs and have 185 RBI but he can be streaky, strikes out a lot, and most importantly can not play defense. If you can eliminate the need for Gload, you can save a lot of the runs that Mackowiak surrendered with his rotten glove in the 7-9 innings this year. Anderson could still be on this team in Mackowiak's current roll of part time starter. You pick your spots and allow the regulars to rest while Anderson can develop against some of the less stingy arms in the league. Meanwhile, he can always come in late to help preserve a lead. It is all hindsight, but as much as the starting pitchers and Ozzie deserve some blame for the team struggles, so does the defense for not backing them up. Just remember, the Yankees line-up is stacked and has not won a world series since the days of Brosius, O'Neil, Williams, and Martinez. The White Sox may be unbalanced as far as having Anderson and Uribe at the bottom of the order, but they still lead the league in runs scored. The problem is the pitching. The Sox have gone 5-26 in games in which they have scored 3 or fewer runs. While a good record in that situation is nearly impossible, only 5 wins is the alarming part. They also have lost 11 games in which they have scored 6 or more runs. Brian Anderson and Juan Uribe, although they have been less than stellar at the plate, are not the reason the White Sox are miles behind Detroit and now in 3rd place in the Central. The blame goes to the pitchers. Buerhle, Garcia, Garland for a while, Vazquez, Politte. If these guys gave you what the White Sox had projected for them, Detroit would be looking up at the White Sox right now. No question about it. You can have the greatest offense in the world, but if your pitching is poor, you may have a decent record, but you won't be hoisting any trophies in October. KW will learn something from this season, no matter what happens, and I think you will see him aggressively improve his pitching staff this winter. Its not going to be sign 8 minor league free agents and hope one works out again.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 03:20 PM) Our ticket rep is alright. Nothing wrong. But nothing great, either - never heard from the guy, except the blanket emails about game time changes. And he doesn't return out emails, more often than not. Actually, he's not very good. Is it cool to name names in this thread? Not sure if that is a good idea. I'm guessing he shares a first name with a off color comedian with the last name of Rock.

QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 03:13 PM) His away splits are atrocious. 1 HR and 7 RBIs AVG/OBP/OPS 204/292/588 And thats with him getting 3 RBI on the last roadtrip. He and Carlos Zambrano were tied in road homers and RBI until last roadtrip. Zambrano only needed 16 ABs though.

QUOTE(Beltin @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 02:54 PM) Thanks. I forgot that Philly picked up a good chunk of Thome's contract. I think Thome's overall numbers are going to be more impressive than Overbay at the end of the season. However, I have watched Overbay in the past and seen how he has improved each year. His power numbers are decent. He plays a pretty good first base. He is also left handed but makes contact more consistently than Thome. To me he seems more of a pure hitter than big Jim. He also seems to spread his productivity out very nicely over the course of the season. Without going overboard, he has impressed me in the past and from what I have seen in limited games against the Sox, has done very well in his first AL season. Let's throw out Thome versus Overbay comparisons, though. My bigger point was not whether one was better than the other. I was thinking more about residuals and team balance. Thome's presence improves the lineup from 2 through 7 considerably. He is also a great character guy to have in the clubhouse. Finally, individually he is a monster at the plate. On the down side, his presence in the lineup has thrown the balance way off at the bottom of the order. Anderson's inexperience has not only hurt his spot in the lineup, but it probably has also taken it's toll on the quality pitches seen by Uribe and Podsednik. Further, too many boppers in a White Sox lineup has turned the bottom half of the order into a bunch of spectators and mimics. They are either waiting for the big guys to knock one to the concourse, or are trying to join the party and swinging for the fences themselves. Now, if you have an Overbay, you trade a fair amount in slugging percentage (versus Thome) for more singles and doubles. However, he is still lefthanded and you also add versatility by having a guy that can play first base to give Paulie a bit of a rest. Meanwhile, I do not know about Overbay's character but Rowand's is unquestioned. You keep the three stooges together and let them take Anderson under their wing. Chemistry may be overrated, but Rowand personified the 2005 White Sox in many ways, even if he was not a superstar. Finally, by keeping Rowand and picking up Overbay, you can free up a valuable roster spot as Ross Glaod is no longer needed. You can still acquire Mackowiak and Cintron but then find a speedy defensive replacement outfielder that is a little more reliable for a pinch hit situation than Willie Harris was in 2005. So effectively, you trade Gload for Overbay rather than Rowand for Thome and may never have to use Ozuna in LF. You also probably do not have to give up nearly as much talent on the prospect side. In return you have a more versatile team with less offensive pop but a lot more balance and far better outfield defense. Despite his shortcomings, I would still take Rowand's offensive numbers over Anderson, especially considering BA's strikeout totals. I also like the idea of BA being a late inning replacement for Podsednik. Guillen may frustrate us with his decisions sometimes but he has had a knack in the past for setting guys up to succeed. He has not had that luxury with Anderson this year. As a result, not only has the bottom of the order been brutal but so has the defense at times. A late inning rally when the Sox are down a run or two results in a Mackowiak pinch hit situation rather than taking your chances with Rowand had he not been traded. Now, Mack may or may not get the hit and then you are stuck with him in center field for 2 or 3 innings. Meanwhile, any time your outfield needs a rest you have Mackowiak in center or Ozuna in left rather than Anderson being the backup. The result has been a lot of balls finding holes rather than Rowand's or Anderson's glove. If you have a Brian Anderson available, you would have a very solid late-inning outfield defense with BA in left, A-Row in center and JD in right. That is solid from both a range/read standpoint but also improves the White Sox chances at throwing a runner out at home every once in a while. I can not remember one outfield assist this year. I know the ultimate argument will be that the 2006 White Sox are struggling because their pitching has been inconsistent to poor. I agree with that to a point. However, good pitching is very much bolstered by good defense. That is not just measurable in routine plays but also highlights. If errors give a team 4 outs an inning, then highlight plays give them 2 outs. That eases stress on the pitching staff and frustrates the opponent to the point of pressing. That ends my argument of how Lyle Overbay could have saved the Sox this season. If only KW had called me. While the defense has been poorer this year than last, Rowand is not an upgrade defensively from Anderson, and Overbay would not play first base enough to make a difference. You don't improve the defense with acquiring Overbay and retaining Rowand, in fact it even goes down a bit. Offensively, maybe at the bottom of your order you get a little improvement, but not enough to offset the huge loss of not having Thome in the lineup. Thome obviously has more homers than Overbay. In fact he has more than Overbay and Rowand combined. He also gets on base a ton more than either do. Thome's contribution to the White Sox can also be seen in Jermaine Dye's numbers, and maybe even Crede's and AJs. He alone changed this team from a very average offensive team with power, to a powerhouse line-up, and perhaps the best offense in baseball even when they have a CF who hasn't hit sour apples, and a lead-off man that has looked lost for a good portion of the season.

QUOTE(Beltin @ Aug 10, 2006 -> 01:16 PM) Gonna add something stupid that I will get beat up for.... Last offseason when everyone got all excited about picking up Jim Thome, I thought, "Wasn't Lyle Overbay available?" Thome kicked ass early in the season but from July on he has been frustrating to watch. He also can not play any position other than DH. What's my point? Toronto got Overbay for a song. Look at his numbers right now (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=4598). He is not a monster like Thome, but his strikout totals are far fewer. He is also way cheaper and would not have cost us the players we gave up to get Thome, particularly Mr. Rowand. I have heard how poor a hitter Rowand was and how he misjudged fly balls sometimes. But if you could have kept Rowand in center, had Overbay and Konerko to share first base and DH duties, thus eliminating the need for Ross Gload and then either had Brian Anderson available to be the 4th outfielder or had the extra money for a quality reserve outfielder, would you do it? Many will say no. Just remember, Kenny's success is usually when he does not go for the big name trade. Last year's success was built on the backs of guys like Iguchi, Dye, Contreras, and Pierzynski. Without those guys this year would be a disaster, too. I wish Kenny would look at the champions of the past and see that too many slugging superstars does not equate to a title. It worked in Boston but their lineup was still far more balanced that what the White Sox have now. Rather than pushing Sox toward more versatility iwth extra speed and defense, he took a big gamble that the addition of Thome would make up for the loss of Rowand and the risk of a rookie center fielder. His OPS has been over 1.000 every month except June when it was in the high .800s. If you read this board, you would think he's in a slump but his OPS this month is OVER 1.400. He's hitting .300 has an OBP of .420 and is still on pace to hit around 50 homers which would be a White Sox team record. How in the hell can anyone not be estatic with Jim Thome's performance this season? Frankly, if he keeps it up, it will be one of the greatest offensive performances in team history. If Jim Thome is a problem, the White Sox should have about 5 total losses this year.

Daryl Boston dove into the LF line stands and made a sensational catch several years ago. It was one of the greatest catches of all time, and the only reason it wouldn't make it is if they don't have footage of it. For a little humor, they should show the ball that bounced off Ron LeFlore's head that knocked him silly and went for a 4 base error.

Vazquez will make a lot of amends with me if he pitches well tonight. Another mediocre start by him in a big game, and I think it will be pretty obvious what he really is. Mussina has had a good year, but he can be had, and the White Sox do have a nice offense. This is a big game, the Sox don't want to fall to 1-3 on the homestand with the Tigers coming in. A win here, and a nice weekend could be the beginning of a nice streak. Prove me wrong Javy and step up and shut the Yankees down.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:31 PM) Garland on the PFB show was talking about the humidity and the weather helping the ball carry. One question, isnt he a sinkerball pitcher. Brandon Webb can come into a game and keep the ball in the park, because he uses his turbo sinker. When you have a sinker use it. Garland gets hurt more on leaving his changeup up than any other pitch. We are in Felix Diaz/Danny Wright/Jason Grilli/Arnie Munoz territory right now with our starting pitching. Our team is now ranked 9th in the AL in pitching. We are just ahead of Cleveland and Toronto. Weather, QuesTec and umpires, doesn't the opposing pitcher have to overcome these "obstacles" as well? Its time for the excuses to stop, and the performances improve.

QUOTE(DABearSoX @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:26 PM) well i thought maybe if we could have pulled that out our season would be going in a different direction....now were in 3rd. If you would have told me at the begining of the season this team would be in 3rd place at some point i would have laughed very hard. I am not gonna give up on this team, we have all been in this situation before, its just different now after last season......God do I wish we were in the NL...haha not really but come on, 66-46 record and we are in third place...this might have to go as the most frustrating year I have ever been through.... Liriano getting hurt might be our savior The fact that the Twins and KW actually discussed Torii Hunter coming to the White Sox shows how far the Twins have come to pass the White Sox. I still think the Sox will finish ahead of them if Liriano is down for any length of time, but Radke has picked it up lately and Santana is still nails. This kid they just called up, Garza, I believe,is supposed to be something, hopefully he performs like Liriano did last season.

QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:23 PM) Here's what I've noticed about our starters. If you're patient enough against them, they're going to have an inning where they implode and lose their focus. Our starters don't have the greatest stuff on the planet (Vaz has above average stuff, and Contreras does sometimes), and they become very wild in the strike zone. It's one of the main reasons why I think we have 3 wins this year when we score 3 runs or less. We probably had like 20 last year. Its 5-26 scoring 3 runs or less, and now 11 loses scoring 6 runs or more.

QUOTE(Dan Pasqua @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:23 PM) First of all, I dont know what that first part of your post means But 3 out of 34 homers doesnt sound too convincing. Secondly, if you have to go back to April before you can remember a time where he came through for us in the clutch, there is a problem there. And hes hasd plenty of opportunities Its a higher percentage than Frank Thomas' career clutch homers vs. career homers, and his stats are still updated almost daily on this site. Thome is having a great year, and has had his share of clutch hits. He didn't get Rivera tonight. Guess what? Not a lot of people do. He's going to the Hall of Fame.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:16 PM) Good call Tito, that's 2 game winning HRs (non walkoffs) right there that he's had this year, both of which were in huge clutch situations and agianst good teams (Twins, Cards). Didn't Thome also have big pinch hit homers against the Cubs on that Saturday game when AJ went deep in the 9th to win it, and against the Reds?

QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:09 PM) Well, the PFB told me that it's not a problem that Buehrle allowed 3 homers, since they were all solo. Its unbelievable to me how poorly you can pitch wearing a White Sox uniform and still be praised these days.

QUOTE(TitoMB345 @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 11:06 PM) Thats what I don't get. We list McCarthy as untouchable, and there is no way we trade him, but we use him out of position all year, when he could be easily hold his own in the rotation. It just makes zero sense. And next year when he's in the rotation, he'll probably be gassed by August because of his limited use this season.

If the starter has given up 3 homers, and you are going to take him out if he gives up a hit, and its the 7th inning, why bother waiting for the runner to reach? The thing is Ozzie most likely had given up on the game by that point.

QUOTE(ceffa2000 @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 10:58 PM) Would you say that he was playing for the playoffs last night, using Jenks for 2-2/3 innings? I think he does think about it. It just comes down to our starters not performing. We can't expect to score 6-9 runs a game every game. That's the problem. The starters are not performing, but our manager insists on extending them game after game after game, and it almost always results in more runs scored for the opposition.

QUOTE(Felix @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 10:54 PM) Ozzie kept him in to save his bullpen, which has already been used a lot on streak of 24 consecutive games in 24 days. He wanted to get more out of him to save the pen some work, but it didn't work out. I can't blame Ozzie for that. The White Sox bullpen has been used less than ANY bullpen in baseball. Leaving Garland in to give up another hit, and then yanking him saves the bullpen exactly NOTHING. They still have to get the same amount of outs. Its time Ozzie stops thinking about saving his underused bullpen, and start thinking about saving the White Sox playoff chances. If the bullpen needs help, get another reliever and either tell Gload or Pablo or whoever see you later.

QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 10:45 PM) He has no business getting thrown out there for the start of the 7th with over 100 pitches already. Then Ozzie decides to pitch to Ghey-Rod with 1st base open. Ozzie is really grinding my gears. Why pitch to ARod with the infield in? He had the infield back for Abreu. He could have walked ARod and set up for a DP with a great DP candidate in Posada. Unfortunately Ozzie's strategy is questionable, unless you drank too much of the Kool Aid last season and think he does no wrong.

Garland is going to have his share of starts where he s***s the bed. Unfortunately it happened tonight. He was close to weaseling out of some runs but the homers killed him.

QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 10:36 PM) Not according to Bill Melton on the post game show. Melton's nuts and gets a White Sox paycheck. That ball was clearly not going to be caught, in fact it looked like a homer from the club level.

Well, one thing is sure for me. No matter how obvious it is the Sox need a different LF, we aren't going to see anyone new until Sept. call-ups or 2007. I also don't understand bringing Garland back for a batter in the 7th. That cost another run. Evidently Ozzie has a rule that the last batter the starter faces must reach base.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Aug 9, 2006 -> 10:35 PM) Well, there is one reasonable option out there... Jose Cruz Jr. Of course, that'd mean that one of Gload or Ozuna would have to go. BTW -- the culprit of that 7th inning rally, which was killed, was AJ. 2-1 pitch, Villone had just thrown six of seven balls, and that pitch was several inches inside. AJ has been great this year, but man... he doesn't see a whole lot of pitches that he doesn't like. Its Paulie getting 1 base on a double clearly over the RF's head. It wasn't close.

But who would lead off? We need someone to strikeout at the alarming clip Pods is whiffing at now.l