Dick Allen

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 09:07 AM) The quotation was always about a younger, in the very beginning of his prime ace...at least the Tanaka example. Abreu was at that similar age, 26/27. Upton is the closest to that description. Long term solution to one of their needs. A 4 or 5 year solution some would consider long term. There was no age bracket mentioned. The money is obviously available.

This is the article where the Sox lost out on Tanaka with the pit $100 million bid plus $20 million posting fee. The last paragraph Hahn has a quote, saying that money will be there for the right piece. http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/print...ws&c_id=cws

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 08:51 AM) Announcing an official intended budget would kind of be counterproductive...we can do it fairly closely looking at attendance, projected season ticket sales, profit/loss in the prior year and following all the Forbes numbers cumulatively. Can you provide links to projected season ticket sales, and the 2015 P&L? You have no idea what the budget it. No one here does. And if you are following Forbes numbers you will have to conclude they are sitting on a pile of cash.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 08:34 AM) The problem is the White Sox would be $30-35 million over their supposed budget this year...that big a jump would be unprecedented without following playoffs or competitive seasons. Next year, less of an issue. Essentially it's deliberately spending into a loss for at least one year or more if it backfires..for a payoff more likely in 2017 and 18. What have the White Sox publicly announced as their 2016 payroll budget? And how is saying it is a big problem when in another thread you said they should sign Latos, Desmond, and Parra for $30 million ? Just try once to be consistent.

Apparently these guys aren't getting offered anything if the White Wox have been mentioned as favorites to sign them but are only offering 3 years or less. Negotiating is a game. We should see what ultimately happens before the hopes drain. There is a lot of bad information out there, some made up by attention mongers and some thrown out there by teams and agents. Maybe this piece was thrown out their by an agent trying to get other teams offering more than 3 years.

QUOTE (blackmooncreeping @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 04:48 PM) If he can hit .270, with 15 bombs and around 70 rbi, then he's earning his salary. Anyone expecting more than that will be disappointed, but that's on them for having unrealistic expectations. The 3 seasons prior that he had been healthy, he had at least an .800 OPS. Maybe there was help, but he put one up after he was busted. He has more .800 OPS seasons the last 4 years than Cespedes.

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 04:22 PM) I've read a lot of posts on here during the offseason speak about Melky Cabrera like he had an awful year and they expect a big rebound in '16. Or that we should find a way to get rid of him in the same sense we need to get rid of Laroche. I've kind of been wondering why so many people think his 2015 was so bad, and I'm curious what they expected. Perhaps that line of thought is fueled by the dichotomy of his 1st and 2nd half last year, but I don't think he finished much differently than I expected when we signed him. Perhaps a little worse, but nothing too significant. Stat: 2015/Career Average AVE: .273/.285 OBP: .314/.336 OPS: .709/.748 HR: 12/12 (Rate based career AB/HR with 629 ABs) RBIs: 77/75 (Rate based career AB/RBI with 629 ABs) Obviously this isn't close to his monster, yet suspension shortened 2012 numbers, but we clearly didn't expect to see those 2012 numbers. Are people expecting him to be something more than a 15 HR .280 hitter from a 1 time all star?? His problem was he started out so slowly without power. I think he puts up better numbers with the improved offense. His defense wasn't good, but he did throw.a lot of guys out and didn't throw to the wrong base all the time.

QUOTE (soxfan49 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 04:03 PM) But the question is: why? The Bears are a middle of the pack offense Not many jobs will be open and I'd much rather have Shula, Payton or Hue Jackson. Hell, I don't even think I'd want him over Fangio Considering how many players they were without, middle of the pack is an accomplishment..

QUOTE (blackmooncreeping @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 03:02 PM) Bartolo Colon begs to differ I don't know, his time down to 1B was over 7 seconds.

If paying Mat Latos $10-12 million is a market inefficiency, the White Sox are going to need a ton more revenue.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:32 PM) And specifically saying he wanted to play with the Cubs' young core and Maddon as opposed to a theoretically better deal in terms of total guaranteed dollars from the Cards. What would you expect him to say at a Cubs news conference? Do players say I really wish I wasn't taking this $184 million?

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:30 PM) Correct, but the point was he didn't take the most money available. He signed to contract for other reasons than the biggest contract. He signed it with the possibility of more money later, hopefully. Yes. But do you really think if there was no opt out he would have taken $16 million less for 8 years?

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:23 PM) So, in other words, he signed this deal due to the opt outs not the most money in the deal. He signed it with the possibility of more money later not more money now. Isn't his average about $28 million the first 3 years? Then he could opt out. He is risking about $16 million with a chance to make a lot more. If he is great, Theo probably lets him walk, and gets 3 prime years out of him, and doesn't have to pay for the decline. I still think he is going to start hitting homers, but his defense will fall off a bit. 245 pound guys legs don't age all that well IMO.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:22 PM) Finished? That was constructive. How about you come up with a back-up plan for when/if the Big 3 fall through for $30 million. You sure enjoy being sarcastic but never provide anything other than general platitudes, lectures or generic comments such as it would be nice to get Gordon or Cespedes. Quite insightful. And when have Boras clients not gone on the open market and signed hometown discounts, by the way? I just hope someone keeps a list of all your recommendations. Latos, Desmond, Duensing, Parra. You name enough crappy players one is bound to hit for you and you can remind us all summer. I have already said what I would do. With names. And as stated, the Royals, if they can't afford Gordon now, are screwed. They should start rebuilding immediately.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:21 PM) Weren't there reports that he was offered 200 million by other teams? By his own admission during interviews, he was offered more money elsewhere. He did not however specify the amount. Technically he was, but without the opt outs when he gets his money the first 3 years and then signs another huge contract.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:17 PM) According to all media accounts, he was offered more money elsewhere. If this is true then there were others things that played into signing the contract with the cubs. Overall, but with the opt outs, if he is any good, he will make more. The players association doesn't like players, especially the really big names taking discounts. That is why I doubt Gordon would go back to the Royals if their offer is significantly less than any other team. A slight discount is fine, but a large one would be a no no.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:08 PM) So you're 100% confident Johnson and Saladino will keep their spots all season long then? And you're 100% confident Latos would be good in the AL, Parra's fall off in Baltimore was just a mirage, and Desmond will be one of the first players to sign in June and live up to his contract. $28 million, which as pointed out would be very low, 100% confident. Maybe that is what the Royals will do, and they will start selling off parts at the deadline. If they can't offer Gordon market rate after 2 WS appearances, they will be totally screwed if they don't make the playoffs and get that additional revenue. No way those remaining sign extensions, and I'm sure the great leader Sal Perez is still a little miffed the Royals didn't do what you told us they would do, rip up his contract and give him something more appropriate for one of the greatest leaders of all time.

He strikes out a lot anyway. Open him up, change his swing plane and have him try to hit the ball 600 feet every AB. Maybe a different set up gets him a different look at pitches, and he could actually swing at something he could hit hard. Longshot I know, but staying the course isn't working.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 01:14 PM) The example really doesnt apply as Laroche is a very accomplished MLB player who had a bad year. He was never a failed AAAA player. Laroche is going to go one of two ways, he either his skills have eroded from age, or he will rebound from a bad year. I thought we were talking Garcia.

Gavin Floyd to me is the starter version of Jesse Crain. The setback is coming, but spring training fluff would make it seem like he could win 15. It wouldn't cost anything, so I wouldn't be surprised it happened, but would be very surprised anything really came of it.

QUOTE (jasonxctf @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 12:08 PM) 2013 Kepplinger Backup Catcher (when they were carrying 3) Jordan Danks Semien 2014 Semien Konerko Sierra Danks Backup Catcher (when they were carrying 3) I also disagree with the concern about using your backup catcher. If it's the 7th/8th/9th and and you are pinch hitting your DH, what's the risk? So your starting catcher gets hurt in the 2 innings or extra innings, you have to move your now DH to C and then your pitcher has to hit going forward? If you are already losing, why not create the problem? Then you would be stuck with Tyler Flowers hitting with no pinch hitter. I am sure if Soto struck out in the 8th and Flowers came up in the 9th with the tying run on 3rd and winning run at second, and hit, Ventura would be a fool. Again, he isn't unique not using catchers as DHs and PHs if there aren't 3 guys capable of catching on the roster.

Hahn and JR are pretty good at negotiating contracts. Better than most. They are going to have to go to somewhere unprecedented, but they knew this day would come. Hahn even said when they lost out on Tanaka that the money would be there for the right guy.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 11:51 AM) He doesn't platoon for the purpose of real platooning at all. so the only evidence i can provide is pinch hitting and pinch running. Evidence which is, predictably, ignored. Now the CW is that Soto with his .780 OPS against lefties is no good. Why wouldn't you play a 2nd catcher at another position? To protect against the slight chance that the starting catcher is injured? So you put yourself at a disadvantage game after game, to protect the one game where the starting catcher may get hurt? And the groupthink keeps rolling on. Wasn't Robin among the leaders in using pinch hitters? I think he was. According to Bill James his 118 pinch hitters was above average, and considering he doesn't have pitchers hitting, although I will give you he had some hitters hit like pitchers, that shows, that once again, your issues with Robbie are pure fiction.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 11:24 AM) You have yet to come up with one legitimate example where Robin failed to platoon correctly. And when he did platoon Trayce Thompson to what seemed like perfection, he was a fool for not throwing him to the wolves right away. Of course he was also a fool for throwing Rodon to the wolves right away.

QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 11:01 AM) The Heyward signing was thought to be the first domino, but I believe that the structure of his contract with the opt out slowed things down. These guys may be looking for a similar option...especially Upton because of his age. Also, as someone else mentioned, there aren't a ton of teams lining up to get these guys. There are probably only a half dozen teams that are really serious about them. I know we're all anxious for a signing, but it's looking more and more like we'll be waiting another week or so. I just hope that when the dust settles, the Sox will have signed one of the big three. There were big boys like the Cubs, Nationals and Angels in on Heyward, not so much on the others. It depresses their market. If a team offered any of them what was projected in November, they most likely would be signed right now.