harfman77

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 02:16 PM) mine are Carlye and Evaland (sp) Amir Garret is very intriguing to me as a LOOGY. Very athletic, really good fastball, needs to develop more secondary stuff but his offerings show promise.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 11:24 AM) You want to hold on to the money for five more years? Will that money at least gain some interest while the Sox wait for Otani to be posted? Anyway. Anyone know what's up with the link? I clicked it and it would appear the article is gone now. What were Rogers' suggestions? Yes, I think the Sox can sign short term solutions in the meanwhile to hold spots in the rotation until guys like Danish and Beck are ready to contribute and that the large amount of money being tossed at a backend starter would be better invested elsewhere. Something like McCarthy or Masterson on a one or two year deal is just as appealing to me as Maeda.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 10:37 AM) if there is a post of those players who are not protected, pls post. I am really looking at NYM pitchers. Players can still be added to the 40 man roster through the close of business today, after that we will have a much better idea of what will be available, if the Sox have any roster spots to even make it matter.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 10:01 AM) With Dayan, it is all between the ears. If he would ever decide to watch and immitate Jose Abreu in his approach, he'd be one of the better power hitters in the game. He is so naturally strong, and has so much bat speed, he doesn't even have to swing for the LF pole. He hits so much better when he goes with the pitch, it isn't even funny. He could just wear out right and right center, which would make pitchers come back inside to him. Now they just sit away, and he flails at pitches that he can't do anything with on a pull swing. I totally agree, and I am very interested to see how things work out now that Abreu will be spending his first off-season in the States. He has said he wants to be a leader and he appears to have the respect of Viciedo, so hopefully he can help influence Vicideos's approach going forward. QUOTE (shysocks @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 10:14 AM) Jose Bautista only had 600 PA's by age 25; I don't think he's a comp at all. David Ortiz had a career .351 OBP and a 101 wRC+ through age 25; he knew how to hit. Viciedo doesn't, is sitting at a .298 OBP and 95 wRC+, and he's going in the wrong direction. He only had 600 PA's because he struggled with ML pitching. Ortiz had 1200 and at his age 25 season put up a slash line of .234/.324/.475. That line is obviously better than Viciedos this season, however, the entire league was better offensively in 2001 than it is today. I am sure someone here knows where to find the differential factor between 2014 and 2001, but I think when applied, the numbers will not be all that different. I don't think hitting is Viciedos problem either, it is more being disciplined of when not to swing that gets him in trouble.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 09:56 AM) and do you think that is not an excessive amount. pass. Agree, based on the scouting reports I have seen, he has the kind of stuff that will play down in MLB. I think we hold on to the money and roster spot until Shohei Otani is posted. http://www.baseballamerica.com/internation...el-kenta-maeda/

I think people forget how young Viciedo still is, he sure does have room to improve to reach his ceiling. He comps pretty well to how players like Bautista and Ortiz did through their age 25 seasons in a time where offensive production has regressed. There is still so much raw talent in that bat, I would hate to give it up only to see it get put together someplace else. I understand I am in the minority here as many have moved on from Viciedo, but I still have hope that he can put things together. He has shown flashes, periods of time where his bat is dominant, but unforunately not very consistently and not as often as you would like, but I still have hope for him. So that being said, I would need a very interesting return to trade him, not a backup C with no real upside. I would take another change of scenery candidate or quality player that fills a hole along with a low level prospect.

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 20, 2014 -> 09:35 AM) Thompson also already on the 40-man. So if the pool is 3 spots for 5 guys (Montas, Rondon, Saladino, Ravelo, and Smith), I'd have to think Saladino and Smith are the ones left off. Maybe some subtractions later today too. Here's mlbtraderumors link for the all of the teams: http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2014/11/play...n-roster-2.html I think Montas, Saladino, and Rondon get protected. I also think Saladino breaks spring training on the 25 man roster. I think Belly, Carroll, and Mitchell get outrighted.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 19, 2014 -> 12:37 PM) the main thing, if the sox signs Yoan or Ibanez, they are going to get penalize for surpassing the signing limit. are they not? Yes they will. It will be a large upfront investment, but, you gain high level controlled players. Basically you would be buying a top 10 prospect in the case of Moncada and a top 100 prospect in Ibanez. The upfront cost is steep, but if you look at the long term picture, Moncada can fill either or an OF spot or 3B for quite a while and Ibanez gives you depth at 2B with Semien and Sanchez graduated and Johnson not far behind. I think the penalties are worth the players as you cannot typically acquire this type of talent without dumping a major piece from your ML roster.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Nov 19, 2014 -> 08:57 AM) Probably so. There is a large incentive though in doing it DA. If you think the class of talent the following year isn't as good, I think it makes sense to go nuts and then sit out a year. Something I wish the Sox would do. Or if you can sign four years worth of talent in one year, it makes a lot of sense. You are not restricted from signing players in the other years, so you always have talent entering the system but you have top of the line talent entering the system every three years. Granted that the top of the line talent is very far from a sure thing, which is why I would not necessarily endorse that approach for 16 year old kids who spend most of their time showing off in batting practice and drills rather than in games. Some trainers will not let there kids play in games at all and will let scouts make their decisions based only on what they can see in the player showcases. This is different to me because these players, Moncada and Ibanez, have played at a high level and had success both in their professional leagues and internationally. When you read McDaniels article that says Moncada is the most talented player to come from Cuba and that he can handle any position except for SS (though some think he could still stick there) it is a very appealing alternative to me.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 19, 2014 -> 08:27 AM) It's more than two Adolfos, it's like ten or twelve guys, unless you think they'll go bonkers this year and get a bunch of the OTHER top guys too since it's their last chance. They can still sign the 10 or 12 guys, just at $300K each. The Sox signed two guys this year for $900K and $750K respectively, everyone else has been under $300K. The can also double up by grabbing Andy Ibanez who has now defected as well. I used Adolfo as an example of high level players in the market so it would be two years of signing guys like Adolfo or two years of signing guys like Alfaro and Nunez. It is essentially trading four Domincan league players for one (or two) AA players and cash.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 01:04 PM) No, this is exactly what I don't want. Signing one year wonders who are over 30 and have been released a couple of times the last 2 years. Coming into this season, the White Sox didn't think he was worth 1/5 of what they paid Scott Downs or they could have signed him for exactly that. Now he's worth $15 million over 3 years? This is the kind of guy that the Sox bullpen needs though. Another thread talked about leadership, Duke has done it all from a pitching standpoint. As a rookie, he looked like he was going to be the real deal, but eventually bombed as a starter then bombed in his transition to the bullpen, but kept working at it and is now getting some pretty good results. The bullpen is going to be pretty young next year, and someone who has the perspective of handling a lot of adversity can be a good leader for that group. Hes a solid bullpen arm, can go multiple innings if needed, and throws left handed. The contract is not large by the context of what other players have been getting or what I think they will continue to get in FA.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 11:45 AM) Because he'd be more valuable to the White Sox than John Danks. Thats not true. He is a replacement level player that is signed for two years and $36M after Danks contract comes off the books. Danks also plays a position where the Sox should be able to replace him with an internal option about the time his contract expires, until that time he has value as an innings eater. Cy Young he isn't, but he can give you a league average number of quality starts. De Aza makes more sense as a signing than trading anything for Ethier at this point.

Not sure this isn't just smoke to drive up the price for the Mets and make them pull the trigger on a deal the Sox want to get done.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 09:37 AM) It's $56 Million for 3 years, including the $2.5 Million buy out, and the Sox wouldn't lose a draft pick. He has been a very good hitter his whole career until last year. If he can put up his normal numbers, he's a better hitter than Alex Rios, or Melky Cabrera vs. RHP. The buyout only comes into play if the option doesn't vest, since we don't know what it takes for the option to vest, you can't assume he doesn't meet the standards in the contract. He is getting older, he will be 33 when the season starts, and there is no reason to think that last year wasn't the start of his decline as he ages. I would certainly not risk hamstringing the club financially on the chance that last season was a fluke and that he will produce at a high level in his age 33-37 seasons.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 03:08 AM) To follow up on the Ethier specualation: Could the Dodgers be willing to just have someone take him and his contract, with no trade involved. He might be worth the $18 Million per year, for 3 years, if it didn't require giving up a prospect. I'd pay a premium not to have to sign someone to a longer contract than 3 years, especially for a player in his mid 30's. Moreover, we wouldn't lose a draft pick. My biggest concern is whether or not he is good enough to bat in the middle of the lineup, versus RHP. He definitely is not suitable vs. LHP. Against RHP, he has been almost as good as V. Martinez. His career average is over .300, with an OBP of .383 and a Slugging % of over .500. That would work!!! The problem is that he would really need to be platooned. However, the Sox have enough right handed hitters, with whom he could be platooned. That would also give him a little rest, which might help an aging player. It all depends upon whether or not last year was an aberration, or the beginning of a serious decline. No. They are not in any financial hardship and will not give up players of value for only salary relief. You may be able to get them to swap Danks for Ethier as they need someone to fill in the back of their rotation. The $71M he is owed over the next four years is an awful lot of salary to take on for a platoon player at the back end of his career, especially one that hits a replacement level.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 11:58 PM) Sox can't dump Alexei until there's somebody who can play short and not be a black hole at the plate. It's that simple. Sox will be a horrific baseball team if he's replaced right now. Sox have nobody "ready" who can hit or field like him. Sox claim they want to contend. He will NOT be traded. No brainer, just like we weren't getting Victor. 100 percent Lexi stays. He definitely will be traded if Hahn gets more in value in return than he feels Alexei is worth. Semien can play SS for the next couple of seasons until Anderson is ready, Sanchez can play there as well. I doubt any team will offer Hahn enough to get him interested in dealing Alexei, but he is not untouchable by any means.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 06:54 PM) "Leadership" is overrated. Find talented ballplayers and win ball games and the clubhouse figures itself out. I disagree. Leadership is important on ballclubs because things are not always going to go your way and it is good to have someone who has been through it all to help stabilize the emotions in the clubhouse and focus on doing the little things to win games. Someone that will hold teammates accountable for not putting the appropriate work in either during the offseason or in preparation. Successful teams have good leadership.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 09:04 AM) If you are taking on Either's contract, you had better have a damned good reason to do so. Honestly I can't see the Dodgers being willing to give any team enough extras to take that on. To me, Ethier seems like a LH version of Alex Rios.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 08:44 AM) Would rather take Kemp or Ethier. I would rather take Gerardo Parra at this point as a one year solution and then wait to see what we can get when the OF market is a little deeper next off-season. I think he will come back nicely next year and is a good buy low candidate as a top tier defender, he gets on base at a good clip, and his power would play up a bit more here than it did in Arizona. It also leaves the team with a lot of payroll flexibility going forward.

Glad we passed.

QUOTE (Baron @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 01:33 PM) Yeah Miller...the young pitcher with conditioning problems and a complete mental breakdown. Yeah the Cardinals are really going to regret getting an accumulated 24 WAR OF who is 25 years old. Miller is pretty much in the same spot the Greinke was at the same age. Those are the growing pains that you have to go through sometimes with young players before they are fully developed. Time will tell what happens, but I definitely don't like the trade for the Cardinals, especially giving up 11 years of control for basically two.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 01:27 PM) It was changed from no signings over $250K for 1 season to no signings over $300k for 2 seasons when teams were intentionally exploiting that loophole, so for whoever signs Moncada, it will be two times his signing bonus (likely about $80 million) for year one of his service plus then whatever he'd get in a normal 6 year contract. They are then locked out of signings over $300k for 2015-16 and 2016-17. They'd finally be able to make signings over $300k within their slotted pool amount again on July 2, 2017. Yes I understand the international piece, and I think Moncada is worth two Adolfo's or whatever else you could get over the next two signing periods. There are a lot of cases where the guys that sign smaller contracts end up with ML success and guys that sign big bonuses fizzle out. In addition, you can sign 8 guys for $300K each of the next two seasons which would still be a pretty good haul. As of this point, when many of the top names for next years class are agreeing to deals with ML teams, the Sox are not a team that seem to have any deals in place with any of the top players based on McDaniels last international breakdown.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 01:20 PM) Maybe the Cards don't feel Piscotty has much of a future with them and would be willing to deal him for minor league depth elsewhere. They did just block his path to the majors again, and Holliday is signed through at least 2016. Overall though I agree, the Sox and Cards don't match up well for a trade. The Cards will hold on to him until they either need to make a move to bolster the ML roster or get blown away with an offer, they aren't going to move anybody just because they don't have a clear path.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 01:18 PM) The sentiment seems to be that he will cost somewhere between $30 and $40 million for his contract.` I have been reading some of that, and has been the case with Tomas, the numbers are often inflated by rival scouts to get teams to sit out. I can't remember if it was Badler or McDaniel that talked to Tomas' agent and said the numbers that were being reported are much larger than what was being discussed. If it truly is $40M, than the Sox and pretty much everyone but the Yankees are out, because nobody has $80M in expendable income. So I don't see anyway the bidding reaches that point. But I could see the tag being in the $20-$25M range.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 12:03 PM) It's more than just the lump sum dollars -- it's also freezing yourself form the entire market for two years. For a team that's trying to building a "sustainable winner," that's a MAJOR drawback. Its really only taking yourself out of play for one season, and maybe not even that long given the names that Sox have been connected with. With the payroll reductions the Sox have made the last two seasons there is some money there to go out and use to make such acquisitions. The Sox would have had to pay $20M posting fee for Tanaka last season, so we know there is some money around for such moves and you can reasonable assume that the pot is bigger given the reduced payroll and amateur spending this season.