beck72

I could see the sox taking a chance on Sheets for a one year deal with an option for a 2nd. The health reports and films on his arm would have to be somewhat encouraging though. But I doubt his injuries would lessen with time.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 30, 2008 -> 03:44 AM) Who would be your LFer then? Wise? Viciedo? Quentin? Fields? (assuming we move Carlos over to RF is most logical, if Dye were to be traded) Would you then go out and have the confidence to deal Vazquez and go with four youngsters in the rotation? Would you sign a veteran for the 5th spot just in case, or pray that Bailey and Richard/Poreda came through? A deal for Javy should also include another young arm [who has thrown 100 + innings in the bigs] who could be the 4th/ 5th starter. I think an OFer could also be had in the deal, who could compete for a spot. Quentin would probably be moved to RF, as the sox would probably want a better athlete for LF and CF. Taveras would probably be in CF. I'd deal for a vet such as Duchscherer who could be a health risk [with his hip], yet has a big upside.

I'm still going with Bailey and Chris Heisey for Dye. While Heisey won't help the sox in 2009, he could play a factor in 2010. Sounds like an Aaron Cunningham with speed and ability to play CF http://redsminorleagues.com/2008/10/22/thi...t-chris-heisey/

QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Nov 29, 2008 -> 05:38 PM) I guess I don't understand why everyone assumes the White Sox DON'T need that... Like, do we have a guy coming up that can replace Vazquez's ERA and innings next year that I don't know about? Or is there some big FA deal in the works that would totally be out of KW's character? I'm not a big Vazquez fan, he's done a lot to hinder himself while here and definitely hasn't lived up to his potential (like everywhere), but if we trade him, whoever replaces him has to be of his value or better... Which is why the asking price for Dye is a young starting pitcher and a position prospect. I'm sure if the sox trade Vazquez part of the return would be for a young starter who could vie for the 4th or 5th spot. I've talked about the sox trying to acquire Duchscherer from the A's. With his injury history, he'd likely be cheap to acquire. Yet he could be a #2 or #3 SP.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Nov 29, 2008 -> 02:29 PM) Javy usually bounces back strong after dissapointing seasons. I think he will excell on a team like Atlanta where the media isn't as intense and the expectations aren't as high. Bring back Jurjens and you have a deal! Just the idea of having Buerhle, Floyd, Danks, Jurjens and possibly even Poreda makes me smile. ATL would more likely give up a AA SP or someone like Jo Jo Reyes or James Parr. Jurjens probably isn't going anywhere.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 29, 2008 -> 03:09 PM) I decided that staying up and trying to figure out why Willy Taveras was bad last year was more important than sleeping. Don't need it anyway. The surprising thing about the numbers though is that when you look at he often he ends an AB in 1-2 pitches, or 3 pitches, or 4+ pitches it all comes out very, very close and is perfectly in line with his career. The guy wasn't any less aggressive early in the count last year, he just was late in the count, which was a continuation of a slide that began in his second year. So whatever Hurdle and those guys told him, you can see that it only affected him with 2 strikes, and it hit him really, really hard in full counts. I think he was going up to the plate ready to swing, but when he ended up getting 3 balls he completely changed his mindset, probably because of what Hurdle or whoever their hitting coach had said. His AVG w/ a full count completely fell off the planet, and he had a lot of AB with a full count last year. If he lifts that, given that he improved every other bit of his game, he would have had a career year or close to it last year. God damn, I feel like I'm like a Willy Taveras expert now. WTF? It would be like the sox trying to change Alexei, who sees few pitches during an AB. You take away the natural aggressiveness of a guy who hits early in the count, and then when he falls behind, he's toast because he's got too much thinking going on. Taveras can get on base better than Alexei, with the bunts and will take more walks [though that's not saying a lot]. One of the things Ozzie and Co. do best is to simplify things for guys, talk to players in straight forward, crystal clear terms. Give a guy like Taveras clear expectations [be aggressive at the plate and on the bases, and bunt a lot], and then sit back and let his talent take over. Focus on what he does well, rather than tyring to overcorrect what he does wrong. You can make minor adjustments to a major league hitter instead of wholesale changes such as making an aggressive hitter become an On base machine.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 29, 2008 -> 03:02 PM) After 2007 I never thought I'd ever say Gavin Floyd is more of a big game pitcher than Javy, but I guess that's how it's going to turn out. Gavin flashed his ballsack all over the place last year and really showed some emotion, plus he went out there with nothing a few times and still found a way to come out with the W or else keep the team in the game. He didn't get it done against Tampa, but it was a long year and he couldn't find his breaker. And we all know about the enormous girth of Danks' and Buehrle's respective nutsacs. So yeah, see ya later Javy. Interesting choice of words. But appropriate. I guess that's what the sox are looking for-starting pitchers who can flash ballsack or have the potential to flash ballsack. Javy's not that kind of guy.

Good work. You do have too much time on your hands. I did read reports about Hurdle and staff trying to change Taveras' hitting approach. Trying to make Taveras be more patient seems like trying to change Alexei. You take away his aggressiveness, and you make a guy lose confidence and have him thinking at the plate too much instead of letting his natural abilities take over. And esp. last year with benching Willy early in the year. Throw in a young Latino who moved from a diverse Houston to a lily white Denver and the cultural changes/ adjustments of the trade may come into play as well. He should be far more comfortable with the sox clubhouse and the diversity of the city of Chicago. I remember watching Taveras in the 2005 World Series. Here was a guy who showed 5 tools during that series and was an exciting player. He's not that far removed from that success. For the cost of acquiring him [which should not be much, a bullpen arm that really won't help the sox in 2009] the possible reward far outweighs the risks involved.

When Ozzie "called out" Javy about not being a big game pitcher [i forget which game it was late in the year], and Javy responded by being too cautious, and trying to be too fine with his pitches instead of attacking hitters, he probably wrote his ticket out of here. His starts after that were all the same--he wasn't being aggressive. That's been Javy's MO all his career. The sox gave him every opportunity to turn it around. But if it's not in his makeup by now, it probably isn't going to happen. When a guy has the pure "stuff Vazquez has, and can't step up when his team needs him for a big game, and he has an ERA in the mid 4's, it's time to move on. The sox have [or should have] consistent guys in Buehrle, Danks, and Floyd who can give the team 6 innings and give the team a chance to win even when they are struggling. Javy can do that for the most part, especially vs. weaker teams. But he's been MIA in games when it's mattered. The sox should expect more from a guy with Javy's arm and salary, and be able to come up big like Danks did vs the Twins in the 1-game playoff. That said, Javy has very good value for teams out there needing someone to give a staff innings and a decent ERA.

QUOTE (Shadows @ Nov 29, 2008 -> 03:07 AM) I don't know why people hate on Wily T Even with his down year this season he still has career numbers of .283 AVG and .331 OBP.. he plays great defense and has exceptional speed.. I would love to have Wily on this team, whether that be leading off or batting 9th.. If hes gonna steal 60+ bases while playing great defense and be somewhere in the .280 avg range ill gladly take that If the sox got him, I think he'd do well here.

Didn't see any mention of this. I have to believe the sox have a deal in place for Taveras in a swap for a guy like Lance Broadway and/or Boone Logan. The Rockies need bullpen help. He's a fallback option for leadoff if nothing else is out there but could be a solid #9 hitter. "The bullpen represents the biggest concern. The Rockies could add arms through trades and have had recent discussions with the Mets regarding Aaron Heilman, according to a source close to the team. The Reds and the White Sox also remain interested in center fielder Willy Taveras." http://www.denverpost.com/rockies/ci_11075193?source=rss

QUOTE (BearSox @ Nov 28, 2008 -> 03:33 PM) I don't see anything special in Kelly Johnson. I think Chris Getz can be just as good, if not better. Johnson would be a decent pickup. Yet it would create a logjam at 2b, with Beckham not having a spot in a year or two. Getz could be decent stopgap until Beckham's ready, and then be moved.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 28, 2008 -> 04:07 AM) If Kenny wants players that will be ready in the this year or 2010 then he should ask for some combination of Hanson/JoJo/Rohrbough/Morton and Blanco/Gorkys/Shafer/Heyward. Asking for someone you're not even going to play doesn't make sense. Emil Brown could equal the numbers Jones put up in the Majors this year and a healthy Juan Rivera, Garrett Anderson, Ken Griffey Jr. etc. off the scrap heap could easily exceed even the most generous expectations for Jones. That's why he's the GM and not you or I

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 28, 2008 -> 04:34 AM) I still don't know about that. Danny Richar has a lot more tools than David Eckstein does but there's a pretty good chance Richar never starts in the Majors. David DeJesus I fear is going to end up being like the offensive version of Mark Buehrle. By that I mean, normally when you look at soft-tossing lefties with control and a decent change you think, "OK, maybe this guy can make it as a LOOGY/LR/5th starter type." But because of what Buehrle is able to do, people will always say so-and-so could be the next Buehrle, even though Buehrle is the exception and is truly a special player given what he can do with his ability. I think the same will end up holding true for DeJesus, in that guys who look like 4th OF's with decent skill-sets that don't wow anyone will inevitably be compared to DeJesus, even though he's the overachiever type and that is very hard to do. Looking at Brandon Jones' numbers alone, I don't see any way he can be compared with David DeJesus. DeJesus' contact rate was much better coming up through the minors (DD had 122 K's in 909 minor league AB's compared to 128 K's in '07 and 104 K's in '08) and that contact rate is what makes DeJesus such a good player. He can draw walks - so can Jones - but Jones doesn't walk so much that he'll be able to overcome a poor batting average and still post a respectable OBP. And again, Jones' minor league numbers will certainly dip, and dip a lot, in the Majors. Last year he hit .267/.312/.397 in 116 AB with 7 BB to 28 K. Obviously he can improve on it, but given his lack of power, his lack of contact, his lack of ability to draw enough walks to offset his poor batting average, and given the fact that he is not going to play a premium position, it is very unlikely Jones ever does anything as a starter in the Majors. He does not offer the type of power or hitting ability that will make GM's and managers stick with him for 1-2 seasons while the fans are booing his poor production. Every single team has guys like this. Why didn't we just keep David Cook? I mean seriously. Cook is two years older, but he actually strikes out less, he has a lot more power, and he has twice the batting eye of Jones. Seriously, Cook is a better player than Jones is and we didn't even protect him on the roster. I know you like this dude, but if Kenny traded Jermaine Dye for him he'd be the laughing stock of baseball. Ryan Sweeney is and was better than Jones and we traded him, and only a few posters here even cared when we did it. If we offered JD to Oakland, and Oakland wanted him, I'd like to think we could easily get Sweeney back plus another good player. The asking price for Dye from KW is a young starting pitcher and an OFer. I never said Jones for Dye. IMO, Jones still has upside after one down year.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 27, 2008 -> 10:06 PM) What makes you think he can hit for a solid average? Because he hit .283 in the minors? Those walk numbers don't exactly inspire confidence should he be unable to hit Major League pitching. League average for RF last year was .272/.340/.426 and Jones' career minor league line is .283/.360/.456. So basically, you're hoping a guy can maintain his minor league numbers against much tougher competition (completely unrealistic) just to stay above league average. No thanks. Trading Dye is trading one of the most productive outfielders in baseball since he came to Chicago. If you trade for a player with league-average upside then you're just wasting your own time. I'd rather get a guy who I won't be looking to move the next season even if he does do somewhat well. Otherwise, keep Dye, keep the 30+ HR and .500+ SLG, and when it comes time to collect a first round draft pick for him, select a guy with 3X the ceiling of Brandon Jones. You seem to be against trading Dye. I'd love for Dye to be kept around to DH. Yet the sox can get a good return for him and get younger and better for the long term. The guys the sox get in return for Dye probably won't outproduce him in 2009. Yet they should be able to help the sox. I threw out some names from ATL based on the media report. You don't like Jones. Fine. He was a top tier prospect heading into 2008. But you do like Blanco, right, who had 1000 more at bats than Jones in the minors, and hit for a career .273/.372/.377 line compared to Jones' .283/.360/.456 line? I'm not fully understanding.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 27, 2008 -> 10:10 PM) Blanco's tools and ability fit his position better than Jones' tools and ability do. If you can't hit for power in the corners then you had better do something else exceptionally well if you want to start in the Majors. CF is a completely different story. Jones has more tools than DeJesus but projects like him-a guy who can hit for avg. and sport a good OBP.

QUOTE (Jimmywins1 @ Nov 27, 2008 -> 06:25 PM) Some one we should look into is Gregor Blanco. He plays CF, is 24, and had a .366 OBP in 144 games (430 AB's), and in 6 minor league seasons, he racked up 180+ SB's. I listed Blanco as well a few posts back. Yet Jones, IMO is better than Blanco. Both are the same age. Yet Jones has a better line in the minors .283/.360/.456 in 1,000 less ab's compared to Blanco. Blanco has decent numbers .273/.372/.377. And his 182 sb's are nice. But not his 86 CS for a 68% avg.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 27, 2008 -> 08:20 PM) I doubt Fields stock has dropped that much. He was hurt last year. He still has 40HR power and a very strong arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. Dye loves it here. If he goes elsewhere and doesn't like the fit he may decline his 2010 mutual option, but if we don't trade him we've got him in the middle of our order for two years, probably the last as DH, and then we get Type A comp after that. No offense, but I really hate the idea of giving up Jermaine Dye for crap like Brandon Jones and company. If you trade Jermaine, make sure you get at least one guy who has a shot at becoming a long-term solution somewhere. Get a corner OF with power potential, or a legit CF and not some tweener, or a SP prospect who is expected to become a #3 or better. Brandon Jones? I'd rather take a shot at bringing back Griffey to take over for JD for a year or two, or sign Juan Rivera or something. The guy is a career .283 hitter in the minor leagues and he struck out over 100 times per season in '07 and '08. For a corner OF with no power, yuck. Ryan Sweeney was a much better player and we felt he didn't fit, so I highly doubt Jones does anything for the Sox. I'm sorry, but nowhere is Brandon Jones looked like as "crap". He's a guy who should be able to hit for avg. play solid defense, and get on base. Whether that's in LF or RF, who cares. In the NL that makes a difference having a corner OFer being able to hit or power without the DH. But not so much for the sox. And say no to Jones who has far greater upside over a Griffey or Rivera? Did you mean to put that in green? The sox need to get younger. And need to diversify their lineup by adding guys who can hit for avg., get on base, move around the bases and play defense. Jones does all those things.

Just as an aside to Brandon Jones, ATL may look at him like the Sox with Josh Fields prior to 2008. Trading a year too late is far worse than trading a year early. in 2007 in AA and AAA- .295/.367/.490 in 2008 in AAA-.260/.343/.405 [and .252/.295/.370 in the bigs]. Jones doesn't show much improvement in 2009 and his stock will drop dramatically, ala Fields. Jones is supposed to hit for a solid avg. and get on base, even if he doesn't hit for power. That would be a good fit going forward, esp as he can hit from the left side Here's a link to Prospects blog that had Jones 3rd prior to 2008 season, behind both Heyward and Schafer. I like the defense comment-and the scrappy approach to hitting. Doesn't that sound like Kenny's type of guy http://diamondcutter.wordpress.com/2008/01...atlanta-braves/

If the Braves were looking to sell low on Brandon Jones, the sox should go after him. He's a corner OFer without much power-likely only a 10 HR a year guy. NL teams need their corner to produce power. Yet the sox could have him replace Dye. His minor league numbers have been decent- .283/.360/.456. Yet his MLB #'s have been poor-.252/.295/.370. Granted he's only had 135 Ab's in the bigs. But ATL does have Jordan Schafer who'll be in AAA to start 2009 and their top prospect OFer Jayson Hayward who's supposed to fly through their system. If the sox got Jones, they'd still have to acquire a leadoff man. Willy Taveras still keeps coming back to mind for CF. A defense of Jones, Taveras and Quentin would be a definite upgrade. More than likely, a CFer from the Braves major league roster would have to be included. Josh Anderson, 26, hit well in his callup [.294/.338/.426] and has speed. Though he doesn't hit LHP. He was acquired from Houston and 2008 was his 1st yr with ATL, likely will be kept. Gregor Blanco, 24, has OBP skills and hit leadoff in over 200 ab's. He hit .251/.366/.309 in his rookie year in 430 total AB's. Both he and Anderson are LHB. Blanco hits both LHP and RHP. Also, AA is where the Braves have the pitchers, [so one of those not named Tommy Hanson]. Guys like Kris Medlen, 23 [who has been lights out in the AFL] Todd Redmond, 23, though a FB pitcher, and James Parr, 22, another FB pitcher [who threw in the bigs] seem to have upside. A deal like Blanco, Medlen [both of whom could help in 2009-Medlen probably in the bullpen] and a decent A ball prospect wouldn't be the worst deal. Though I'd look at Jones first.

Homer Bailey and Chris Heisey for Dye. The sox would have seen Heisey play in the Southern League this year. Don't know if Heisey can play defense. But he looks like he can hit for avg, get OBP and steal some bases, as well hit for some pop. http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/st...&pid=502317 Here's a write up from a Reds blog. Interesting note that they said Heisey might not fit into the crowded Reds OF in the near future. http://redsminorleagues.com/2008/10/22/thi...t-chris-heisey/

Sounds like Gavin Floyd on this write up: http://www.baseball-intellect.com/Articles...mer-bailey.html Bailey has upside-if he's healthy. He'd be a better get than Edwin Jackson. Bailey + another player for Dye? Sounds good

Thanks for the heads up. And welcome aboard

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 23, 2008 -> 03:38 PM) In all honesty, I would rather try Josh Fields in LF and press my luck than give up a pitcher with the stuff of Edwin Jackson for a complementary corner outfielder who doesn't hit with corner power, doesn't have much of an arm and doesn't record stolen bases like he did earlier in his career...in fact, I'd rather have Ryan Sweeney back than trade for DeJesus (because of the salary difference). We shouldn't ever dream of trading a potential 3 or higher start to an intradivision rival IMO. I would rather have Taveras playing CF and hitting 1st and giving up Broadway/Russell compared to Edwin Jackson/Adam Russell for David DeJesus. With the HR power of Alexei and in the future with Beckham at 2 spots not usually known for power production, the sox can use LF for a guy who can hit for average and get on base. DeJesus, IMO would be a good fit in LF for the next 3 years. I've advocated getting Taveras as well. Yet DeJesus is a much better leadoff hitter and hitter in general. Sweeney isn't likely to match the hitting and OBP of DeJesus. Esp. the next 3 years.

QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 23, 2008 -> 02:11 PM) I'd rather use Brian Anderson than Edmonds or DeJesus. DeJesus may be quicker than Anderson, but he makes a lot of dumb defensive mistakes. I agree, DeJesus is a LFer.