beck72

I think it's pretty clear both will be gone and the sox will load up on draft picks as they offer both arbitration. Those four picks will help the sox be good for the long run though. Yet I wouldn't be surprised if the Sox paid Mark his money--which would pave the way for Crede to leave town though. As far as those who say the sox need to spend money on some veteran players--of course they do. But those guys need to be young and/ or irreplaceable. Dye's bat [esp. if he repeats his 2006 numbers] will be hard to replace. But not his d. Esp. as he should get a 4 yr deal and won't be near the player he was in 2006 in 2010 and 2012. I liken Dye to the Magglio situation. Sure you'd like him back. But not at a huge price. Someone you give a long term deal to should be near the same player they are in the last yr of the contract that they were when you first signed them. And they should be able to give a team something no one else can. It probably comes down to who the sox would rather sign to a long term deal---Dye, Mark or Crede. But teams built around their pitching can really only afford to have a few max contract position players. This is what Scheurholtz [sp?] has done in ATL and who KW really respects.

QUOTE(TheOcho @ Jan 12, 2007 -> 10:32 PM) As mentioned before we have enough pitchers for another team... I love the depth we have in the minors etc. but uhh... what about position players? Last time I checked we have virtually no one at SS or 2nd... Getting a guy like Lujan [and harnessing his control] could potentially net the sox a position player. Yet Stewart wasn't going to play for the sox the next 2 yrs. Getting a guy who should outperform a back up C like Stewart is a good deal--no matter what position he plays on the field. BTW--don't discount Chris Getz at 2b. He should have been in high A instead of AA last yr. The sox have been high on him for yrs, drafting him out of high school and in 2005. 2007 should get him back to being a top 10 prospect

QUOTE(winninguglyin83 @ Jan 13, 2007 -> 01:45 AM) seems like we have a hard-on for the pitchers in the Rangers system -- and I don't remember Texas producing many pitchers through the years. There were media reports the sox had scouted the Rangers prospects extensively. The more familiar the sox are with these guys, the better the chance these arms may one day help the sox. New people are in charge of the Rangers since, IIRC 2003 or 2004. The guys they drafted then are now close to coming into the majors. Esp. the high ceiling arms like Hurley, Diamond, Volquez, etc. So you have to wait to see how these arms turn out. By all accounts, they have much more upside.

QUOTE(spiderman @ Jan 7, 2007 -> 02:44 AM) Why should the White Sox ante up if they feel their prospects can carry the load? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of acquiring all these young arms ? I'd love to have Buerhel here long-term, and I think the Whie Sox probably do as well, but I don't see them bending very much considering they are so high on their prospects, and KW has spoken at length about how out of control the market is. I said the sox should ante up a deal as high as 5 yrs and $75 mill. More than that and it's crazy money. The sox acquired arms to give them options. I'm sure they'd like to re-sign Mark to a air, reasonable contract. But not at Zito type money and length.

From Mark's point of view, he should be well compensated next yr. He's been one of the most consistent SP's in baseball. He looks around the league and sees crap pitchers getting over 5 yr $55 mill deals, why shouldn't he look for the best deal out there for him and his family. A normal, good yr in 2007 should net Mark at minimum a 4, 5 yr deal worth $60-75 mill. The sox should ante up--provided he returns to form this yr. Which IMO, he will. Yet they shouldn't get too crazy in terms of money or length beyond what I suggested above.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jan 2, 2007 -> 06:21 AM) Trying to get back on topic, I have no problem getting rid of a quality pitching prospect for one of the better, more constant bullpen arms in the game. Jenks and Mac don't exactly have clean bills of health, and like it was mentioned earlier in the thread, Cordero might be a better closer than Jenks is now. I just have a problem with giving up Anderson. Then what, Sweeney in CF? I like Sweeney, but I would expect him to be almost as bad as Anderson was last year. He just isn't ready, and there isn't anything wrong with that, he just needs more time. If you could get Cordero for a Broadway or Gio, I say you do it.To have a shut down bullpen like that would be outstanding to have. IMO, Anderson wouldn't be part of a trade with the Nats. They have a logjam of OF's now and it looks like they'll be going with Escobar in CF. And it was pointed out that the writer suggested BA and Lance for Soriano, that it wouldn't take as much for Cordero. Yet a trade for a proven bullpen arm wouldn't mean the sox are keeping BA in CF. Actually, it may make a trade even easier for a CFer/ LFer, as the sox could use a guy like Aardsma or MacDougal as bait. Somehow, the sox will upgrade the OF via trade. If they can do it w/o trading away guys who can help the sox big club in 2007 great. But it's not likely.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jan 2, 2007 -> 06:05 AM) Bucholz, Bowden, and Bard are "A level prospects" but you make it sound like they are horrible prospects. They all could be top 30 prospects in Baseball America in the next year. Still, if the White Sox have what it takes ala Broadway and Anderson, they should without hesitiation go after him. I was showing that a trade for Cordero wouldn't necessarily take guys who would play for the sox in 2007. Most teams want players who can help this yr at some point. The Nats are in a different situation

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jan 1, 2007 -> 06:53 PM) Think we could get Ciristian Guzman tossed in? Your post makes no sense. The Sox are going to trade non-prospects for Cordero only to trade him to other teams for valuable "extra peices?" I guess teams stockpiling SP's and bullpen help makes no sense--esp the market for major league pitching the way it is. I'd forsee a guy like Cordero being a big help to the sox bullpen. Yet he could also be moved [or another guy the sox have gotten in a trade, such as Aardsma] to another team who the sox could get an upgrade in the OF, or SS--if the sox didn't have to give up too much in the short term or long term. That was my point. QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Jan 1, 2007 -> 08:59 PM) If we can get Cordero in our bp to go along with Jenks, Macdougal, and Thornton.... idonno I think that would be pretty much the best bp hands down. I like the looks of the sox 'pen. But it is light in proven guys after those big 3. You can never have too much pitching talent, as long as the cost isn't that steep.

QUOTE(U can putitontheboarrrrd...YES @ Jan 1, 2007 -> 02:39 PM) Cordero is a 1 trick pony, and really not a very good one. He'd get annihilated in the AL. Keep him far away. He's done pretty well so far in his career. And the sox could trade him to a few teams in dire need of a closer--Marlins, D-Rays. Acquiring him for extra peices could help save the sox from trading prospects the sox don't want to part with

What's interesting, looking back to talks with the Nats GM Bowden, that both Anderson and a prospect [like Lance Broadway] were mentioned as possible targets by the Wash. Post columnist in a deal for Soriano last yr. Here's the quote: "So if a deal with the White Sox is to get done quickly, and it doesn't involve McCarthy, it's possible the Nationals could be targeting an outfielder such as Brian Anderson -- a 24-year-old who is hitting just .205 with a .281 on-base percentage as the White Sox' regular center fielder -- to go along with a prospect, perhaps right-hander Lance Broadway, left-hander Ray Liotta (who has struggled this year), third baseman Josh Fields, or outfielder Ryan Sweeney." http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6072401251.html

The Nationals reportedly are interested in trading closer Cordero. The article mentions the Nats interest in Boston's lower level prospects. Seeing how it wouldn't hurt the present, and the sox would be dealing from a position of stength of pitchers, why not make a play for Cordero. He'd be the perfect insurance policy in case Jenks went down. I'm not sold on MacDougal or Thornton taking over for Bobby if he got hurt. And the cost for getting a closer mid year would be astronomical. http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view...rticleid=174781

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Dec 31, 2006 -> 04:05 PM) The White Sox will never sign Johan Santana. We don't take that kind of risk. Santana isn't much of a risk. The only question would be the money

By his own account, Lance got a lot of K's in AA and below on balls out of the strike zone. Getting big league hitters to chase pitches won't be easy. That may translate into Lance getting battered around in AAA and above. His value now may be at it's greatest. Esp. as Charlie Haeger is the same age as Lance and did stellar in AAA.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Dec 31, 2006 -> 02:47 PM) I wish the Sox would get him but that wouldn't be realistic at all The Twins would under no circumstances trade him to the Sox. But as a FA.... With the sox getting young arms, they will have money for a few big money arms

Didn't see this posted anywhere. If the Twins can't hold onto Johan, that would be a devastating hit to the Twins. As long as they trade him to a NL team. I don't want to see him on the Yanks The twins would be fools to trade him to an AL team--though the Yanks are positioning themselves to be suitors by acquiring the young arms needed to get Santana. http://www.startribune.com/508/story/905897.html

I don't think MB, Javy, Jon or Jose will be moved. Taking KW at his word that the sox won't hurt their chances to win in 07--which trading one of the remaining SP's would, no doubt [even for a Pelfrey, as these guys all have shown they can dominate major league hitters and throw 200 innings], the sox are a 90 win team that can contend as is. They don't have the pressure to unload big contracts. And have gotten more high quality, young depth with the trades they've made. They are also set for the future, and the present. The casual fan will follow a winner. And go to a park they have a good time in. I'm willing to bet some casual fans went to the cell because the sox won the series, people who had gone to their fair share of Cub games. And after attending some games at the cell, having a good time, able to park and get tickets, will also come back in 2007. These people aren't and won't be affected by the trades the sox have made. The "die hards" [like on White Sox weekly, who made me wince with their comments] are the ones moaning and groaning that the sox are "white-flagging" it [They aren't the newbies but guys and gals who can remember who was actually involved in the original trade]. These are the people worried the sox are doing the trades for financial reasons, and not for baseball related reasons. They are naturally suspicious that the moves are being made to 'make a profit'. I disagree, with them. But I can see their points.

The Yanks are finally starting to get it. They're getting younger and arguably better by trading guys like Wright, Sheffield and now Randy. They can't keep paying these huge contracts to older players. Now that they have some youth--esp pitching--they can make a lot of moves. No team wanted their has-beens before. And the Yanks weren't able to trade to get pitching help. Now they have in house help to take over in case of injury

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Dec 30, 2006 -> 07:07 AM) That would be retarded. Why give up a gold-glove caliber CF, a first round pitcher pick who is in AAA plus a guy ready for the major league pen? I like Anderson more than most people around here. I think he showed something the way he battled back from his horrible start. Yet he doesn't have much trade value. His best value is on his "potential". If he has a poor 2007, that potential is gone. IMO, he's more valuable to the sox if they let him play in 2007 and build on his OK 2nd half. That would make the most sense, esp. if they believed BA could bounce back. For some reason though, the sox seem down on him. I don't want the sox to give him away. But if they essentially do that, it would show they wanted him gone for reasons besides just his poor hitting. The biggest peices to me would be the pitchers involved.

QUOTE(S720 @ Dec 30, 2006 -> 07:04 AM) No way in the world I would do this deal! Masset will be an outstanding reliever next year. Rocco does not worth two of our top pitching prospects AND Anderson. Hell NO, I will not do this deal at all. Anderson and Broadway are the most I'm willing to give up for Rocco. Masset probably wouldn't be involved--his upside for the sox is pretty high. Yet I could see TB wanting a guy who could close for them. I'm sure TB would want one of Masset or Aardsma. Anyway, Anderson doesn't make sense for them

QUOTE(Brian @ Dec 29, 2006 -> 08:43 PM) I would trade BA and a prospect that is not that promising for him. If you were a GM and offered them that kind of deal, the D-rays would drop the phone in laughter and never take a phone call from you ever again

FWIW, WSI has a thread on the Baldelli talk. A first time poster [yeah, I know, with "connections"] mentioned BA, Masset and Lance Broadway possibly being involved. Take it with a grain of salt. But something like that is probably worth it. http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbullet...2751&page=2

QUOTE(SEALgep @ Dec 29, 2006 -> 05:44 PM) They could spin Anderson to the Marlins for even more pitching. IMO, the only the Sox get Baldelli is if it's a 3 way deal with the DRays getting one of the young proven Marlins SP's that they like-- Josh Johnson, Nolasco or Olsen.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Dec 29, 2006 -> 05:49 PM) Someone should say it: the Sox are stockpiling pitching because they're going to rebuild the rotation completely once all the current deals are done unless by some miracle all of our pitchers take significant pay cuts and decline to hit free agency. We're not going to trade pitching for an oft-injured Rocco Baldelli because these arms -- Floyd, Haeger, Danks -- are our future. Not that I approve of it, but that's the plan. I don't think KW has said that is the "plan". The sox are stockpiling pitching because that is the most valuable commodity. But that doesn't mean the sox will keep all the young arms they have. If they just kept guys in AAA who should be in the majors, that would lessen their value even more. So, yes the sox are getting arms. But they still should look to keep veteran pitchers as well. Guys who can go 200 innings each yr are very valuable and the sox will try and keep a few around. Plus, they still will have 3/5 of their rotation around for 2 more yrs. A young arm or two could still be traded--esp for a guy who can stabilize a key position like CF for 5 yrs

QUOTE(iamshack @ Dec 29, 2006 -> 04:40 PM) If they wanted to sign Buehrle, I think they would have just signed Zito and avoided having to make a trade. I don't think the Mets would really deal for MB. I was just saying they would have to negotiate something long term for Mark [like 5 yrs or less] in order for them to give up Pelfrey and Milledge.

I'm surprised the writer wasted his time assessing the offseason moves. There are still 3 months left in the offseason. The sox aren't done. They'll use some of the young guys [or their existing minor league players] in order to beef up the everyday lineup via a trade or two.