caulfield12

QUOTE (MurcieOne @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 10:55 AM) I thought at first we acquired this guy..... whew With the way he has killed us this year (10/31), well below .500 against the rest of MLB, it might be worth it just to give up Anderson Gomes' vaunted speed just to take him out of their line-up. Thankfully, Grudzielanek is also on the shelf for them too.

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:47 PM) their fans are convinced we are going to win the division it's funny the similarities between us just shows you that both of these teams are massively flawed and not great, the division is a crapshoot at this point Typical Twins' fan 1) Our rotation doesn't have anyone after Liriano that you feel confident will win a clutch post-season game 2) Pohlad is cheap, cheap, cheap 3) Adam Everett, Bret Boone, Tony Batista, Livan Hernandez, Craig Monroe, Ponson, Juan Castro, Phil Nevin, Ruben Sierra, Ramon Ortiz, etc. 4) GM's will never trade minor league depth to put them over the top 5) Team keeps "rebuilding" or giving up critical vets (Hunter, David Ortiz, Santana, etc.) that always seem them 1 bat or arm behind in the playoffs 6) Twins will embarass the AL Central by going out in the first round 7) Gardenhire sucks 8) Bill Smith doesn't know how to make a big, splashy move...he's an institutional, IBM type egg counter

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:44 PM) You know what's amazing about our bullpen....outside of Jenks, not a single one of them has a good offspeed pitch. Bring back Shingo and the frisbee! The gong was priceless fun while it lasted.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:40 PM) Twins are in great position to win 7 or 8 of their next 9 games. You never know what can happen in a pennant race. Nobody expected Minnesota to give up two 2-run leads to KC and blow two games to the Mariners in a row. Anything can happen...and often does...when you underestimate other MLB teams. The Twins are still a quite young and maturing team. Do they face Duchsherer in that series or not? After 8 more at home, the Twins have 14 on the road...and at least they can knock the Yankees off our tails in the WC race, if it comes down to that. Then it will be a five team race for four spots.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:37 PM) Russell's stuff is nothing special. 94 mph fastball, extremely flat slider. I'm not blaming Ozzie for this....KW's inability to find another righty reliever is killing us. Okay...I am just saying, compared to Wasserman or Carrasco or someone of their ilk, he has a much better raw arsenal...it's just not polished, and he is definitely a work in progress. However, I wouldn't put him in the Jon Adkins category just yet, either.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:31 PM) There's just no excuse to have a pitcher with a 5.52 ERA coming into a 1 run game in the 8th inning with 50 games left in a pennant race. There won't be a pennant race with 15 games to go (see 2003) if we completely burn out and overexpose Thornton, Dotel and Jenks. Linebrink probably won't be coming back...and Ozzie needs to find a fourth reliever that he can count on somehow. There's no better way than now. He could be forced to use someone like Russell in Minnesota with a week to go and down by two games in the standings, it's better to establish exactly what he has right now. Russell has the third best "stuff" of anyone in the bullpen, arguably (although you could certainly make a case for Dotel, even with a diminished arsenal after injury). He should/could be someone you project as that missing piece, because we're not going to get much better from someone we can sneak through waivers, unless KW is willing to take on another big contract (Dotel, Linebrink, Jenks after this season, Thornton and MacDougal) in the pen.

QUOTE (WCSox @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 10:28 AM) You want Kenny to trade for John Smoltz, Mike Hampton, or Mark Mulder and then sign them to an extension? I sure don't. Kenny's probably not going to sign any pitcher he trades for this season to an extension. Not with Buehrle, Vazquez, Danks, and Floyd under contract for the next couple of seasons. Many of the players on your list (Webb, Harden, Lackey, Lee, Beckett, Hudson, etc.) are going to command well in excess of $50 million guaranteed. The Sox almost never give that kind of money to free agent veteran pitchers. Kenny tends to limit himself to trading for guys with $30 million left on their deals and I don't think that he's looking towards the 2010 rotation just yet. No, that's why they are not underlined... Smoltz and Mulder might never pitch again in the major leagues...only our medical staff could determine their situations after doing some due diligence, but I am pretty sure Smoltz is either done or he will try to make his comeback with the Braves. Mulder might draw a little interest, but less than Freddy Garcia did after his recent tryout...not until he can at least throw 86-89 MPH again. Vazquez is the most obvious candidate to move, with Contreras done. However, you have to consider 1) whether we will get anything worthwhile in return based on his performance the last 6-8 weeks, 2) whether he's going to bounce back again next year, and the likelihood of finding anyone who can come close to leading the AL in strikeouts, 3) whether it's safe for KW to take the $20-30 million he was going to invest in Javier and Contreras and put it into a veteran (at least 3 years of service) pitcher.

QUOTE (jackie hayes @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 10:20 AM) So your forward thinking is that Beckett, Webb, Bedard, Lee, Escobar, Harden, etc etc etc will pass through waivers and their respective teams will be willing to deal them to us. God, if only I had thought forward! First, as is obviosly denoted (didn't think I needed to provide an explanation to more serious baseball fans), the ones that are underlined are the ones that KW will be considering. It's the full list...I don't think anywhere on there I mentioned that KW was going to be able to trade for any of those pitchers. Although I wouldn't be entirely surprised if he took a stab at someone like Bedard for Fields, Poreda, Silverio/Martinez and a B level pitching prospect.

QUOTE (jackie hayes @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 09:29 AM) You already posted this list in TW, and it didn't make any sense there, either. Simple...you have to use forward thinking. 1) We need a starting pitcher (and maybe 2, perhaps Ramirez is one of them) for Contreras and possibly Danks if he tires 2) We almost never enter the open bidding process for a FA pitcher in the offseason 3) When we make an acquisition, it's almost always (see Garcia, Contreras, Vazquez, etc.) a pitcher who we have under contract control or feel very confident we can get to sign a long-term deal 4) Washburn fits this profile...of someone we would keep next year, and even though $10.35 million seems like a lot of money, it's similar to what Contreras was going to receive AND the odds of getting anyone for less (and not having to give them 3-6 years) are minimal at best from the FA market 5) It's KW's style to find an underrated/undervalued pitcher with talent...but not one that we would just "rent" for a couple of months 6) Having them signed through next year gives us payroll certainty but not the commitment to a long-term deal that might blow up in our faces, as most of those contracts (see Zito or Hampton) tend to do

2010 Starting Pitchers Brandon Backe HOU Miguel Batista SEA Josh Beckett * BOS Erik Bedard SEA Chris Capuano MIL Jose Contreras CWS Doug Davis ARZ Justin Duchscherer OAK Adam Eaton * PHI Kelvim Escobar LAA Mike Hampton ATL Rich Harden CHC Tim Hudson * ATL John Lackey LAA Cliff Lee * CLE Jason Marquis CHC Mark Mulder STL Brett Myers PHI Vicente Padilla * TEX Brad Penny LAD Joel Pineiro STL Jason Schmidt LAD John Smoltz * ATL Claudio Vargas NYM Jarrod Washburn SEA Brandon Webb * ARZ Todd Wellemeyer STL

Underline means this guy COULD be a possibility for a KW deal in the next 2 weeks (2010 Free Agent Pitchers) **** Excitement Level (Padilla/Penny/Brett Myers) *** Excitement Level (Backe/Pineiro/Washburn) both of these guys seem to be pretty talented, but the results have never measured up...maybe Coop can fix them (trademark/copyright symbol) ** Excitement Level (Batista/Capuano/Vargas/Wellemeyer) Batista fits the KW/White Sox mold of getting a Tim Belcher when they need a more significant upgrade, Wellemeyer has a live arm...Vargas could start or reliever and would be a valuable addition to the pen...we should be looking at Duaner Sanchez too) * Excitement Level (Eaton/Mulder) maybe with a little elbow grease, a few screws (Cal Eldred), some baling wire and super glue, Mulder will get 30 starts in 2009 or 2010 Starting Pitchers Brandon Backe HOU Miguel Batista SEA Josh Beckett * BOS Erik Bedard SEA Chris Capuano MIL Jose Contreras CWS Doug Davis ARZ Justin Duchscherer OAK Adam Eaton * PHI Kelvim Escobar LAA Mike Hampton ATL Rich Harden CHC Tim Hudson * ATL John Lackey LAA Cliff Lee * CLE Jason Marquis CHC Mark Mulder STL Brett Myers PHI Vicente Padilla * TEX Brad Penny LAD Joel Pineiro STL Jason Schmidt LAD John Smoltz * ATL Claudio Vargas NYM Jarrod Washburn SEA Brandon Webb * ARZ Todd Wellemeyer STL

Brandon Backe HOU (still don't like him after the way he acted like a horse's a-- in the 2005 World Series, but live arm if healthy) Miguel Batista SEA (another veteran Seattle would like to move, along with Washburn and possibly a huge deal for Bedard) Josh Beckett * BOS Erik Bedard SEA (don't think this deal will go through until the off-season, unless the Yankees or a similar team can pull off a blockbuster deal) Chris Capuano MIL (good K to BB ratio, but very MEHH year so far) Jose Contreras CWS (ouf for one year, minimum) Doug Davis ARZ (struggling mightily in recent outings, recovery from testicular cancer an amazing story) Justin Duchscherer OAK (see Bedard) Adam Eaton * PHI (abysmal year so far...should be available to risk-takers out there) Kelvim Escobar LAA Mike Hampton ATL (Mr. Injury) Rich Harden CHC Tim Hudson * ATL (out for at least one year with TJ, if not done for career) John Lackey LAA Cliff Lee * CLE Jason Marquis CHC (remember when the White Sox owned that guy in 06?) Mark Mulder STL (typically KW reclamation project...could be a possibility with muchos incentivos, like Freddy Garcia) Brett Myers PHI (would the Phillies dare trade another huge upside pitcher who's struggling to the White Sox???) Vicente Padilla * TEX (might be an option, has always had a very good arm, so-so results, like Vazquez) Brad Penny LAD (huge disappointment, just off the DL, would the Dodgers give him up without a pretty high return in $$$ or prospects?) Joel Pineiro STL (Cards might make him available if they fall a few more games off the pace) Jason Schmidt LAD (probably out for season) John Smoltz * ATL (career in jeopardy) Claudio Vargas NYM (could be used out of the pen or as a starter) Brandon Webb * ARZ (yes, virginia, there is a santa claus) Todd Wellemeyer STL (one of the best starters possibly available from a statistics standpoint, but not far removed from oblivion with KC Royals) Asterisk means this guy COULD be a possibility for a KW deal in the next 2 weeks

Paul Byrd - Despite the scarcity of available starting pitching, no team was willing to take on the remainder of Byrd's $7.5MM salary. Greg Maddux - Maddux is earning $10MM this year and will only accept a trade to a West Coast team. The Dodgers wanted him but asked the Padres to pay more than 80% of his remaining salary according to Peter Gammons. Duaner Sanchez - His velocity is down 3.6 mph from '06. Sanchez is under team control through '09. Scott Schoeneweis - His strikeout rate is down, but so is his ERA. Apparently no team wanted to risk taking on his contract - $3.6MM this year, $3.6MM in '09. Jarrod Washburn - Mariners sources told beat writer Geoff Baker that Washburn cleared. The Mariners may have overplayed their hand here. Washburn is set to earn $10.35MM next year. from mlbtraderumors.com Sanchez has been a really good NL set-up guy but the loss in velocity is a mystery...no interest in Schoeneweis after the Ramirez deal and due to the money invested in Thornton, Dotel, Linebrink, MacDougal and Jenks' expected salary bump in arbitration.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 09:20 PM) And that's why I hope Dave Wilder rots in prison. No way that will happen...I think he's supposedly cooperating, and will end up with a slap on the wrist. I'm sure he will be blacklisted from MLB, perhaps for life...or maybe he'll get lucky and be like Rick Neuheisel and eventually have another team give him an opportunity. I really think they're going after the network of "buscones," and any higher level execs they can...like Bowden and Jose Rijo of the Nationals. Heck, that team is so bad (and it's a shame, with the new franchise move), there should be a criminal investigation anyway into the mismanagement of the organization. If it was a stock, there would be a shareholder lawsuit, that's for sure. They've already established a Dominican "clearinghouse" bank that all the bonuses/checks have to be deposited through now...every team in the majors will use this specific bank. It's a start. The weird thing is that we got Ordonez and Carlos Lee in the early 90's...but with Guillen as manager, and more of a focus on the Venezuelan academy, we've got little to show for it, outside of El Duque, Contreras, Ramirez, Jose Martinez and Juan Silverio. Heck, Ramirez was more like the Tadahito signing (KW only saw video)...I think every team could have signed Alexei after his open tryout, but most were projecting him as a utility player would might even struggle to make an impact at the major league level. Thankfully, how right KW was on that call. With Uribe/Richar/Getz at 2B, we would be about 5-7 games behind where we're at right now.

QUOTE (joejoedairy @ Aug 11, 2008 -> 02:00 AM) DJ said we got Ramirez in a trade for Orlando Paulo. not sure who that is exactly Paulo Orlando...low level (at best) C prospect who we will never miss and whose chances of making it (even to the Royals) are about 1/1000.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 07:19 PM) Exactly, but I think it's almost set in stone that he will win it. Maybe Quentin can have an affair (does he have a wife or g/f, we know so little about his personal life) and go on the Oprah show for his "catharsis" in order to catch up with the Josh Hamilton/Rookie II Disney script.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 10:31 PM) I don't expect the Sox to eat all of the contract, which means we will see one to two solid prospects moved. That could include one or two of the AAA/AAAA pitchers the Sox currently have (ie, Whisler/Haeger/Broadway/Egbert). I'd think the Sox wouldn't go with Broadway and instead give the others up simply because Broadway is a former first rounder. I don't anticipate Shelby/Poreda or any of the Sox higher upside prospects going (and its sad that I had to reach to go with Shelby as one of the "higher upside" prospects). The bright side is it looks as if the Sox are getting some decent talent in the lower levels. The Yanks offered basically nothing with the willingness of taking on the entire contract and had no luck getting him so that leads me to believe the M's are going to ask for at least something in return. Oh and Washburn was absolutely dominant in June and July. And I mean dominant (at least ERA wise). His August stats are skewed by one bad start (the other was what I'd consider average). Well...a lot of question marks. What are his stats on the road versus in very "pitcher friendly" Safeco? I haven't checked them yet. It would seem that they would want a B level pitcher to go along with Fields/Poreda/Martinez/Silverio...something like that. Then the issue is whether they would even want Fields back in a deal...depending on their plans for Beltre. You have to think the GM would be smart enough to build around defense in that stadium, and that would seem to take Josh out of the equation. Finally, we basically pilfered Thornton from them (I know it's a new GM), and the Freddy Garcia deal also turned out to be quite a disaster (yes, I know Reed is back with the M's)...so they might be a little wary of taking on supposed "prospects" from the White Sox a 3rd time around.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 10:21 PM) There are essentially two types of insurance. The normal worker's comp like every company has where the worker gets paid 66% of the salary without taxes. The other is a policy that can is arranged separately with the club and a re-insurer such as Loyd's of London where a pre-arranged amount of the total will be paid based on the amount of time the player missed based on the normal workload. This was the problem with the A-Rod contract over the 10 years. The Rangers couldn't get the entire contract covered and had to settle for only a portion being covered. Thus, the ballclub has to assume a greater debt if the player misses significant time. All of the policies are individually arranged based on factors such as age, inujury history ... Ihave no idea what Jose's was but it should pay out well. An achilles tendon repair in a guy his age is a 6-8 month rehab. Actually, now that you mention it, I think the policy was through Lloyd's of London.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 07:49 PM) I could see it happening if the M's like Shelby enough and if the Sox view him as a replaceable piece within the organization. The Sox would include more, but Shelby would almost certainly have to be the piece that made or broke the trade (on an unrelated note, made or broke isn't nearly as cool as make or break). would certainly have to be the "make or break" piece of the trading puzzle...?

QUOTE (WCSox @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 02:40 PM) They'll shut him down, just like they did last season and like the Tigers shut down Verlander in their pennant race a couple of years ago. Danks only threw 139 innings last season and he's currently at 137 1/3. I don't see them letting him throw more than 160. Kenny saw what the Cubs did to Wood and Prior and isn't going to let that happen to his young studs. I'm not so sure...Danks is closer to Buehrle than he is to being a pure power (see Verlander/Prior), high effort type of pitcher. One of the reasons he was shut down was because KW wanted to preserve his confidence I think, and it has definitely paid dividends this season. Blackburn and Perkins are in similar situations in Minnesota, and there hasn't been much talk of shutting either one of those guys down that I've heard. I guess, if it comes down to it, they could go to a six man rotation if they could acquire another starter to protect Danks and Floyd.

QUOTE (Jenks Heat @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 03:56 PM) Seems like a regular thing though nowadays. You never know what you will get on consistent basis from any pitcher on this team. Joe Neshack (sp?) says hi. That's a perfect example. The Twins losing Neshek (he's about to come back from rehab) and the Rincon falling apart really hurt that bullpen. Bonser and Ball have been disasters as well. Even Crain has looked shaky recently. Guerrier got knocked around and Reyes couldn't quite get out of the situation (didn't help to have a WP and an error behind him).

QUOTE (Jenks Heat @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 03:37 PM) There is nothing consistent about this team except for prolonged slumps whether they are starters, the bullpen or hitters making over $7M a year. Real sad. How many leads of 3+ have the Sox blown in the last two weeks? 3 But the Twins blew leads (one even more considerable) in consecutive games too...it happens. If you take away Crain or Guerrier from the Twins, they would be similarly hurting as the White Sox are without Linebrink. And whether it's nerve, lack of cajones or tiredness...we're finding out what happens when Thornton throws too many pitches...dating back to the Tigers overtime game.

QUOTE (Frankensteiner @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 03:34 PM) I am turning this game off. No need to take 5 years off my life. Too bad we can't put El Duque into this game like in 2005. Eerie. Erratic lefty (like Marte) screws up the inning and the righty has to come in and try to save the game.

QUOTE (Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 10, 2008 -> 03:23 PM) Right on. Maybe we could trade for him before the next inning. I'd send them Boone. Can't we get Javier Lopez back?

So Dotel comes in to face Mike Lowell no matter what the situation is...?