ozzfest

QUOTE (bmags @ Feb 12, 2016 -> 01:12 PM) Yes, it was specifically not Hoiberg. I don't know how anyone makes that mistake. You don't know how anyone can make that mistake? Sorry, Hoiberg was an assistant GM when they drafted Flynn and Rubio ahead of Curry. I still think that's enough not to want him as GM. http://espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4506863

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 12:46 PM) The problem I have, is while they might have played mediocre, the roster, at the start of the season was far better than mediocre. The combination of poor fit and poor coaching have just made things worse (to go along with injuries). Nothing I've seen from Fred makes me think he's a good coach, but I'll also admit he's in a tough spot. But when it comes to Gar, he made his bed when he came out strongly and talked about how Fred was the guy who was going to maximize the talent, etc, and this team has done nothing but got worse and I don't see how JR ignores it. I don't think Gar is someone JR will "protect". Pax, absolutely. I think it is unlikely Pax gets fired. An interesting alternative is whether Hoiberg would move into the front office (vs. coach). I.e., do the Bulls fire Gar, have Pax take on greater reigns, and have Hoiberg become GM? Hoiberg was the GM that took two point guards ahead of Steph Curry. He drafted Johnny Flynn and Ricky Rubio. I don't think I want him running the show...Soxtalk will eventually realize that John Paxson is the head of the snake. As long as Paxson is still running anything. The Bulls have no shot.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 9, 2016 -> 04:24 PM) Thibs knew the roster would get crushed with injuries? This roster is sh** even when healthy.

--I am astonished at the above claiming that we as a fan base shouldn't be questioning a front office group who has been running basketball operations for 14 seasons now and has failed spectacularly time and time again. What is even more puzzling is this asinine narrative fed directly from the puppeteering mouth of one Dan Bernstein and Co. asking fans over the radio, "Well what would you want them to do, or who would you want replacing them, or who can do a better job?" What the hell are we talking about here? I mean honestly. Its not rocket science. An ex player/broadcaster has been running this team for 14+ seasons, and hasn't won. Period. Zero championships. Yet, John Paxson is one of the longest tenured executives in the NBA. Who are the others you ask? Pat Riley with the Heat. RC Buford with the Spurs. Danny Ainge with the Celtics. Mitch Kupchak with the Lakers. Now there is a reason they are the longest tenured. Its because these four men each have won championships as executives. Besides physically assaulting a coach and hitting a few corner 3's in the 90's, what the hell has John Paxson brought to this organization? It is clear that many of the fans who defend this unbelievably incompetent, complacent front office group are not truly aware of the many bright minds that are significantly more qualified and deserving than these moronic buffoons known as GarPax. Here are 5 different names that will get the ball rolling. First-Larry Riley. Essentially the architect behind the 2015 NBA Champion Golden State Warriors. Has a litany of draft successes including Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, Draymond Green and Harrison Barnes. That alone qualifies him as a viable candidate. In addition to drafting well, Riley has shown a willingness to be creative in the FA and trade market (yes, to the surprise of some Bulls fans, this is another responsibility of an NBA executive). In 2012, Riley shipped oft-injured guard Monte Ellis to the Milwaukee Bucks for big man Andrew Bogut and forward Stephen Jackson. This was a bit unpopular among Warrior fans. However, we see now that this move jumpstarted the building phase of an elite group. As far as replacements are concerned, Riley falls at the top of my list. Second, Miami Heat General Manager/Cap Man/Pat Riley's #2 Andy Elisberg. All you need to know about Andy Elisberg is that he is directly responsible for the Heat acquiring LBJ and Bosh in 2010. A guy who specializes in the salary cap, in addition to working under Pat Riley for 10+ seasons now, Elisberg would be a fine, albeit less realistic choice to replace the incredibly incompetent GarPax. Third on the list is Jeff Weltman, who serves under Masai Ujiri as the Assistant GM for the Toronto Raptors. Plain and simple, Weltman is an extremely well respected scout. He is highly regarded among NBA circles. It also doesn't hurt to work under the tutelage of one of the brightest executives in the league. Fourth is Troy Weaver, who is the Assistant GM with the Thunder as Sam Presti's #2. Weaver is known to be a respected scout having heavily recruited Carmelo Anthony to Syracuse and having a direct role in the Thunder's selection of Russell Westbrook. Finally, Brian Puaga, Director of Scouting for the San Antonio Spurs. In addition to this role, Puaga serves as General Manager for the Spurs D-League affiliate team. Plain and simple, Puaga is considered a rising star in the NBA's gold standard organization having climbed up the R.C Buford tree since being hired in 2007. Now, keep in mind these are jump 5 names off the top of my head. There are countless others who could do twice the job Forman and Paxson have done in 14+ seasons. Remember, 5 playoff series wins since 1999. 4 out of 5 wins within the last 5 years under Tom Thibodeau. Paxson was given the job in 2003. He previously played, broadcasted and was an assistant coach for one season before entering the role. He served as General Manager from 2003 to 2009. In 2009, he physically assaulted Vinny Del Negro and instead of being fired immediately, he was instantly promoted to VP of Basketball Operations, a role he currently serves in today. If we as fans are seriously interested in change, and I mean real change, we better get serious about ridding this organization of BOTH Gar Forman and John Paxson and not one or the other.

Bump.

Bump. I'm wondering what you guys think after Bulls losing 9 of 13. Are the GarPax apologists still out there?

Is Hoiberg a bad coach? Maybe. But the conversation needs to shift to John Paxson and Gar Forman. They are the decision makers here. They pick the players. They pick the coach. They run the show. And this show sucks. The Bulls have ranged between B- and B+ for seventeen years now. That trend is going to continue as long as Paxson is running the show.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jan 27, 2016 -> 11:50 AM) Good God, just clean these clowns out of here. ^^^^^The primary purpose of this thread^^^^^^

QUOTE (Tony @ Jan 25, 2016 -> 11:33 PM) Man, you need a new hobby lol, says the guy who has 24,000 posts on a white sox message board...

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 25, 2016 -> 10:45 PM) Is this you? No. Haha. But this guy shows some promise as a sportstalk personality.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 24, 2016 -> 03:31 PM) Derrick Rose is no where near the player he was pre-injury nor is he the player he's being paid to be. He currently has the 9th highest salary in the NBA. Is he a top 10 player right now? So why did GarPax tell us this was a championship roster? And if they have no shot at winning...why aren't they rebuilding?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 24, 2016 -> 01:31 PM) I think a short summation of my view of this thread is 1. It's entirely possible the Bulls FO has made some mistakes. They've had some clear major hits and some solid misses. However... 2. Given what happened to the MVP they drafted, I submit that there are zero GM/coach/management combos who could have turned this team into a championship team in the last 5 years. Make every decision correct...and that injury ravaged player still prevents them from being a title team. 1. Derrick Rose is healthy (enough) this year 2. The team is not even close to being a contender. 3. The FO said that this roster was a championship roster with Thibs standing in the way. 4. So what gives?

One single conference finals game win in 17 years is the reality of the Bulls. They haven't even come close to an NBA finals appearance. They strike out on every major FA. Are the least creative FO in the league. And their drafting as of late has been pretty sub-par. The only difference between the NBA and the MLB is that being B+ gets you into the playoffs in the NBA. In the MLB it is much more difficult to make the playoffs. So to use consecutive playoff appearances in the NBA as a measuring stick of success is just wrong. It is not that hard to make the playoffs in the NBA. Half of the league makes the playoffs. While one third of the league is tanking.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 24, 2016 -> 09:44 AM) In the modern NBA it is pretty terrible to have a SF who can shoot the three and move the ball. They signed him to a 3 year extension the day before he announced he was having surgery. They agreed to the contract knowing he would miss significant time. THEREFORE, they were CONTENT having Tony Snell being a regular rotational player filling in. A terrible plan.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 09:10 PM) Explain why. Because his resigning had literally 0 effect on the cap and ability to sign other people. Explain to me why 35 year old Mike Dunleavy is a good starting small forward in the NBA? Especially on a team we were told was a championship contender.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 08:22 PM) The Bulls "plan" didn't involve Snell starting either. But its clueless fans like you that leave out the fact that the reason Snell is starting is because multiple starters are out hurt and pretend otherwise to make a point that isn't even really true. Excuse me, I forgot to mention re-signing 35 year old Mike Dunleavy was a bad idea as well.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 06:10 PM) Tell us more about your brilliant championship plan. Oh wait, that's right. You don't have one. It's clueless fans like yourself that support Kenny Williams running the White Sox for as long as he has. You don't know something will get better until you change it. The Bulls need to change their FO. The White Sox need to get rid of Kenny. Both teams need to tank and rebuild. Going halfway is a really sh*** plan. In regards to my plan: it would not involve Tony Snell starting on my team.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 10:06 AM) You fundamentally don't understand how the NBA works. No team that is any good trades for stars. They simply don't have the assets to do it. Pau to the Lakers is the rare exception and everyone agreed Memphis got screwed in the trade and something fishy was going on. You are right. Kobe Bryant, Kevin Garnett, Shaq, James Harden, Ray Allen, Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Kawhi Leanord, Kevin Love, Lamarcus Aldridge. None of those guys were traded.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 22, 2016 -> 11:00 PM) I'm a pax apologist but I could give a s*** about Gar. By all accounts he's a dick and while Pax might be fiery, he changed the entire culture in the org and while he's had his issues, Gar was the guy who ran Thibs out of town (yes, stuff eventually happened that got Pax and JR to side with Gar, but Gar is going to get the axe). He won't be around next year, I'm convinced of it. I honestly wonder if he's even around by the time we sell some assets at the deadline (and I truly think we'll see some retooling...no not tanking or anything like that, but we'll see this team try and reposition and I expect Pax to be the guy leading that process). Longest tenured execs in NBA: Riley (95 Heat), Kupchak (Lakers 2000), RC Buford (Spurs '02), Ainge (Boston '03), Paxson (Bulls '03). One of those names stands out like a sore thumb. How much longer does Paxson get in Chicago? His name probably doesn't belong on the above list. He hasn't even come close to a championship. All of those other executives have won one or multiple titles.

hello third place!

this ballgame is ovaaaa

so what have the white sox been doing the last week? waiting for cespedes? they had to have known they had no shot...i wonder if we hear about a sox signing or trade tomorrow...

please god i hope the white sox don't scramble to sign .250 hitting dexter fowler...

QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 22, 2016 -> 10:05 PM) So he got pretty much the offer we thought the Sox were putting on the table. yup