7/28/2006 White Sox v. Orioles

[winninguglyin83]

hr derby jinx for Jermaine

 

believe it.

[DABearSoX]

so whose starting the "White Sox Loser" thread tonight?

[fathom]

I don't disagree with your point but aren't you the one who's always on his ass about bringing in pitchers strictly for the matchup?

 

Sure...when it comes to our relievers in the game. Guys like Cotts, Thornton, McCarthy, and Jenks should be allowed to get themselves out of their own mess (unless Cotts is facing Mench ). However, I'm a bigger supporter of letting our bullpen guys start the inning.

[Chisoxfn]

I'm to the point where I don't care if we get a guy or two suspended, but if any dirty play happens to us, the player involved needs to just throw down to try and create a spark, suspensions be dammed.

 

Teams used to try and do this stuff in the olden days and while teams shy away from it now due to suspensions, If I were Ozzie I wouldn't care about that. Any type of thing to wake this team up and get them to forget about the losing baseball and go back to just playing baseball would be a blessing.

[WilliamTell]

we are playing the O's right?

 

I don't think it matters right now who we're playing, we are just plain bad.

[MHizzle85]

he gone.

[SoxHawk1980]

I'm getting so sick of Ozzie leaving in his pitchers too late, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see a pattern. FIGURE IT OUT OZZIE!!!!

But Ozzie won us the championship last year. So leaving SP's in so long MUST be the right thing to do.

Edited July 29, 2006 by SoxHawk1980

[fathom]

I'm to the point where I don't care if we get a guy or two suspended, but if any dirty play happens to us, the player involved needs to just throw down to try and create a spark, suspensions be dammed.

 

Teams used to try and do this stuff in the olden days and while teams shy away from it now due to suspensions, If I were Ozzie I wouldn't care about that. Any type of thing to wake this team up and get them to forget about the losing baseball and go back to just playing baseball would be a blessing.

 

I was hoping Ozzie would go absolutely nuts on Tuesday night when none of the calls were going our way. I'm not a fan of fights or managers getting ejected, but that would have been the perfect situation.

[winninguglyin83]

I'm to the point where I don't care if we get a guy or two suspended, but if any dirty play happens to us, the player involved needs to just throw down to try and create a spark, suspensions be dammed.

 

Teams used to try and do this stuff in the olden days and while teams shy away from it now due to suspensions, If I were Ozzie I wouldn't care about that. Any type of thing to wake this team up and get them to forget about the losing baseball and go back to just playing baseball would be a blessing.

 

 

that or a dustup in the clubhouse.

 

Somebody needs to blow a fuse and get this team moving.

[Guest JimH]

Sure...when it comes to our relievers in the game. Guys like Cotts, Thornton, McCarthy, and Jenks should be allowed to get themselves out of their own mess

 

So ... you think relievers should be allowed to get out of their own mess but not a starter. OK. So when a reliever comes in and doesn't have it, he should just let them stay in and you won't complain about it? Why do I doubt that?

 

Cotts out and MacDougal in to face Mora, Tejada, Conine. He should just leave Cotts in?

Edited July 29, 2006 by JimH

[BigSqwert]

Our offense has been atrocious since the ASB. Please Kenny...do something to spark this team.

[SoxHawk1980]

Why is it that a Marriotti column pisses off Ozzie, but horrible, lacadaisical play and losses by his team doesn't piss him off?

[fathom]

So ... you think relievers should be allowed to get out of their own mess but not a starter. OK. So when a reliever comes in and doesn't have it, he should just let them stay in and you won't complain about it? Why do I doubt that?

 

The way this season is going, the starting pitchers shouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt. Obviously, you're going to have guys like Cotts, Thornton, or MacDougal who might lack their control in a game. Having a guy warming up in the pen is fine during that. However, he has continued to leave his starting pitchers in to start an inning late in a game, and it hasn't paid off much at all. There's been more times than I want to remember where he let a starter give up a hit or two to start the 7th or 8th, and then pull him.

[Guest JimH]

The way this season is going, the starting pitchers shouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt. Obviously, you're going to have guys like Cotts, Thornton, or MacDougal who might lack their control in a game. Having a guy warming up in the pen is fine during that. However, he has continued to leave his starting pitchers in to start an inning late in a game, and it hasn't paid off much at all. There's been more times than I want to remember where he let a starter give up a hit or two to start the 7th or 8th, and then pull him.

 

You didn't answer the question about the relievers. You said they should be allowed to clean up their own mess, but not the starters.

[BigSqwert]

Wow! See the movement on that pitch? Sick.

Edited July 29, 2006 by BigSqwert

[Butter Parque]

the reason it isn't pissing him off is because he knows that there is nothing he can do with this team. Last year we were great for 5 months, then when we struggled, he said we stunk, he expected more. I think he knows at this point there isn't much to expect with a one dimensional offense and below average pitching.

[iguchi=dank]

good trade by kenny. mcD is worth having for this year and beyond and he's cheap. hopefully having him this year matters but our SP will determine that

[Chisoxfn]

So ... you think relievers should be allowed to get out of their own mess but not a starter. OK. So when a reliever comes in and doesn't have it, he should just let them stay in and you won't complain about it? Why do I doubt that?

 

Cotts out and MacDougal in to face Mora, Tejada, Conine. He should just leave Cotts in?

I can't speak for fathom, but usually I say if your plan is if a pitcher gives up a hit he's out of there, than he probably shouldn't be in there in the first place. I think thats exactly what Ozzie was thinking so why have him throw to a lefty when you have a fresh pen and guys more suited.

 

In terms of Cotts/Jenks/Thornton I think they've proven they can get lefties and righties out so I have no problem being a little more leniant with them. In general I don't tend to matchup my relievers (if they have proven themselves capable) based on whether a lefty or righty is at the plate.

 

An example of this was a few games ago, Bmac came in and gave up a hit (It may have been the game Buehrle started against the Twins) that scored one of Mark's run and than pitched great for a couple innings and we could have kept using him but instead a lefty came up and Brandon was takne out and Cotts got into trouble. Now whether or not Cotts got into trouble is nothign to me, but Brandon was the hot arm and I ride that arm, especially when in the back of my mind there is no harm stretching it out a bit considering the team just gave me another reliever (MacDougall) and the fact that maybe I could use this arm as a starter.

 

Basically put if Cotts is looking goo against 2 batters and gives up a bleeder and than righty is coming up I wouldn't pull him (assuming Cotts is really looking good) cause you never know how the next guy out of the pen is going to react(you know what you got right now).

 

The only exceptoin to this rule is when you talk about facing premier hitters (all star, game changing players) than I got no problem going to your very best in clutch situations.

[winninguglyin83]

ball was scalded.

 

got a break.

 

need to cash in.

[DABearSoX]

So on the orioles brodcast they said that in the last whatever number of games were 14 of 84 with RISP. That comes out to be .16666666667 fishing TITS

[Dick Allen]

good trade by kenny. mcD is worth having for this year and beyond and he's cheap. hopefully having him this year matters but our SP will determine that

As long as he stays healthy. That's been a huge problem for him.

[fathom]

You didn't answer the question about the relievers. You said they should be allowed to clean up their own mess, but not the starters.

 

Yes, I would give our relievers the chance to clean up their mess. Unlike the starters, most of our relievers can get a big 2 out strikeout. Obviously, if they go out there and load the bases with no outs, you might want to bring in a reliever. However, if there's 2 outs and a runner on 2nd, we don't need to be playing the matchups like we have.

[Chisoxfn]

the reason it isn't pissing him off is because he knows that there is nothing he can do with this team. Last year we were great for 5 months, then when we struggled, he said we stunk, he expected more. I think he knows at this point there isn't much to expect with a one dimensional offense and below average pitching.

If that was truly the case than Ozzie should resign because it would make him hopeless as a manager.

 

Note: I don't see that being the case, but i'm just responding to the idea that Ozzie doesn't think he can do anything to help. Of course he can, doing nothing could be doing something if he feels he's been getting in there way. But in this case it isn't the answer, he's been doing too much of nothing as of late and now he needs to start being creative with the baserunners.

[fathom]

Maybe, just maybe, Crede should get a day off. His recent pop up stretch has been pathetic.

[Butter Parque]

there's only so many pop ups I can watch before my eyes bleed, is it that hard to realize you need a level swing.